Ontario moose ... New Rules
- Thread starter Jaaska
- Start date
The computer generated draw pick is almost always correct as per their rules. We had one of our group who we thought should have been on the top of our list and asked MNR why he didn’t win the draw. Their answer was that he picked up a surplus tag a few years prior and that counted against him and was their equivalent of him drawing a tag. We had no idea that buying a surplus tag would put you in the back of the pack even though you stayed in pool 1.
There must have been a reason you’re 25 year applying guy didn’t draw a tag. Was it all consecutive?, or did he purchase a surplus tag somewhat recently? Get him to phone the MNR and they will look his file up and give the reason why he wasn’t successful.
I went last year, their season is only 2 weeks long.
Trimmer 905
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
On the surface,I'm liking what I see with this new system. With the elimination of tag transfers,the system eliminates all bones-of-contention with manipulating tags by certain groups. They're either IN or they're OUT,it's as simple as that. Now,if we could only get the other side of the equation on board with their own closely matching harvest system,under population and over harvest issues would be solved.
lazyfarmer
CGN Regular
- Location
- S.W.Ontario
How do you explain the 2 tags in 7 years to the newbie? In our area there are no guarenteed group size and no suplus tags, older fellow applied every year as we apply as a group. We are not the only ones who had this issue.
Really, I don’t have to explain, a call to the MNR would explain why that could have happened. There are WMU’s that have 100% success rate when applying to the draw and some others that are in the 80% and 90% range so that’s also a possibility.
As for your older guy, there’s definitely a reason he hasn’t drawn a tag. Call the MNR and you’ll get the answer. If he missed a year, he had to start over.
That won’t happen with the new system though as they will be removing the “consecutive” from requirements. It will give the hunter a point for every year that they applied and were unsuccessful and it doesn’t have to be consecutive.
For the vast majority of hunters, all they can afford to take is 1 week, maybe 2 at most. I think most guys would prefer a 2-week season where they know they can hunt than the system Ontario has now. I know a lot of guys who quit hunting moose because of the rules we have. I know that personally, I will never go back to moose. Just too phoqued up.
Maybe for group draws, the tag goes to the member who has been in pool 1 longest, but when the draw is for individual applicants, it's a totally random draw.
trkyhunter
Member
- Location
- ontario,not toronto
another problem,with no transfers,if you drew the tag and then something happens like a medical problem you have just thrown $250 away and ruined the hunt for your group
Yeah, that was part of the plan, I'm sure, but there are quite a few factors - I used to hunt WMU 28, sometimes 29. I think they give out under 10 tags per unit. Add to that the fact that moose are just too frikkin' big and I'm too frikkin' old.
I wonder how many calves get shot in a year? I hunted moose every year from 74 to 97, and we harvested our full quota of moose every year, and I only remember us getting one calf in all that time. We did get 4 or 5 cows for each bull, though.
I don't hunt moose any more, and am quite content with deer hunting - less hassle getting tags, close to home, a kill I can easily handle and butcher myself, but I think Ontario should take a close look at the QC system. I don't know the details, but there are several guys I know that have given up hunting in ON, and now go to QC. Also, I don't hear many complaints from friends and relatives who are residents and hunters in QC.
Me too (lol) but i ended seeing way more people in the bush at the same time. But that was my only time to qc and much further south than normal. I did not enjoy seeing a camp at every bend of the road.
I hunted moose in Ont from 1971 to 2013. The early years were simple, you bought a moose licence which came with a bear licence as a bonus as bear were considered a nuisance. You went moose hunting and shot what you came across. Then the folks at The MNR decided to change the system and there was a short period that it took two licence tags to tag a moose. Then the lottery came along. I remember the MNR saying at the time the lottery would only be instituted for 10 yrs and during they time it would double the moose population and then the lottery would be discontinued. Well many decades later we all know how that worked.
In my humble opinion and observations the moose are in decline in many areas for many reasons. Ticks and disease, wolves, poaching, gross over hunting by natives just because they can, and a lottery system that emphasised killing off the cows and calves. As we know human nature is opportunistic, we will by nature take advantage of and manipulate the circumstances to our favour. So as a result with the moose lottery was manipulated as best it could be by the citizenry and the natives took full advantage of their status by shooting what they wanted when they wanted.
My opinion is moose hunting in Ontario should be suspended/closed for a period of ten years to give the moose a hiatus. All the other factors will still be affecting their population which unfortunately includes native abuse as the government will never have guts to take them to task. But if enough of us ordinary tax payers say enough is enough on all fronts on these native issues perhaps they will. It has taken decades to put the moose population in this position and it will take decades to turn it around. The other issues is the economic impact to the province in lost licence fees and to tourist camps, neither of which wants to loose the money. But someone has to make the decision of do you want a healthy moose population for the future or do you want to carry on and have the money. This new lottery will solve nothing as to increasing the moose population. But it will keep the hunters somewhat happy and the economic benefits will still exist so I guess "money" has been chosen, which is no great surprise.
As to me I seen the writing on the wall years ago but stubbornly persisted, until I had enough aggravation with the system and plain just lack of moose. Over the years I created many great memories of moose hunting, so I am satisfied that I have had my time. It is most unfortunate that there will be several generations that will not have the same experiences that my generation did. I would say a grossly underfunded and incompetent MNR and completely spineless and politically correct politicians are to thank. I now only hunt on my own property for deer and bear and be made a fool of by sly wolves.
In my humble opinion and observations the moose are in decline in many areas for many reasons. Ticks and disease, wolves, poaching, gross over hunting by natives just because they can, and a lottery system that emphasised killing off the cows and calves. As we know human nature is opportunistic, we will by nature take advantage of and manipulate the circumstances to our favour. So as a result with the moose lottery was manipulated as best it could be by the citizenry and the natives took full advantage of their status by shooting what they wanted when they wanted.
My opinion is moose hunting in Ontario should be suspended/closed for a period of ten years to give the moose a hiatus. All the other factors will still be affecting their population which unfortunately includes native abuse as the government will never have guts to take them to task. But if enough of us ordinary tax payers say enough is enough on all fronts on these native issues perhaps they will. It has taken decades to put the moose population in this position and it will take decades to turn it around. The other issues is the economic impact to the province in lost licence fees and to tourist camps, neither of which wants to loose the money. But someone has to make the decision of do you want a healthy moose population for the future or do you want to carry on and have the money. This new lottery will solve nothing as to increasing the moose population. But it will keep the hunters somewhat happy and the economic benefits will still exist so I guess "money" has been chosen, which is no great surprise.
As to me I seen the writing on the wall years ago but stubbornly persisted, until I had enough aggravation with the system and plain just lack of moose. Over the years I created many great memories of moose hunting, so I am satisfied that I have had my time. It is most unfortunate that there will be several generations that will not have the same experiences that my generation did. I would say a grossly underfunded and incompetent MNR and completely spineless and politically correct politicians are to thank. I now only hunt on my own property for deer and bear and be made a fool of by sly wolves.
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Regarding revenue, how many licenses are sold in Ontario in a year? 200K? That works out to about $10M @ $50 a pop - peanuts to the government. Outfitters would be affected, but with the spring bear hunt back on, increased turkey numbers, and maybe a campaign to reduce wolf numbers through guided hunts, they could probably make up the revenue. Thing is, without addressing the "subsistence hunting" issue, I don't think they would have much success with a hiatus.
