Not your typical bear defense thread
- Thread starter canuckjgc
- Start date
So a newbie comes on here asking questions and when they are answered he goes on the attack of those that tried to forwarn him...
The only answer for you is take those firearms in there with you don't worry those park officers won't bother you because you have the law on your side.
I can hardly wait for you to be man enough to come back to this thread and inform us of the charges that you acquired when caught with any firearm there.
Sheephunter is right if you can't use a firearm proficiently carry spray mind you that is the only real defense that you can legally carry there but you know that that isn't true so why listen to any advise posted here.
Also remember when you run out of spray and the bear comes back your out of luck...
The only answer for you is take those firearms in there with you don't worry those park officers won't bother you because you have the law on your side.
I can hardly wait for you to be man enough to come back to this thread and inform us of the charges that you acquired when caught with any firearm there.
Sheephunter is right if you can't use a firearm proficiently carry spray mind you that is the only real defense that you can legally carry there but you know that that isn't true so why listen to any advise posted here.
Also remember when you run out of spray and the bear comes back your out of luck...
------ H 4831 is " Right " on this !!!! " All Firearms are Prohibited " --- I happen to live in the area and know this is a Fact !!!!!!!!!!!!! ------- take Bear Spray !!!!
i spend 60-70 days a year, for the last 6 years in the bowron valley flyfishing and hunting. it supports a very healthy blackbear and grizz population. although, for the big brown fuzzy stuff be prepared to wear out some shoes. the salmon run was terrible this year so I image you wont see to many down along the river. Whate tail have started to really show up around the bowron/hagen confluence. Excellent flyfishing for bull trout (non-retention) at that spot too.
keep a clean camp and take any rifle/shotgun you like. if you;re like 99% of the people I meet in the area your biggest problem will be getting lost on the logging roads around Narrow lake
backroad maps shows connecting roads from the bowron FSR to the Park, but unless you have a lot of fuel and a monster truck, go the long way by stoney. bridges are out on the wolverine mountain side. \
bring a pan, I find the odd bit of color in Grizzly Creek.
don;t know much about about the park itself, but have been alaround the borders. so much country around there to see, why waste your time on some puddles full of hippies and yuppies from vancouver?
Ghost lake to the south of the park along the likely/well old road is amazing spot to canoe. the waterfall will blow you away.
dude, you are my new HERO! I laughed so hard I think a little piss came out.
keep a clean camp and take any rifle/shotgun you like. if you;re like 99% of the people I meet in the area your biggest problem will be getting lost on the logging roads around Narrow lake
backroad maps shows connecting roads from the bowron FSR to the Park, but unless you have a lot of fuel and a monster truck, go the long way by stoney. bridges are out on the wolverine mountain side. \
bring a pan, I find the odd bit of color in Grizzly Creek.
don;t know much about about the park itself, but have been alaround the borders. so much country around there to see, why waste your time on some puddles full of hippies and yuppies from vancouver?
Ghost lake to the south of the park along the likely/well old road is amazing spot to canoe. the waterfall will blow you away.
dude, you are my new HERO! I laughed so hard I think a little piss came out.
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We did the Bowron circuit over ten days, and we were inspected before leaving, all equipment weighed, and given the compulsory bear spray defense course.
On the trip we saw 17 bears, a dozen or so Park Wardens who made a point of visiting us at least once a day, 2 RCMP on patrol, and multiple provincial work crews.
I understood it to be "No Firearms".
Ghost is indeed one of the most special places you will ever find in the interior. It is also the home of what are probably some of the largest black bears in the province.
This guy taken 15 km from Ghost by one of my hunting buddies was well over 500 pounds live and his skull scored just shy of 20"
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I also liked Mitchel Lake, which is south of Ghost Lake, and now also in the Cariboo Mountain Park. There is a beautiful delta where the rivers enters it from the east, a wide flat, flanked by high mountains. Years ago there were certainly some huge grizzly bears leaving their tracks in the sand.
The lake iself is of galcier, milky colour, due to all the high mountains.
The lake iself is of galcier, milky colour, due to all the high mountains.
Ruger dosn't make that 44 semi anymore and they are hard to find used. I have tried but pepole want more for one used then what they were brand new. I would get a 12 ga with slugs. If you need to use it the last thing you want is a gun that shoots spit balls. If you need to get low recoil slugs I would rather use one ounce slugs then peas.
I think in the hands on someone that is inexperienced with both firearm and bears a firearm can be very dangerous. Like mentioned above a wounded bear can be incredibly dangerous. A firearm can give a false sence of security and inturn can cause a lapse of total awareness and a possible surprise. If you aren't experienced and the bear looks to you like it is dangerous there is a huge chance you are wrong and now you have a dead bear to explain or worse a wounded one that needs to be tracked down. As far as what to carry I would suggest a paintball gun or slingshot. I have shot a blackbear at 30feet in the back of the front shouldor with a 12ga 23/4inch magnum slug weighing 1.25oz. It hit the ear and the bear barely flinched and took off. It reacted so little I thought I had missed. We went into the woods after it and it went down about 100yrds inside the treeline. We opened it up and discovered that the slug had bounced off of the sholdur and travelled down between the ribs and hide breaking a tiny piece of rib off and it lodging it in the lung killing it. That was a planned shot. I have actually done some shotgun bear defense training and it is not an easy target to hit and to make it deadly takes practice. I really do suggest a paintballgun or a flare gun that a very close range will make a bear think twice. I would also encourage you to do some research into bear behavoir because you are dealing with 2 different species and the same action from each type of bear can mean completly different things. One last tip for bear country with a wife is that bears can smell blood from along way away so don't go then. Perp is a far better defence than a gun but in some cases both are nessisary.
- Location
- Back in the Peace Country
If you think you may need to use a gun, and can't properly use one that is required for the job, you probably shouldn't be there
Go get a loan of a 30 30 marlin. Let her shoot til the cows come home and get very good with one shot only. One shot, It's all you need if you do it right.
Then you go buy a 45/70 and put it on target at 50 yrds . After you have sighted it for 50 yrds, it's all done. Swith the guns.
If a bear needs it, grab the 45/70 the same as a 30 30 and Shoot , and hope for the best. One shot will probably be all an inexperienced shooter will ever get anyways, so who cares about the fright when she realizes it's a 45/70.
A second later she'll be thanking you or you both won't give a #### cause you're running your last steps. No one has time to be mad when a bear is eating them
Go get a loan of a 30 30 marlin. Let her shoot til the cows come home and get very good with one shot only. One shot, It's all you need if you do it right.
Then you go buy a 45/70 and put it on target at 50 yrds . After you have sighted it for 50 yrds, it's all done. Swith the guns.
If a bear needs it, grab the 45/70 the same as a 30 30 and Shoot , and hope for the best. One shot will probably be all an inexperienced shooter will ever get anyways, so who cares about the fright when she realizes it's a 45/70.
A second later she'll be thanking you or you both won't give a #### cause you're running your last steps. No one has time to be mad when a bear is eating them
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I have gone thru numerous guns trying to find the right one for my wife.
She now uses my Marlin 1895GS 45-70 with 425gr Beartooth WLNGC's with 48grs H322 recoil isn't all that bad this is the same load that I use in my 22" barreled T/C Contender carbine.
I normally load these bullets with 54grs H322 so with 6grs less powder it really reduces the felt recoil for her but gives excellent performance.
I have a XS Sights Backup ghost ring sight installed when she uses the rifle she finds it easy to see the sights and can acquire the target quickly.
She now uses my Marlin 1895GS 45-70 with 425gr Beartooth WLNGC's with 48grs H322 recoil isn't all that bad this is the same load that I use in my 22" barreled T/C Contender carbine.
I normally load these bullets with 54grs H322 so with 6grs less powder it really reduces the felt recoil for her but gives excellent performance.
I have a XS Sights Backup ghost ring sight installed when she uses the rifle she finds it easy to see the sights and can acquire the target quickly.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
Regardless of the gun chosen, the key is practice. I had my wife snap shooting at a 5 yard target with her Husky .30/06 this summer, and I was quite impressed. She would hold the rifle in both hands at port arms, I would yell, "SHOOT!" and she would mostly get the shot off in a second and a half, although once she took 3 seconds. At the shot she would immediately work the bolt with the rifle at her shoulder then return to port arms. When we were finished her group measured an inch and had I had her shooting pairs, I doubt if the results would of changed significantly.
Bear work typically is a close range problem. The action will be fast. That means that the best practice will involve drills that are done at very short range with a time element included. Position shooting can be worth while, particularly kneeling, but the bulk of the shooting should be off hand. Do not assume that because you can clean a target at 50 yards slow fire that you can do the same at 5 yards rapid fire. A moving target, particularly one that moves directly towards you is a challenge, but this might be the very target you are faced with in a real life defensive/protection scenario.
I just noticed that there was an earlier recommendation for a shotgun loaded with buckshot as a bear defense load. Shot has a place in the bear defence arsenal, but its use is one that is specialized and should be restricted to those times when the over penetration of a slug could be a hazard to other people, such as in towns, crowded campgrounds, or even when there is more than one tent near yours and a bear decides on a nocturnal visit forcing you to shoot from your bed. Because typical defensive ranges are so short, a shot pattern does not open up enough to be a hitting advantage, requiring rifle type precision anyway; particularly when the dismal ballistic efficiency of each individual pellet is considered.
Bear work typically is a close range problem. The action will be fast. That means that the best practice will involve drills that are done at very short range with a time element included. Position shooting can be worth while, particularly kneeling, but the bulk of the shooting should be off hand. Do not assume that because you can clean a target at 50 yards slow fire that you can do the same at 5 yards rapid fire. A moving target, particularly one that moves directly towards you is a challenge, but this might be the very target you are faced with in a real life defensive/protection scenario.
I just noticed that there was an earlier recommendation for a shotgun loaded with buckshot as a bear defense load. Shot has a place in the bear defence arsenal, but its use is one that is specialized and should be restricted to those times when the over penetration of a slug could be a hazard to other people, such as in towns, crowded campgrounds, or even when there is more than one tent near yours and a bear decides on a nocturnal visit forcing you to shoot from your bed. Because typical defensive ranges are so short, a shot pattern does not open up enough to be a hitting advantage, requiring rifle type precision anyway; particularly when the dismal ballistic efficiency of each individual pellet is considered.
I don't recall a Ernie Holmes, but that is not saying I didn't come across him. It was so long ago and I have crossed paths with so many people.
When I wrote my book, getting correct names was one of the hardest tasks. Sometimes I could recall everything, see the person vividly in my mind, but not sure of the name. Fortunately, I had two excellent people, who knew the people and the area I was referring to and I quite often would cheque with them, sometimes just to make sure I was right.
When I wrote my book, getting correct names was one of the hardest tasks. Sometimes I could recall everything, see the person vividly in my mind, but not sure of the name. Fortunately, I had two excellent people, who knew the people and the area I was referring to and I quite often would cheque with them, sometimes just to make sure I was right.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
That has not been the results of my observation. After 12" of penetration though an aqueous medium with a hard shell covering, an individual pellet has little remaining velocity, probably not enough to produce a lethal wound to a target 10 yards beyond the impact target. Conversely, the slug after 12" of penetration continues to be a lethal projectile well beyond that range. Additionally, the target down range from the impact target is unlikely to sustain multiple pellet hits due to the wide dispersion of the shot column, but if it sustains a hit from the slug, it is hit with the entire retained weight of the slug.
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Just talking penetration Boomer and I think this subject has been studied to death despite your observations. Not making a case for buckshot here just pointing out a fact that many on this board refuse to believe.
I'm still a big fan a the energy delivered by one big solid mass for bear defense and the fact that buckshot out penetrates slugs does not make them more lethal but it doesn't make it any less of a fact either.
It's always a good day when you get to say, "Hey, I learned something today" Guess you are having a good day.
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