Nightforce vs Schmidt and Bender vs Vortex vs US Optics

thump_rrr said:
I don't like the MTC either.
Another thing to watch out for with Schmidt & Bender are scopes that are available in CW or CCW.
Nothing will screw with you more than dialing the opposite way than you are used to on elevation.
The exact scope I would like to purchase is the 677-911-982-A8-A2
It is the S&B PMii 5-25x56 DT Illuminated P4L Fine Reticle-CCW- 1/4 MOA

I know that others would prefer it in MRAD but that is my personal preference.

That scope is selling for $3,739USD yet only $3,899CDN
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Does it have zero stop and locking turret? I assumed you got the price from Wolverine. Which one is it?
 
thump_rrr said:
I haven't read the whole thread but I will give you my opinion.
I have a Vortex Viper PST 6-24x50 FFP. The first one brand new out of the box had a canted reticle.
It was sent in and when it came back it had scratches on it.
I complained and it was sent back again and it was replaced for a new one.

If you are looking in the $3,000 area you have the Vortex Razor Gen II 3-18x50 at $3,300 or the 4.5-27x56 for $3,750
If I was in that price range the Schmidt & Bender PMii 5-25x56 in FFP with the P4F reticle would be my choice for $3,800.

Due to the stronger US dollar it makes more financial sense to go with Schmidt & Bender.
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Where can I get a S&B PMII 5-25x56 in FFP for $3800Canadian???
 
bsand said:
3900$ at wolverine now.
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Thanks but... still not entirely clear. Not all S&B scopes are FFP, first focal plane, from reading the company's site. Some scope come with a choice of FFP or SFP with different reticles in both categories. On Wolverine site some items have FFP stated in specs, most don't. Guess I'll have to call them and get someone to clarify what they have in stock.Having so many options is nice, but very confusing. For $4000, I don't want to be confused.
 
SFP is denoted as PMII-2 on the scope. The last SB i got from wolverine was FFP for 3850 w/ MTC/LT turrets. More than likely the only SFP's would be in 12-50.
 
big bear said:
Thanks but... still not entirely clear. Not all S&B scopes are FFP, first focal plane, from reading the company's site. Some scope come with a choice of FFP or SFP with different reticles in both categories. On Wolverine site some items have FFP stated in specs, most don't. Guess I'll have to call them and get someone to clarify what they have in stock.Having so many options is nice, but very confusing. For $4000, I don't want to be confused.
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You're not alone in your confusion. S&B has so many permutations and combinations it's not even funny. It's f-ing awesome once you work out their "code", but until then - GOOD LUCK!!!

bsand is quite right though - the "2" in the PMII-2 denotes SECOND focal plane. As for the CW/CCW/ST/DT/MTC blah blah blah, I can't even tell you what mine is.....
 
I ordered my S&B PMII back in October. When I called wolverine asking about all the features, they recommended I go over to EuroOptic or B&H photo do select all my features that would then give me the right product number so that they could go into their 21pg "code book" to give me a price. Since they import direct from Germany, they were able to keep their cost similar (and in my case...UNDER) the USD price listed on the websites I checked out.

If it matters, I got the PMII 5-25 (MTC, LT, CCW, DT/ST, FFP, 1cm, LP, H59) stock code is: 677911592B2A8.

If the OP or anyone is thinking about one of these, I'm located in Kingston and can meet up if you want to check out the features. You can also PM me with any other questions.

thumprr: did you end up ordering one?
 
Why not a Kahles K624i

Just spent an hour going through this thread, why no mention of Kahles scope? I'd be interested in this well heeled group of shooter's opinion on the scope. Just studying it, it seems a very good option in the 3500-4000 buck scope bracket.

thank you, gentlemen.
 
Lack of availability, also same price as a Schmidt and Bender. In USA kahles Its much more affordable vs SB. I saw probably 8 or 10 Khales scopes on the weekend at a club prs match in the USA. There was maybe 5 sb's and only one TT. Which was called a white buffalo by the MD.
 
big bear said:
Just spent an hour going through this thread, why no mention of Kahles scope? I'd be interested in this well heeled group of shooter's opinion on the scope. Just studying it, it seems a very good option in the 3500-4000 buck scope bracket.

thank you, gentlemen.
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Dealers/distributor don't care to push the product IMO. I heard it's difficult dealing with the distributor when it comes to sending the scope back to Austria for warranty or things like ordering parts, changing reticle so YMMV.
 
big bear said:
Just spent an hour going through this thread, why no mention of Kahles scope? I'd be interested in this well heeled group of shooter's opinion on the scope. Just studying it, it seems a very good option in the 3500-4000 buck scope bracket.

thank you, gentlemen.
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Shooting Centre in Calgary carries Kahles scopes, last time I was there they had 2 (I think). They were $3,900+ or something along those lines.
 
Let's keep it on the topic guys.

I am torn now between NF ATACR F1 Mil-R 5-25x56 and S&B PMII LP 5-25x56 MSR. Especially with Prophet is having a sale right now, you can get the said NF for $3300 all in including shipping.

Is the particular S&B really worth the extra $1500? That is how much the different after I calculated.

I am thinking if NF is good enough for Chris Kyle, maybe it will be good enough for most people?
 
bacardi said:
Let's say if I can afford either one of them.....is the particular S&B worth the extra $1500? If it does, what particular feature(s) that makes it worth the extra money?
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No particular features. Some will argue better glass, but that's a matter of opinion and value. 4800$ for a 5-25 PMII seems steep to me, but maybe they've shot up.

Both are like looking into the face of God. Both are tough as nails and battle proven.
 
Yes, they're both great scopes. You'll be happy with either one of them. It's a matter of personal preference so we can't really help you decide. I'd fork out the extra bucks for the PM II, but that's just me. Then again, I'd fork out the extra again for a TT.
 
The ATACR will do everything you want it to do well, provided it has the options you want.

$3300 seems like a good price for what I believe is the updated model.
 
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