New bullet designs , what have they changed for you
- Thread starter Spruster
- Start date
well i do not know i spoke with some other users of the tsx bullets in 9.3x62 mostly and they find the same issue with less than 10 rounds but there is something.
the previous barnes were worst but that is strange as other copper or equivalent wonder bullets do not do that.
Probably a good bet. I have a couple hundred of them through my .243 and I am not sure I’ve cleaned the barrel lately. Accuracy is is still excellent. I imagine I’ll clean it when accuracy drops off. I am laying off shooting the Barnes at the moment though. At $50 a box of more it gets costly for paper punching. They shoot so dang good though.
They sure do.
Shooting the cheapest reloads or factory ammo I can find from field positions 99% of the time here...until hunting season starts. Clean, verify zero/foul with Barnes, hunt. 5-6 rounds a year? A box goes a long way haha.
Working up the load is the expensive part but its been straightforward so far at least.
Medvedqc,
Wow if its happened enough others tell you of it too...
Experience here is limited to a handful of 250gr TTSX in 375 H&H. Didn't notice any unusual fouling but this is a long ways back.
Shooting the cheapest reloads or factory ammo I can find from field positions 99% of the time here...until hunting season starts. Clean, verify zero/foul with Barnes, hunt. 5-6 rounds a year? A box goes a long way haha.
Working up the load is the expensive part but its been straightforward so far at least.
Medvedqc,
Wow if its happened enough others tell you of it too...
Experience here is limited to a handful of 250gr TTSX in 375 H&H. Didn't notice any unusual fouling but this is a long ways back.
As I stated before, the partitions displayed represent about 25% of the partitions I have taken game with.
The rest have been passthroughs, and with 2 exceptions, were not recovered
One 160 grain 7mm Partition was found in the snow after going through the chest of a moose.
A 165 grain 30 cal Partition was recovered from a fir stump right behind a muley I shot through the lungs. I
spotted something shiny in the bark of that Fir. Dug out the expanded Partition.
Recovered an Expanded 196 grain Oryx from last fall's Bull Elk. [325 WSM @ 308 yards]
Quite a number of C&C bullets were passthroughs as well, particularly on deer.
I shot two Black bears [250, 320 lbs] with the 8x57 and the 180 grain Ballistic Tip. Both were passthroughs.
Likewise, a 200 grain Accubond on a Immature bull moose [8x57 also]
I had a 220 grain A-Frame exit a Bull Elk I shot at 425 yards 4 years ago.[8mm Rem Mag]
So while what I have displayed seems like a lot, it is only a representation of game taken with various bullets.
Still love the Partitions, Accubonds, Interbonds and A-Frames. I have a 100 grain 25 cal TTSX that really shoots
well in a 257 Roberts, but have not shot any game with it yet. Dave.
Wonderful Life! So many things to learn from the finished bullet. Not that you need homework but what a body of data if the cartridges, bullets name/weight, and impact velocities went along with those along the way but you've seen more than enough to have a preferred formula.
What's the story on that monster mushroom in the first pic? And is one cartridge responsible for more of those than other? Or top 3 cartridges you've used and preferred bullet weights?
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X2 on this for me.
Adding to that, new cartridges came along to support the new bullets more efficiently, and this allowed easy for the whole family to shoot well.
So somewhat unrelated, but interesting none the less. Last night I went to the range with a few loads to test with a new powder. Previously I had tested a couple of loads with that powder and 225 gr North Forks. Accuracy was around 1.5”. I adjusted seating depth and then went back to test. Just before I left I decided to load up some 225 gr TSX’s with the new powder as well. The TSX’s had proven accurate with other powders in the past.
The group, if you can call it that, on the left is the North Forks. Shot three is the one in the top left corner of the paper. When I saw it i immediately assumed something mechanical. I must have broken something. In all my shooting I’ve never seen anything like it. So back at the bench I decided to shoot the TSX load to see if I was getting the same erratic result. That produced the group on the right.
Forget the North Forks, I’ll shoot solid copper.
The group, if you can call it that, on the left is the North Forks. Shot three is the one in the top left corner of the paper. When I saw it i immediately assumed something mechanical. I must have broken something. In all my shooting I’ve never seen anything like it. So back at the bench I decided to shoot the TSX load to see if I was getting the same erratic result. That produced the group on the right.
Forget the North Forks, I’ll shoot solid copper.
The Ttsx shoot good with a minimum of 50 thou jump and best pushed fast. So it’s easier to develop a load with them because you know where to start ime. Other bullets will shoot as well but the load development is often longer, playing with seating depth and velocity.
That "monster" mushroom is a bullet no longer made. A small boutique bullet maker in Ontario made them. I still have a few 30 cal - 190 grain samples. The Company
was "Blue Point" and the core was truly bonded to the jacket. The sample you see was recovered from a moose. 190 grain bullet from one of my 308 Norma Mags at
about 200 yards. Initial Velocity c. 3000 fps.
I have probably shot 60% of all game taken with the 30-06, using a lot of 165 or 180 Partitions. Also used the WW original Silvertip a bit, found it quite reliable at
30-06 velocities. Second most common chambering is the 308 Norma Magnum [started using it in 1967] Third would be the 7x57 [Shot 8 moose with 8 shots with the
7x57.
] But, I have also hunted with and taken game with: 220 Swift, 6mmBR, 6mm Remington, 257 Roberts, 25-06, 257 Weatherby, 260 Remington, 6.5 x 54 MS, 6.5x55 Swede, 264 Win Mag, 270 Winchester, 7mm-08, 280 Remington, 7mm Rem Mag, 7mm Weatherby Mag, 7mm STW, 30-30 Winchester, 300 Savage, 308 Winchester,
300 Win Mag, 303 British, 303 Epps, 8x57, 325 WSM, 8mm Rem Mag, 338 Win Mag. 38-55 Winchester, and one moose with the 375 H&H Mag.
I feel particularly privileged to live in the time and place I have. Game rich areas of BC and Alberta. I started hunting in 1957, and hunted every year since then but 2.
Once I started reloading, I experimented a lot with bullet types and different chamberings. The picture of the C&C bullets shows several "jackets only" Since I show
these, it is obvious that I recovered the animal shot with them. But, If a bullet does this, I will not hunt with it again. There are so many great choices today, that I do
not have to play with overly frangible ones. I Still judge all in comparison to the venerable Partition. I do NOT hunt with Bergers or their equivalent
I am certainly not against the monometals, but some of the areas I still hunt demand shots out at 4-500 yards, and my experience so far leads me to believe that the
TTSX, GMX, E-Tip, and other solid copper bullets need velocity to reliably expand.
You asked about preferred bullet weights: Swift, 60 Part; 6mm, 95 or 100 Part or 90 Scirocco II; 257, 115, 120 Part; 6.5, 125 or 140 Part or 130 AB; 270, 140 AB; 7mms,
140-160 Parts, 140 TTSX; 30-30, 170 Speer HC; Other 30s, 150-180 AB or Parts; 30 cal Mags, 180-200 Parts, ABs, or 180 Scirocco II, 180 A-Frame; 303, 180 Sierra P-H
8x57, 180 Ballistic Tip, 185 REm C-L; 325 WSM, 196 ORYX; 8mm Rem Mag, 200 or 220 A-Frames. 338, 210 or 225 Partition.
Sorry this is a long dialogue, but could not figure a way to condense it much. Regards, Dave.
So somewhat unrelated, but interesting none the less. Last night I went to the range with a few loads to test with a new powder. Previously I had tested a couple of loads with that powder and 225 gr North Forks. Accuracy was around 1.5”. I adjusted seating depth and then went back to test. Just before I left I decided to load up some 225 gr TSX’s with the new powder as well. The TSX’s had proven accurate with other powders in the past.
The group, if you can call it that, on the left is the North Forks. Shot three is the one in the top left corner of the paper. When I saw it i immediately assumed something mechanical. I must have broken something. In all my shooting I’ve never seen anything like it. So back at the bench I decided to shoot the TSX load to see if I was getting the same erratic result. That produced the group on the right.
Forget the North Forks, I’ll shoot solid copper.
sometimes guns are doing stuff on their own ,,,
Just watched this and started laughing. My wife thinks I’m nuts. Generally. Watch the last four ish minutes.
https://youtu.be/a26qAvSq2Vw
https://youtu.be/a26qAvSq2Vw
I have used the old standard cup and core bullets with great results over the years, as well as the newer premium bullets, as they became more available, and I could afford them.
I always test new rifles and cartridges with factory ammo to see if the rifle will show a preference for a certain bullet or weight. And when a rifle shows a preference for a certain factory load, I will buy 5 boxes so that I always have a good supply on hand for zeroing the scope, practice and hunting for the upcoming season.
I will then start working on handloads for that cartridge/rifle, with that particular bullet or bullet weight, to find a more accurate load fine tuned to that cartridge/rifle combination.
In factory cup and core offerings, I have had great success with Winchester Power Points, Sierra GameKings, Nosler Ballistic Tips and Hornady Interlock bullets in various calibers/cartridges.
In handloads, the Sierra GK, Pro Hunters, Nosler Ballistic Tips, Hornady Interlocks, and Speer Hot Cor's have proved successful.
In factory premium bullet offerings, I have had great success with Nosler Partitions and AccuBonds.
In handloads, the Nosler Partition and AccuBonds have proven themselves in all rifles/cartridges used, Barnes X Bullet, TSX and TTSX have proven themselves in a few rifles, and I am looking forward to working up loads in a few rifles with the Swift A Frames, and using them on hunts.
In cup and core bullets, I have used and will continue to use the SGK's, NBT's, Speer Hot-Cor's and Winchester Power Points.
In the premiums, again, I have used and will continue to use the NPT and NAB (my favourite bullet overall), and the Barnes 350 gr TSX in my 416 Taylor (it shoots very well, although I have yet to prove it on game - did not find the bison on the last trip out with it).
I look forward to trying the Swift A Frames and Hdy CX bullets in a few rifles...most notably the 9.3x62 and 376 Steyr. I also have some 140 gr A Frames to try in my 7mm-08 lever action (rebarreled Win Model 88).
In the end, I do not think that the premiums have made a huge difference in determining what bullet I use, whether in factory ammo or handloads, as many of my lever actions work well with the factory cup and core and I do not see reason to change to premium bullets in those rifles used on game at shorter distances.
I always test new rifles and cartridges with factory ammo to see if the rifle will show a preference for a certain bullet or weight. And when a rifle shows a preference for a certain factory load, I will buy 5 boxes so that I always have a good supply on hand for zeroing the scope, practice and hunting for the upcoming season.
I will then start working on handloads for that cartridge/rifle, with that particular bullet or bullet weight, to find a more accurate load fine tuned to that cartridge/rifle combination.
In factory cup and core offerings, I have had great success with Winchester Power Points, Sierra GameKings, Nosler Ballistic Tips and Hornady Interlock bullets in various calibers/cartridges.
In handloads, the Sierra GK, Pro Hunters, Nosler Ballistic Tips, Hornady Interlocks, and Speer Hot Cor's have proved successful.
In factory premium bullet offerings, I have had great success with Nosler Partitions and AccuBonds.
In handloads, the Nosler Partition and AccuBonds have proven themselves in all rifles/cartridges used, Barnes X Bullet, TSX and TTSX have proven themselves in a few rifles, and I am looking forward to working up loads in a few rifles with the Swift A Frames, and using them on hunts.
In cup and core bullets, I have used and will continue to use the SGK's, NBT's, Speer Hot-Cor's and Winchester Power Points.
In the premiums, again, I have used and will continue to use the NPT and NAB (my favourite bullet overall), and the Barnes 350 gr TSX in my 416 Taylor (it shoots very well, although I have yet to prove it on game - did not find the bison on the last trip out with it).
I look forward to trying the Swift A Frames and Hdy CX bullets in a few rifles...most notably the 9.3x62 and 376 Steyr. I also have some 140 gr A Frames to try in my 7mm-08 lever action (rebarreled Win Model 88).
In the end, I do not think that the premiums have made a huge difference in determining what bullet I use, whether in factory ammo or handloads, as many of my lever actions work well with the factory cup and core and I do not see reason to change to premium bullets in those rifles used on game at shorter distances.
Shooting costs more money now. Funny though how the animal was just as dead with a 50c bullet as it is now with a $2 one. Then again though, all my hunting happens inside 300 yards or so. I’m sure the biggest change has been bullets that expand and penetrate properly at longer ranges / lower velocities.
That "monster" mushroom is a bullet no longer made. A small boutique bullet maker in Ontario made them. I still have a few 30 cal - 190 grain samples. The Company
was "Blue Point" and the core was truly bonded to the jacket. The sample you see was recovered from a moose. 190 grain bullet from one of my 308 Norma Mags at
about 200 yards. Initial Velocity c. 3000 fps.
I have probably shot 60% of all game taken with the 30-06, using a lot of 165 or 180 Partitions. Also used the WW original Silvertip a bit, found it quite reliable at
30-06 velocities. Second most common chambering is the 308 Norma Magnum [started using it in 1967] Third would be the 7x57 [Shot 8 moose with 8 shots with the
7x57.
6.5x55 Swede, 264 Win Mag, 270 Winchester, 7mm-08, 280 Remington, 7mm Rem Mag, 7mm Weatherby Mag, 7mm STW, 30-30 Winchester, 300 Savage, 308 Winchester,
300 Win Mag, 303 British, 303 Epps, 8x57, 325 WSM, 8mm Rem Mag, 338 Win Mag. 38-55 Winchester, and one moose with the 375 H&H Mag.
I feel particularly privileged to live in the time and place I have. Game rich areas of BC and Alberta. I started hunting in 1957, and hunted every year since then but 2.
Once I started reloading, I experimented a lot with bullet types and different chamberings. The picture of the C&C bullets shows several "jackets only" Since I show
these, it is obvious that I recovered the animal shot with them. But, If a bullet does this, I will not hunt with it again. There are so many great choices today, that I do
not have to play with overly frangible ones. I Still judge all in comparison to the venerable Partition. I do NOT hunt with Bergers or their equivalent
I am certainly not against the monometals, but some of the areas I still hunt demand shots out at 4-500 yards, and my experience so far leads me to believe that the
TTSX, GMX, E-Tip, and other solid copper bullets need velocity to reliably expand.
You asked about preferred bullet weights: Swift, 60 Part; 6mm, 95 or 100 Part or 90 Scirocco II; 257, 115, 120 Part; 6.5, 125 or 140 Part or 130 AB; 270, 140 AB; 7mms,
140-160 Parts, 140 TTSX; 30-30, 170 Speer HC; Other 30s, 150-180 AB or Parts; 30 cal Mags, 180-200 Parts, ABs, or 180 Scirocco II, 180 A-Frame; 303, 180 Sierra P-H
8x57, 180 Ballistic Tip, 185 REm C-L; 325 WSM, 196 ORYX; 8mm Rem Mag, 200 or 220 A-Frames. 338, 210 or 225 Partition.
Sorry this is a long dialogue, but could not figure a way to condense it much. Regards, Dave.
Great to add that to that picture, more data and recollection than most could come up with. Of the 30-06 kills what would be the majority weighting of inside x amount of yards? ie; 90% under 300 yards sort of thing?
If you averaged all the shots taken at game, it would not be over 125 yards. Weight of
recovered bullets overall - 65% The average distance would be somewhat less without
6 fairly long successful shots at moose with the '06 [c. 350-400 yards] EE.
