Need schooling on paper patch

[oldrodder]

To be honest, I did not know what HTC meant and forgot to ask. I could powder coat them but not sure I understand what then point would be. If they drop out @.502 I will need to size them down to .501 or maybe .500, THEN paper patch back to groove diameter..unless there is something I am missing. This is new to me.

Depends on what your final diameter is needed. In my case, I wanted to get to .595" from .577" and paper alone wasn't gonna get me there, hence the powder coating. If I understand you correctly, you need to get from .501 to .513 and I doubt paper only will get you there.
YMMV!

 

[Licensed to kill]

Looks like I might have got my digits mixed - go here - an ad from Amazon.com - so price is likely in USA dollars. Is Lee Size and Lube kit at .501" - what I had some years ago. The last "new" one that I bought some months ago, did NOT have the Lee Liquid Alox with it any more.

https://www.amazon.com/Lee-Precision-90191-SIZING-501/dp/B005KW72J0

Actually, I have a sizer (Lyman 3500) that I bought years ago for my 45-90 but have not used it yet. When running a bullet through the sizer AFYER it is paper patched, do you run it through the same die as used for the initial bullet sizing or a different one??. It seems to me that I would use a .501 die to size the bullet then a .512 die to resize after it is wrapped. Is this correct?.

 

[Licensed to kill]

Depends on what your final diameter is needed. In my case, I wanted to get to .595" from .577" and paper alone wasn't gonna get me there, hence the powder coating. If I understand you correctly, you need to get from .501 to .513 and I doubt paper only will get you there.
YMMV!

In the article by Ross Seyfreid, "My usual bullets for the .500 are grooved designs from NEI, ............... Most drop from the mould at .512 inch. NEI can make jigs to drill hollow points. These are usually .500 inch and then patched with 16 pound paper to return to .512. " Not 100% sure what that means (why a hollow point jig would reduce the diameter???) but it LOOKS like he is saying bullet sized to .500 and patched to .512. That would require paper in the .003 range. A pad of scratch on my desk measures .004 so should be doable.

 

[oldrodder]

Actually, I have a sizer (Lyman 3500) that I bought years ago for my 45-90 but have not used it yet. When running a bullet through the sizer AFYER it is paper patched, do you run it through the same die as used for the initial bullet sizing or a different one??. It seems to me that I would use a .501 die to size the bullet then a .512 die to resize after it is wrapped. Is this correct?.

Yes, that's correct. I don't always size after wrapping. If the bullet ends up the right size, then I shoot it "as wrapped"

 

[Potashminer]

Maybe is different ways to apply a paper patch? I do recall a Seyfried article where he would cut like parallelograms - not rectangles - and would wrap them twice around the bullet - so resulted in 4 thicknesses of the paper plus the bullet diameter - perhaps some people can do it with a single layer wrap?? I am pretty sure the paper was called "onion skin" - it felt hard surface and was semi - "see through" - I had a bunch of patterns that my wife discarded - from the days when she would buy those patterns to make clothes. I think I also had a pad of particular paper for making paper patches - I got it from the Staples store in Yorkton, Sask. - was my intent to "paper patch" for my muzzle loader, but never actually did so.

 

[Licensed to kill]

When my Dad passed away I inherited his whitworth bored muzzleloader and a schwack of bullets and precut papers. he was paper wrapping them and had cut the papers like a parallelogram also. I just thought that was the way it was done and everything I have read to date says parallelogram and two wraps. Never heard of using rectangles before. As for the paper, like patching for a round ball in a muzzleloader, the right material/thickness is paramount and when you find the right one, buy a LOT lest you can not find it again. I recall gaping through a fabric shop with a micrometer checking various bolts of material to try for patches. The woman working there was somewhat puzzled until I told here what I was going to use it for. 30 or 40 years ago I recall my Dad looking for linen at a fabric shop and the woman showing him some exclaiming that it was "the finest Irish linen". Dad said OK, as long as it Mics right it should be fine, I'm going to be shooting it out of my rifle. Anyways, I will likely try some .004 paper and size it to .512. If that is too much reduction and tears I will find something around .0035 to try, then .003 if that fails. Once I get the wrap right I will cut a template from a piece of brass or sheet metal so I can quickly and accurately cut papers. That's the plan anyways. As always, opinion subject to change without notice pending compelling arguments to the contrary.

 

[vagrantviking]

If you are going with the paper patching like the original loadings I think the smooth sided mold in the link would be a good choice. It might be your best bet for matching the sights and velocities too.

I don't have much experience with paper patching but would think that sizing after wrapping shouldn't be very necessary once you have a good tight jacket and the right paper thickness but others who have been down that path would know better. It would be nice to know the process they used back in the day. The attitude to labour intensive projects was different then.

 

[zuke]

Staples sells onion skin pads of 36 sheets.
SKU 27006-7
Model 21160
and the barcode on the rack is 0065800211605

I'd post pics but don't know how

 

[jethunter]

I was told about the Oct 2002 issue of Handloader magazine where Ross Seyfreid has a article on loading for this exact rifle. I ordered a copy from the publisher and have read the article a few times. In it he talks about paper patching a bit, that is where I read to use a bore diameter bullet wrapped with thick enough paper to bring it to groove diameter. It has some really good info but leaves out a few details. It did, bowler, connive me to go with 4198 rather than black. I wanted to use black because...I like black powder and I HAVE over 50 pounds but it sounds like 4198 is a better choice so I bought an 8lb jug. I would like to know if a .513 bullet in 20-1 lead/tin will size through a .500 sizer or is that too much reduction?.

Swaging down 0.013" in one step is probably not going to work well.

What approximate bullet weight are you looking for? Accurate Molds will custom make any diameter you want, either from scratch or from an existing design.