Nightforce vs Schmidt and Bender vs Vortex vs US Optics

farshot said:
I would need to confirm, but I believe that Euro laws do not permit "lifetime warranties" as is permitted on our side of the water. I believe it has to do with consumer protection in that the government wants good warranties, but they think that "lifetime" is unrealistic and is used as a marketing ploy.

In reality, the big Euro optic companies usually bend over backwards if their product goes wonky; even after decades.
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i never heard about euro optics and lifetime warranty.

they tried to push something like 30 years now it is currently 10 years free manpower and parts and extra 20 years free manpower and parts on your dime.

now that SB has maintenance facility in US story may be different but when my little sb 1.1-4x24 had issue with the reticle after 11 years of good service i received fixed but with a note first and last time ... sold at the minute i received it with the note. story was in Europe.

they are certainly good scope but as any mechanical item they fail and then it is time to see how warranty works ...
 
I use a Schmidt&bender pmii 3-12x50 on 2 of my rifles. One a 338 and one a 308. Having over 100 clicks of adjustment is awesome, 34mm tube, glass is flaweless, first focal plane, and the support can't be beaten. Mind you I dished out 6k for the 2, so worth it. Let's not forget it's the same glass we use on our canadian forces c14 mrsws.

I can't go back to other brands of glass...
 
bsand said:
May not make you into a pro. But it removes another variable, like a AI vs Rem700. The AI will make a new shooter that much more confident, thus letting you try more and harder shots. If you know your gear is 100% and then your only variable is you. Makes shooting that much more enjoyable, and I'm talking from experience. Having the right kit makes shooting so much easier and enjoyable.

I like knowing that the only variable is my lack of skill, rather than equipment.
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I would put my Bushy against your TT, maybe not in glass or clicks but in getting the job done. We are not talking a Stevens 200 vs an AI. At this level it is not the equipment that matters. Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborghini, they are all the same too.

Then again I don't have an $11,000 rig.
 
They are absolutely not all the same.

If you're a very very experienced shooter, you could likely beat us all with your bushy (or mine) and a factory tikka.

If your Kimmi Rakkanin (sp?) you could likely out drive us in a pinto with us in our GT-R's.

If we're all somewhat on the same experience/skill level, we'll smoke you with our higher end gear.
 
Tell that to the guys who win matches with the Vortex Gen II and The Bushy ERS/XRS. Hate to bring it up again but precision rifle blog has Bushnells in the top 50 more than S&B (S&B was also behind Vortex, NF, and

No one here is comparing the Vortex PST line or Bushnell legend line to these scopes. These are all alpha scopes here.

I also think I have seen Bushys on the US sniper team so take that for what it is worth.
 
If we follow your logic one could assume that if the very best competed with the very best those with the highest end gear would always win.

Also, a pinto would never beat a GTR, but whatever, there is some saying about arguing on the Internet...

Come to my match in August, I will save a spot.
 
To lower the ####-length contest for a second, what do you guys compete in?? I've read up on benchrest - not for me. F-class, maybe. FTR, sounds intriguing. PRS?? Don't know much. Willing to learn though. More real-life scenarios?

Where are they in western Canada?? Anything in SK?
 
Don't sell the Bushnell short until you try them. Very repeatable, very clear glass, good FOV and plenty of elevation adjustment. The optical clarity is right there with the S&B with the edge goes to S&B but not that much like some people think. When looking through both at near darkness, again not that much different, the S&B is a tad better, my Zeiss Victory Diavari beats them both, my NXS is not even close. I actually like the turrets on the Bushnell better than the S&B. I can dial it very quickly and accurately but on the S&B, the clicks are so close together that I tend to over dial 9 out of 10 time. The fit and finish on the S&B and also Zeiss Diavari is awesome, they are just beautiful to look at. I would consider the Bushnell in along with OP
choice of scopes.
 
I have 2 bushnells. I love them for what I paid for them.

Got my 3.5-21 for about 1300$ and my 4.5-30 for about 1750$. They're great. They're not quite like my S&B or my NF, but they're great.
 
Gunneegoogoo said:
They are absolutely not all the same.

If you're a very very experienced shooter, you could likely beat us all with your bushy (or mine) and a factory tikka.

If your Kimmi Rakkanin (sp?) you could likely out drive us in a pinto with us in our GT-R's.

If we're all somewhat on the same experience/skill level, we'll smoke you with our higher end gear.
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Congrats. You are the new Caramel of CGN. Sorry Caramel, wouldn't be the same without you. You are the dearest to my heart when it comes on CGN. You lighten my day with total confusion and blissfulness that only you can provide.

Gunneegoogoo, ever look into what the top shooters shoot? Plenty of them are on what? Rem 700's.

Kimmi hasn't been winning much of anything for a long, long time. Nearly canned last year, will be this year. Ferrari making a massive mistake keeping him on. Time for him to go out into the pasture.

Skill far surpasses equipment. These scopes (all of them) are well above anything REQUIRED to be used.
 
OK, I submit to your intergalactic authority.....I really don't give enough of a $hit to argue anymore.....ill just carry on into my blissfully stupid weekend, wailing away sending projectiles into the next county with impunity.

It's always nice to be able to share opinions without insult.

Caramel, can I catch a ride on the short bus on Monday?

ps - did I at least come close on the spelling of Kimmi's name??
 
Ryan.M.Anderson said:
Tell that to the guys who win matches with the Vortex Gen II and The Bushy ERS/XRS. Hate to bring it up again but precision rifle blog has Bushnells in the top 50 more than S&B (S&B was also behind Vortex, NF, and

No one here is comparing the Vortex PST line or Bushnell legend line to these scopes. These are all alpha scopes here.

I also think I have seen Bushys on the US sniper team so take that for what it is worth.
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http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/04/vu-pham-wins-match-with-new-bushnell-4-5-30x50mm-scope/
 
Can someone enlighten me here since this is kind of a pi $$!ng contest...
I understand all this S&B is better then... and well Vortex Razor 2 is so much for the money... NF is the $!tt, then there is always that guy that says "no NF glass is like a burris"

All this bickering... to me it sounds like the millionaires at the country club arguing :Ferrari, no Lamborghini, no porche...only a Porche my god Winston did your ex wife really take all your money....

But since wen is a Brand new anything from a brand new company the best there is? And I am talking Tangent Theta here? I mean most well establish with a good reputation company seem to have Initial Qc problem or have some bugs to work out at the beginning wen releasing: a phone , a car, a program a gun a new technology. But this new company release a $4000+ scope and all the suddent everyone decide it is the best new thing since slice bread, the wheel and #### LOL.

I mean it might be! They might got it right but its like saying this brand new car company released this new 300 000$ car with 800hp and after 3 weeks and 200 kilometers everyone agree on this car his the best and it engine will last 3-400 000 km cause its expensive and awesome.

I mean how can all you guys know this thing is so good without any earned reputation? I am not saying its not good but how do you know the scopes are not going to break down in mass at 6 months ,12 months and the company goes under then your all stuck with $4000 paper weight?

Just to prove my point like 3 years ago I found this new European scope with great (paid for I am guessing now) reviews. It had great glass, were light and had a 5x zoom range. I bought one scope... after returning an receiving scope number 1 true 4 and they all were crap I was donne with that company. After 20 round of 308, the eye bell of scope number one ( minox zx5 1.5-8)got so loose i could make it rattle while shaking the scope. I return it scope number 2 the bell was loose and rattling from the box. I unmounted #1 ,my little rings had all crushed the thin foil tube. Receive number 3 seem alright, I never made it to the range I just turn the power ring a couple of times, tried 2 -3 times to see if the bell was loose then it came and started to rattle. True that I initially dealt with the Canadian distributor ( scope #1,2) then he did not have anymore of my model in stock so I was handed to the US distributor for #3 and #4. After #3 the US was also out of 1.5-8 so he offered to upgrade me freely to the 3-15x50 illuminated.... wamp wammmmm it did the same. I returned all those scope and bought a burris 3×9 FF E1 . Btw I compare the cheap Burris to the "expansive" scotch glass in the minox and the burris was quite better.



I am not saying the TT his bad, will have problem or his not the best thing since slice bread I am just trying to understand the overnight fame and rep!

Btw here his a pic of minox #2,3,4 and the cheap burris that replaced them
20130511_132933.jpg
 
Nothing like trial and errors, what i found out to be the best for me may be unnapropriated for you gentlemens...

For me the only logical choice is to order a S&B 3X27X56 PMll H37 for my Nemesis...

Not playing in any pissing contest, just going with what i believe in, i have Bushnell, Vortex, Nikon, Burris, Leupold, Zeiss, Sightron and NF scopes to...
I never said there were POS... JP.
 
Rally guys, you own, what I assume is a Tavor. Your opinion doesn't count. haha.

If you've noticed anything, you'll notice the trend for gun buyers who have this "must own the newest and best" attitude. Same as you mentioned with vehicles.

The TT is likely very good, but likely too hard to say if it's the best now. Glass is something that can be compared from new and won't (or shouldn't) change. The "best" status might come with time, who knows. As I've said, I'm not argueing to persuade any opinions, but close mindedness annoys me. Bandwagon jumpers was always a pet peeve of mine, and for that reason I often go against the flow, to make things interesting and sometimes prove others wrong.

I believe it's Kimi Raikkonen. Doesn't matter. The only thing he brings to F1 these days is his quirky attitude and hilarious comments. Love the guy, but he needs to retire. Rarely are those perceived well by overstaying their welcome. It may be giving up to some, but retiring in good standing, or when on top tends to go better for people.
 
Every once in a while, a new product hits the market and sets a new benchmark. In the cramped sphere of elite shooting optics, the Tangent Theta is standing out, and it's not because of some gimmick or marketing scheme. It's getting by on its own merit.

If you don't understand what the fuss is about then you simply haven't handled one of these scopes. The guys who've spent more than a minute or two with one understand what the new benchmark is.

The TT has seen two years under the microscope and the negative feedback box is still empty. I'd hardly say it's the latest hype.
 
So since I own a "Tavor" that means I don't know or don't have a seat at the table? So what about the fact that in the picture it is a RFB.... what about the fact that I have a 10tr with NXS 5.5-22×50 shooting .5-.75 moa? Granted I have very limited experience on the long range game but should at least get a seat in the corner of the room at the end of the bench. "Even if Winston in onlu driving the Porche" not the real rich man car hahaha.

And yes I never saw one in person, but I am also of the tought that at this level those scope are pretty much all good for what we are douing with them!
 
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