New Norc M14 - bad problem FIXED!

rodregier said:
Concur detail-stripping the bolt assy is painful unless you have the magic tool. I have one that works for both the M1 Garand and M14, but they are uncommon and pricy.

ht tp://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/rifle-tools/bolt-tools/dissassembly-tools/m1-m14-bolt-disassembly-tool-prod917.aspx

Concur that headspace problems are one of several possibilities for the symptoms described.
Receiver safety bridge could be another issue, but that is less likely on a new rifle.
(Prevents the hammer from striking the firing pin when the bolt is out of battery).

Our-of-spec firing pin is also possible, but that is less likely too in a new rifle.

Have the firing pin protrusion checked when you are getting the headspace checked.
Click to expand...

thanks for the link to the tool.
going to check safety bridge and will get protrusion checked as well.
 
Remember, my M14 had a weak hammer spring & it would not fire surplus ammo, but it would fire commercial ammo... Replaced the spring, problem fixed...

Cheers
Jay
P.S. Is the gun properly greased as per the posted sticky?
 
serial number
IMG-20130207-00620.jpg



APPEARS MUCH DIRTIER THAN IT IS
Tilted Back - Pin Back
IMG-20130217-00638.jpg



Again I apologize for such bad pictures
Tilted forward - Pin Forward
IMG-20130217-00637.jpg
 
hmmm, might have it fixed. Just tried some snap caps (so I don't damage it dry firing and it sounds like the action is working properly now. Headed to the range to find out. It appears it may have been the safety bridge. 1 shot in the chamber 1 snap cap in the mag is how I will test. (no runaway auto or slam fire until I am sure it works fine)


as you can see from the pictures it has been greased lately :p (followed the directions word for word)



thanks for the offer of the spring. Like I said - will try it now and see.
 
Are you loading a mag, inserting it into the rifle & then pulling the cocking handle back & LETTING GO? Remember you NEVER 'ride' the cocking handle forward... AND NEVER let the bolt fly on a round handloaded into the chamber...

The M14 is designed to strip the cartridge from the mag, seat it in the chamber & then fire it...

Cheers
Jay
 
Jay said:
Are you loading a mag, inserting it into the rifle & then pulling the cocking handle back & LETTING GO? Remember you NEVER 'ride' the cocking handle forward... AND NEVER let the bolt fly on a round handloaded into the chamber...

The M14 is designed to strip the cartridge from the mag, seat it in the chamber & then fire it...

Cheers
Jay
Click to expand...

Yes thanks for the reminder and I was doing it correctly - but when you are lost getting the basics covered again is never a bad idea :) Found out the issue and it is fixed now.
 
after reassembly of the bolt and finding that the pin was not aligning properly so it would catch on the receiver bridge

the bridge shelf DOES act as a firm stop for the firing pin. It does not “slow” the FP, it STOPS it in its tracks. and since my rifle wasn't in proper bolt state the Bridge stopped it cold. A GOOD THING.


Thank you for all the help - it really did lead to the solution and I am grateful for it! High Fives all around


I have taken it to the range and tested the fix and was able to fire correctly

(testing procedure at range and at home after the reassembly)
1) try with snap cap to see if bolt working correctly
check!
2) bring to range with 2 mags - 1 round + 1 snap cap under it
check
3) fire
2x check - round fired - perfect dimple - feeder loaded snap cap
4) load 2 rounds into a magazine
check
5) fire and fire again
check! no slam fire, no autofire
6) load magazine 100%
check
7)fire and fire some more
check - perfect dimples, no auto no slam



excellent result (and all rounds on paper at 100 yards (bad group but was not trying for that!))
 
Jay said:
Are you loading a mag, inserting it into the rifle & then pulling the cocking handle back & LETTING GO? Remember you NEVER 'ride' the cocking handle forward... AND NEVER let the bolt fly on a round handloaded into the chamber...

The M14 is designed to strip the cartridge from the mag, seat it in the chamber & then fire it...

Cheers
Jay
Click to expand...

Curious, why "NEVER" let a bolt fly on a round manually loaded into the chamber?

OP: glad you got it sorted out.
 
Because it is a free floating firing pin. If something stops the shell before it is properly locked in the breech there is a chance the firing g pin will still continue on and set of the round.
 
yomomma said:
Because it is a free floating firing pin. If something stops the shell before it is properly locked in the breech there is a chance the firing g pin will still continue on and set of the round.
Click to expand...

but how is that any different than the bolt closing on a round it's stripped from the magazine itself (sorry, physics isn't my strong point). One would think that if the pin is going to ride forward and hit the primer hard enough to ignite it, it would happen regardless of whether the round was already in the chamber or stripped off the mag...or does stripping it off the mag slow down the forward speed of the bolt enough to make a difference.
 
Roost said:
the bridge is keyed to stopping firing pin inertia before chambering, so i don't see the problem, mind you im not about to find out
Click to expand...

since the pin is an L shape if it misaligns (as in the case of my rifle) it stops if from firing as well :) if it had fired I could have had a serious slamfire condition
but it works best with 7.62 and not with 308 because chambering size differences cause the receiver bridge to not be as effective with 308
 
fix was a misalignment of the firing pin in the bolt (yeah i know... Oo) disassembled and reassembled the bolt according to the book...
as I said earlier in the thread I was not wanting to disassemble it but since I could find no other fault I did... and rightly so.
 
Read up on the guns you use.

There is enough info out there about slam fires and out of battery fires which can happen with these rifles.



Odd Shot said:
but how is that any different than the bolt closing on a round it's stripped from the magazine itself (sorry, physics isn't my strong point). One would think that if the pin is going to ride forward and hit the primer hard enough to ignite it, it would happen regardless of whether the round was already in the chamber or stripped off the mag...or does stripping it off the mag slow down the forward speed of the bolt enough to make a difference.
Click to expand...
 
Odd Shot said:
but how is that any different than the bolt closing on a round it's stripped from the magazine itself (sorry, physics isn't my strong point). One would think that if the pin is going to ride forward and hit the primer hard enough to ignite it, it would happen regardless of whether the round was already in the chamber or stripped off the mag...or does stripping it off the mag slow down the forward speed of the bolt enough to make a difference.
Click to expand...

I think you answered your own question. The stripping of the round slows the bolt.
 
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