Thanks for your input i haven't attempted anything still waiting for official word from the CFO, on what to do with 25 rounders: turn them, have them pinned w/e . They really ruined this rifle for me i really should have just got a 10/22 or something similar to that.
Notice to S&W M&P 15-22 Rifle Owners
- Thread starter Questar
- Start date
Thanks for your input i haven't attempted anything still waiting for official word from the CFO, on what to do with 25 rounders: turn them, have them pinned w/e . They really ruined this rifle for me i really should have just got a 10/22 or something similar to that.
yea thats it the canadian contact info is online under 2 weeks and presto. i am still waiting on further clarification. but it sounds like part # to me however i am also prepared to get drum mags idc either way i bought it for high capacity fun matches.....
yah still waiting to hear from you how you got free mags and why (if you even did), maybe if you were more open about it instead of sneak around the question, people would be more open to taking what you have to say seriously..... just a thought....
Mark,
What is the R.C.M.P. doing about this magazine situation? I have heard nothing out here and dealers are still selling extra 25 round magazines and rifles with the 25 round magazines.
If these magazines are going to be changed to prohib status, why are the R.C.M.P. allowing them to remain on the shelves and to be sold to unsuspecting public?
What is the R.C.M.P. doing about this magazine situation? I have heard nothing out here and dealers are still selling extra 25 round magazines and rifles with the 25 round magazines.
If these magazines are going to be changed to prohib status, why are the R.C.M.P. allowing them to remain on the shelves and to be sold to unsuspecting public?
Kelley Rathman
Customer Service/Exports
Returns
Smith & Wesson
800-331-0852 x 3766
krathman@smith-wesson.com
I explained the predicament, and how it was basically there fault in a nice way. and yes I did indeed get them for free no bs. They payed the twenty something in shipping too.
"if the law has gone through yet".....
The law was passed years ago.
The regulations have been in place for years.
This manufacturer is manufacturing and marketing magazines for their pistol which exceed the 10 round limit which has been in place for pistol magazines for years.
If you want to find out exactly what the situation is with respect to the legal status of the magazines sold with, and for, the rifles, call 1 800 731 4000, and ask to be connected to the RCMP Firearms Investigative & Enforcement Services Directorate. You might be able to get an accurate, up to date explanation of the legal status of these magazines.
You might even tell them that the rifles are still being sold with 25rd. magazines, and ask if the buyers and sellers are in legal jeopardy. The buyers and sellers do have the right to know.
this is what I got when I asked about the magazines
I have only recently heard of the changes regarding the magazines, and I know it has many folks concerned, and as a result we are starting to get a lot of reaction, however, I was under the impression that now the magazines are to be turned in, and therefore would not be available for exchange. If this is the case, and you would like to order the 10 round capacity mags I will be happy to offer to you a law enforcement discount, to help offset the expense of replacing them. I am sorry to report they are currently on back order, but orders will be released automatically when the mags are again available. I anticipate that could be 2-3 weeks or more...difficult to say for sure. I hope you find this to be satisfactory, under the circumstances we will have many of our Canadian neighbors looking for magazines, I'm sure. Please let me know how you wish to proceed. Thank you.
Thinking I might aswell just sell the rifle off ......... not to happy with it anyways
I have only recently heard of the changes regarding the magazines, and I know it has many folks concerned, and as a result we are starting to get a lot of reaction, however, I was under the impression that now the magazines are to be turned in, and therefore would not be available for exchange. If this is the case, and you would like to order the 10 round capacity mags I will be happy to offer to you a law enforcement discount, to help offset the expense of replacing them. I am sorry to report they are currently on back order, but orders will be released automatically when the mags are again available. I anticipate that could be 2-3 weeks or more...difficult to say for sure. I hope you find this to be satisfactory, under the circumstances we will have many of our Canadian neighbors looking for magazines, I'm sure. Please let me know how you wish to proceed. Thank you.
Thinking I might aswell just sell the rifle off ......... not to happy with it anyways
What are peoples plans with these? should i pin them ASAP or wait for further discussion... I am joining this conversation late and am distressed by this news...
does anyone have a good step by step process to pin them?
Thanks,
Kieran
does anyone have a good step by step process to pin them?
Thanks,
Kieran
Same response that I got.
Our options are this:
- Destroy them or turn them in
- Pin them at 10 to remain legal
- Ask for a refund/exchange from where you purchased your rifle for the 10 rounds when S&W start shipping them again
- Buy the 50-round Black Dog drums to make Canada more safe
Thanks RCMP! With a stroke of a pen you turned almost 2,000 M&P 15-22 owners into criminals with potential of a massive fine and/or 5 years in jail!
- Location
- Calgary, Alberta
I assume you're being sarcastic, but the SIG-Sauer 522 is clearly not a variant of a prohibited firearm, it is a variant of the SIG-Sauer 556 which is a variant of the SIG SG551 and their advertising makes that clear (full page ad in AR a couple of months back).
To say that it is a variant of the SG551 is an entirely subjective decision by RCMP. Personally I think if you took it to judicial review that one could be overturned, but of course that would be very expensive.
We did receive an "official" written response to our request for "direction" on how we could deal with our inventory of magazines caught up in this RCMP decision... the Ontario CFO office has informed us that:
We can "pin" the magazines that we had in our inventory at the time of being notified of the "Prohibited" ruling... and that the CFO would send someone to inspect the pinned magazines to confirm they were in compliance, after which we can legally sell those pinned magazines; or
We could turn the affected magazines in to police for destruction
I can only guess that the CFO would treat others (dealers and end-users) in a similar fashion but that's just a guess... All I can tell you for sure is that the above information was sent to me (in writing) and specific to the affected magazines we have in our inventory... does not apply to any other units.
Mark
We can "pin" the magazines that we had in our inventory at the time of being notified of the "Prohibited" ruling... and that the CFO would send someone to inspect the pinned magazines to confirm they were in compliance, after which we can legally sell those pinned magazines; or
We could turn the affected magazines in to police for destruction
I can only guess that the CFO would treat others (dealers and end-users) in a similar fashion but that's just a guess... All I can tell you for sure is that the above information was sent to me (in writing) and specific to the affected magazines we have in our inventory... does not apply to any other units.
Mark
RCMP Tables Section has used the "variant of a variant" justification for years now on many other questionable classifications, but none (to my knowledge) were tested successfully in court (until the original Henderson decision judge included his opinions in the ruling he handed down).
It is our opinion that the SIG522 should NOT be classified as a Prohibited Variant and that's why we have initiated a legal challenge... but as you pointed out these are VERY expensive and it will take years of court dates and appeals to get a final decision (either way).
Having said that, while I don't agree with the RCMP's ruling on the issue and I believe the courts will agree with us (eventually)... I don't find fault with the RCMP either, since their ruling is based on years of similar cases and I expect they were under pressure to rule in the "tightest" sense possible.
I've said this before and I believe that it is the politicians that are to blame for these issues... they write bad law (poorly thoughtout and poorly worded), they don't write in the necessary checks and balances, definitions and exemptions... they leave it for the courts to eventually work it all out and the reality is that the courts are not capable of handling these issues... not in the volume of instances necessary.
Things would be so much different if we could be awarded our costs in the event that we are successful in challenging these rulings... then it wouldn't be so bad in taking on the government and the government would have to actually think before they made some of these rulings. As it is now they don't care about the costs you incur fighting them and they actually expect you'll give up or they will outlast you in 99% of the cases. It's power through brute force and economic might.
Mark
Well said. All this hair splitting about .22LR "variants" is absurd in the first place. Unless they can be easily modified to fire a larger cartridge there is no intellectually respectable argument for lumping them in with the centre fire guns. (And I am not, by implication, suggesting for a moment that the main prohibited and restricted lists make any sense either.)
As far as restricted rimfire variants are concerned, the whole issue could be eliminated by deleting one clause from the CCC Regulations - Part 2.2 (w). That could be done by Order in Council. Literally a stroke of the pen. I wish the various firearms orgs would focus on this particular issue. It's easy to argue the case and wouldn't require any amendments to the Code or Firearms Act. It would be a good starting point for rolling back some of the other ridiculous regulations.
[QUOTE
Things would be so much different if we could be awarded our costs in the event that we are successful in challenging these rulings... then it wouldn't be so bad in taking on the government and the government would have to actually think before they made some of these rulings. As it is now they don't care about the costs you incur fighting them and they actually expect you'll give up or they will outlast you in 99% of the cases. It's power through brute force and economic might.
[/QUOTE]
Good point Mark, hopefully this one concept will be challenged one day at the Supreme Court
Things would be so much different if we could be awarded our costs in the event that we are successful in challenging these rulings... then it wouldn't be so bad in taking on the government and the government would have to actually think before they made some of these rulings. As it is now they don't care about the costs you incur fighting them and they actually expect you'll give up or they will outlast you in 99% of the cases. It's power through brute force and economic might.
[/QUOTE]
Good point Mark, hopefully this one concept will be challenged one day at the Supreme Court
I was at Wholesale Sports today. They told me the CFO was in about 2 weeks ago and confiscated all 25rnd mags.
Has anyone besides a dealer been contacted yet?
Which WSS? You don't list a location for us to guess.
Mark
Good god... I just found this thread today.
Thank god for the Black Dog mags... I was about to crap my pants when I realized it pertains to "...S&W 25 round rimfire magazine Part #404850000 and is NOT applicable to other makes or models of magazines."
Still very terrible news though.
Thank god for the Black Dog mags... I was about to crap my pants when I realized it pertains to "...S&W 25 round rimfire magazine Part #404850000 and is NOT applicable to other makes or models of magazines."
Still very terrible news though.
