Ontario Moose Draw Results???

Something as simple as adding more pool levels/ratings would make the system "more fair".

When I was posted in NFLD they had 4 pools for moose hunting.

So while it took 4 years to get up to pool 1, it prevented the "same groups" from pulling tags every year or every other year while others went years without getting a tag. Also, in their system, if a tag was pulled the whole group went down to pool 4 (not just Buddy who actually got the tag) and then started from there whether they switched groups or whatever for the following season.

In area's where it was "under hunted" (like our various WMU 1's and 25) the tags would reach down into pool 3 or 4 applicants most years.

In the popular areas what it meant was, Bob's group didn't pull a tag every year while Dan's had applied for six years in a row without seeing one.

Something as simple as that would be a couple lines of computer code in the current Moose draw software and would probably share things out a little more equally.

PS - Hunt Bears - they are good to eat and may save a few moose :)
 
We lobbied for years for a "preference point" system... where every year you apply and are unsuccessful, you receive another point... people with the most points get the tag... each WMU has a specified point value to receive tags... it is done in many states and it is successful... but obviously the plan fell on deaf ears.
 
I have a question this is my first year hunting, aswell as my neighbour. I missed deadline but he got in, he says he entered for 48 where my camp is and yesterday he knocked on my door to show me he got a tag in the mail. My question is no where on the tag does it say 48 but since he got one and said that's the only place he entered the draw for would that mean he was successful for 48 or will it say somewhere in the tag?
 
Rottiguy said:
I have a question this is my first year hunting, aswell as my neighbour. I missed deadline but he got in, he says he entered for 48 where my camp is and yesterday he knocked on my door to show me he got a tag in the mail. My question is no where on the tag does it say 48 but since he got one and said that's the only place he entered the draw for would that mean he was successful for 48 or will it say somewhere in the tag?
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No... it means he was not successful in receiving a bull or cow tag... he can only hunt for calves in any WMU with an open calf season.
 
Rottiguy said:
I have a question this is my first year hunting, aswell as my neighbour. I missed deadline but he got in, he says he entered for 48 where my camp is and yesterday he knocked on my door to show me he got a tag in the mail. My question is no where on the tag does it say 48 but since he got one and said that's the only place he entered the draw for would that mean he was successful for 48 or will it say somewhere in the tag?
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WMU 48 is one of four WMU's that require hunters to enter the draw even for a Calf tag. There's also harvest reporting required for every Moose hunter whether successful or not. There were very few tags issued for all those areas combined,so,your buddy was very lucky. The upside is that he may hunt in any WMU in Ontario that has an open season for Calves. The downside is that Calf seasons have been reduced to a two-week period in every WMU in the north above the French-Mattawa River. Good Luck!
 
hoytcanon said:
We lobbied for years for a "preference point" system... where every year you apply and are unsuccessful, you receive another point... people with the most points get the tag... each WMU has a specified point value to receive tags... it is done in many states and it is successful... but obviously the plan fell on deaf ears.
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I wrote letters proposing the same system. The answer I got back was that everybody was happy with the way it is.
 
Rottiguy said:
I have a question this is my first year hunting, aswell as my neighbour. I missed deadline but he got in, he says he entered for 48 where my camp is and yesterday he knocked on my door to show me he got a tag in the mail. My question is no where on the tag does it say 48 but since he got one and said that's the only place he entered the draw for would that mean he was successful for 48 or will it say somewhere in the tag?
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My (calf) tag reads " Valid for calf in all WMU's except WMU's 48, 55A, 55B, 57 and 65 unless affixed with a tag that is validated for calf". If buddies tag doesn't specify valid in WMU 48, then he didn't draw a tag. But he can hunt anywhere else in the province.
 
9.3mauser said:
My (calf) tag reads " Valid for calf in all WMU's except WMU's 48, 55A, 55B, 57 and 65 unless affixed with a tag that is validated for calf". If buddies tag doesn't specify valid in WMU 48, then he didn't draw a tag. But he can hunt anywhere else in the province.
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Ya I think this is the case. Thanks everyone for the replies! Here's to hoping for next year
 
For those who have the time and the money they are now starting to move their hunts to other jurisdictions. If I was younger I would again hunt outside Ontario. Either the MNR is staffed by total incompetents or they are following instructions from their political bosses who obviously do not know what they are doing. How many years ago was it the Ministry was telling they had a fix for all our problems in the implementation of the unlimited calf tags. The herd can handle this without causing problems. Now they limit where and when calves can be hunted.

I would be inclined to think the Liberals would be behind this since they are so opposed to guns. But to believe this I would have to forget about the earlier changes made by the Conservatives. I always voted as a staunch Conservative but lately have reached the point of doubting whether there is any party that can be trusted to look out for my philosophies.

Federally the Liberals want to spend billions of dollars they don't have, supposedly to cure the sagging economy. I learned at a very young age (a long time ago) you do not spend what you don't have! All you do is create interest debt that is passed along, ultimately to grandchildren. I have reached the point where I am now glad I do not have grandchildren.

Time to wrap this up. All I am doing is getting worked up over things I can not change. For those who are still hunting I hope you have an enjoyable season even though you lack tags.

Jim
 
OntJim said:
For those who have the time and the money they are now starting to move their hunts to other jurisdictions. If I was younger I would again hunt outside Ontario. Either the MNR is staffed by total incompetents or they are following instructions from their political bosses who obviously do not know what they are doing. How many years ago was it the Ministry was telling they had a fix for all our problems in the implementation of the unlimited calf tags. The herd can handle this without causing problems. Now they limit where and when calves can be hunted.

I would be inclined to think the Liberals would be behind this since they are so opposed to guns. But to believe this I would have to forget about the earlier changes made by the Conservatives. I always voted as a staunch Conservative but lately have reached the point of doubting whether there is any party that can be trusted to look out for my philosophies.

Federally the Liberals want to spend billions of dollars they don't have, supposedly to cure the sagging economy. I learned at a very young age (a long time ago) you do not spend what you don't have! All you do is create interest debt that is passed along, ultimately to grandchildren. I have reached the point where I am now glad I do not have grandchildren.

Time to wrap this up. All I am doing is getting worked up over things I can not change. For those who are still hunting I hope you have an enjoyable season even though you lack tags.

Jim
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There is more at work here than just moose tag policies and the other scapegoats - wolves, bears and natives hunting. Moose die off isn't limited to Ontario, it is a trend across N America. Climate change is thought to be a primary driver on a number of fronts, too many warm days for cows to carry to term, to the increase in ticks and tick ranges, expanding deer range with brain worm.

But then again we on CGN don't believe in climate change, must be the wolves, bears, natives and government
 
"There is more at work here than just moose tag policies and the other scapegoats - wolves, bears and natives hunting. Moose die off isn't limited to Ontario, it is a trend across N America. Climate change is thought to be a primary driver on a number of fronts, too many warm days for cows to carry to term, to the increase in ticks and tick ranges, expanding deer range with brain worm.

But then again we on CGN don't believe in climate change, must be the wolves, bears, natives and government"

I don't question the decline in the population. I question the way the tag distribution system allocates tags, specifically, not addressing the known flaws in the system. I have talked to MNR about this and they told me 'that is the way hunters want it'. I know that statement is incorrect. We know there are less tags, we are just asking for a better distribution system.
The decline in moose numbers has many facets. Last year while hunting we ran into a retired MNR biologist. He stated that the moose population in this WMU ( where he lives and traps) was down significantly. While on his trap line, he had seen a number of wolf kills. On average, one every other week and this only on his trap line. He also stated that the bear population was very high in this WMU and that a significant number of moose were taken by natives. He stated that he called his contacts at the MNR to suggest reducing the wolf numbers and increasing the number of bear tags made available but they dismissed his suggestions. If men are driving relatively new pickups with four wheelers in the box using scoped high powered rifles then they should have to purchase and apply for validation tags like everyone else. How can you manage a population when you ignore these contributing factors? These are factors the MNR/government can control but choose not too because it is politically to hard. Climate change. The government refuses to change things it can control.
 
Gotta watch out for those fast acting effects of climate change.... Sarcasm done. Ask yourself then why so many moose are popping up further south in wildlife management units with low bear and wolf numbers, not to mention lack of hunting pressure from "regulated" and "unregulated" hunters.
 
jables said:
Gotta watch out for those fast acting effects of climate change.... Sarcasm done. Ask yourself then why so many moose are popping up further south in wildlife management units with low bear and wolf numbers, not to mention lack of hunting pressure from "regulated" and "unregulated" hunters.
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The moose decline has been going on for a number of years, MNRs tag system just finally caught up. If you think there are fewer unregulated hunters in the southern WMUs you are mistaken. I know lots of guys from southern Ont reserves that go north just far enough to get moose.

I have no faith the government can deal with the climate change issue. I just think people have to start realizing it is a factor and that all of the easy solutions (reduce wolves, bears and native hunters) may not address the issue.
 
The government may not be able to address all the issues, but it should address the ones it can change. The easy solution is to keep reducing the number of tags issued instead of dealing with the difficult/politically incorrect issues.
 
jables said:
Gotta watch out for those fast acting effects of climate change.... Sarcasm done. Ask yourself then why so many moose are popping up further south in wildlife management units with low bear and wolf numbers, not to mention lack of hunting pressure from "regulated" and "unregulated" hunters.
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The average annual temperature is up about 1 degree celsius from 40 years ago when the areas we hunted were so beat down with moose tracks you couldn't count them all.
When the difference hit 1/2 degree about 60% of the moose population dropped dead from heat stroke. :rolleyes:
Climate change is the culprit for sure. ;)
 
Paw and I read through the posts and we can guess to about a 90% accuracy which posters likely never spent a single day in the actual bush moose hunting in their lives. ;)
 
I think we can alleviate the pressure by requiring every moose hunter who lives south of the French River to come north of the French River , on their own time , on their own dime , book vacation to take a 3 day moose hunting course . Say , $300.00 for the course plus food , lodging , gas , vacation and days lost at work . They can stay south of the French River and hunt groundhogs and properly divide the tags between us who live here . Knock yer socks off and be happy filling your freezers with groundhogs . At the very least they should pay the same price as any other non-resident after taking the moose course and hiring an outfitter .
 
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