Papa's Remington 725 in .308 Norma Mag

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skydoor

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I encourage you to read my first post about how I got this gun.

This thing has so much family history. My Papa told me the story how he took down a massive grizzly bear when he and an RCMP officer were on a joint patrol (Papa was with EPD) on horseback in Alberta. While they were on the trails, the horses picked something up and a massive grizzly was charging at them. My Papa said the RCMP office froze but he took out this 725 and put one bullet between its eyes. It went down and he made a pelt out of it (which we sat on every time we visited).

I find this rifle interesting because it shows that it may have been originally chambered for .30-06 but then he must've changed it to .308 Norma Magnum. I know it's a Norma because I have one round left and .308 Winchester doesn't work. I'm hoping to get a dye for this round so I can eventually make my own by modifying .338 Winchester brass...

EDIT: So apparently I can't link photos yet... well that sucks.

**Image and video linking functions will be enabled after you have contributed more to the forum**
 
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Sweet cartridge, you can still get dies and loaded ammo in Canada. And a few guns if you look hard enough!

Just don't confuse it with .300 Norma Magnum as it's a completely different beast.
 
I do not think Norma even made rifles, nor supplied ammo for sale when they introduced that one - was brass cases and chamber reamers loaned or given to North American gun smiths - in the days when the world was awash with cheap mil-surp 30-06 bolt action rifles - run in chamber reamer which gave fresh surface on every dimension from 30-06 chamber, open up the bolt face to belted rim size, and you had a rifle chambered for "more" than a 30-06, in a package that was shorter than 300 Weatherby or 300 H&H. Many rifles "done up" like that had NO alteration to feed lips, magazine or follower - just was used with the former 30-06 stuff.

Is some writings that 308 Norma Mag was the impetus for Winchester of the time to come out with the 300 Win Mag - which was advertised to exceed the 308 Norma Mag, which many reloaders have found to be true or not true. I have a rifle in that chambering by Parker Hale with 24" barrel - they also made a version with 22" barrel which I no longer own. I think was all long before many had access to actual chronographs - so many tended to rely on advertised numbers - so I suspect the 22" Norma Mag compared to 24" 30-06 is where 308 Norma Mag got reputation as a "loud" 30-06.

I notice recently that Prophet River had some ammo for sale; is at least one recent ad on EE where B.C. guy is selling a reloading die set for it.

It would basically fit right in to the series started by Winchester in the 1950's - "short magnums" - that is, 30-06 length - 458 Win Mag, 338 Win Mag, 264 Win Mag. It was Remington who added the 7mm Rem Mag - a curious thing why Winchester did not come out with "308 Win Mag" at that time, in that series, but they did not - Norma seems to have "stolen" that spot. My understanding is that anything you hit with that thing will not know a difference among many other 30 "magnums" of that era. I believe that 30-338 is the name of the wildcat made by necking down 338 Win Mag to 30 cal - I believe you will come up with useable cases, but the necks will be slightly shorter than actual 308 Norma Magnum brass.
 
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I’ve got three 725’s 30/06,270 and a 243. They are terrific rifles with fully adjustable triggers, nice bolt handles and stocks made for scopes. Good luck getting the parts together to resurrect yours. Sounds like some exciting family history.
 
Potash Miner is bang on. In 1961 reamers started being available in North America. A year later cases started coming in. They were never in great supply. So when the 300 win came out widely available in factory rifles and ammunition readily available it’s popularity over shadowed the 308 NM. My P-17 has had a bit of work done to it polishing parts , adjustable trigger. Original barrel was used. Stock was made to resemble the Weatherby MK5.Scope is a Balvar 2-8x with adjustable base. Still a few of us around that shoot them. Ammo is about $140 or more a box so reloading is the way to go if your going to shoot them any amount.
 
You have acquired a very fine rifle, OP. Cherish it for several reasons. :)

I have had a long, pleasant relationship with the 308 Norma Magnum.
Since about 1967, I have owned about a dozen of them, including several
custom builds, one of which I still have and use.
20220128_184026.jpg

A 24" barrelled 308 Norma will yield 3100 fps with a 180 grain bullet, and flirt
with 3000 with the 200 grain pills. It is so close to the 300 Win Mag, that any
real difference is academic. It has a longer neck, which "might" be a plus with
some bullets. Below is a pic of a loaded round, the 180 Scirocco II and the same
recovered from a moose I shot. EE.
20141028_183637 (2).jpg
 

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One here in Schultz & Larsen in 308 NM.
Just picked up a 7mm rm in the same in a MD68 DL.

Fabulous round.
Too bad it wasn't branditted as the 308 Winchester Mag.
The popularity would of taken awf.

There was a set of dies in the EE and some factory rounds there as well for wutt I thought was a decent $$
 
Shot my moose this year with a 22" barreled Parker Hale in 308 Norma, still works. Can't pack those quarters like I used to.
 
I had a very fine 308 Norma Mag barreled up by Bill Leeper on a Weatherby Vanguard magnum receiver. Bedded into a McMillan fiberglass stock, and fitted up with a Leupold 2-7X28 scope, it was one of the most accurate hunting rifles I owned.

Good news is that 3000 fps with 180 gr bullets is no trick at all using reformed 338 Winchester brass, magnum primers, and any number of appropriate slow burning powders.

No doubt you will be very pleased when you start using this rifle at the range as well as afield.

Keep us posted,
Ted
 
Is it better to form from 7mm/264 mag brass or 338?
338 will get shorter sizing down, the 7mm/264 will get longer sizing up, just wondering what results in a proper length neck?
 
7 Rem mag will be shorter. 338 is still slightly shorter but closer than the 7 mag. The bulk of my cases are made from 300 Win mag. Needs to be annealed, shoulder needs to be pushed back and trimmed. Easiest is to use 338 which will be slightly short. Push the shoulder back and trim so that all cases are same length. I have tried all 3 cases and the one I like the best is 300 Win mag as I get the proper length. The 7 doesn’t increase in length as the neck brass is actually stretched side ways making the 30 cal neck.
 
Thanks for update Snider Shooter! I was about to set up 308 Norma Mag dies and try a few - is some previously fired R-P 7mm Rem Mag and W-W 338 Win Mag cases here to try. Some years ago on CGN, I came into circa 150 new Norma brand 308 Norma Mag brass - so I do not have to re-form from anything to feed that rifle, for the time being - no doubt "handy to know" what else might work. Although, I do have a 338 Win Mag rifle and I do have a 300 Win Mag rifle, so I would likely load up them, rather than re-form those brass into 308 Norma Mag. But I do not own a 7 mm Rem Mag rifle - is likely what I would try to re-form from - only because they are here, not because they would be "best". My "big" 7mm is a 7x61 Sharpe and Hart - likely "close enough" to 7mm Rem Mag.
 
Potashminer said:
Thanks for update Snider Shooter! I was about to set up 308 Norma Mag dies and try a few - is some previously fired R-P 7mm Rem Mag and W-W 338 Win Mag cases here to try. Some years ago on CGN, I came into circa 150 new Norma brand 308 Norma Mag brass - so I do not have to re-form from anything to feed that rifle, for the time being - no doubt "handy to know" what else might work. Although, I do have a 338 Win Mag rifle and I do have a 300 Win Mag rifle, so I would likely load up them, rather than re-form those brass into 308 Norma Mag. But I do not own a 7 mm Rem Mag rifle - is likely what I would try to re-form from - only because they are here, not because they would be "best". My "big" 7mm is a 7x61 Sharpe and Hart - likely "close enough" to 7mm Rem Mag.
Click to expand...

They'll work fine. - dan
 
Well, 458wm and 264wm came out in 1958. When they didn't immediately come out with a 30cal version, nimrods made the 30-338, which Norma adopted as the 308nm. When the 300wm came out, it pretty much killed the 308nm. Should help you pinpoint the year your rifle was converted, especially since the model 700 came out in 1962, replacing the 725.

The 308nm is just slightly behind the 300wm. Being that it's pretty much obsolete, it's a reloader caliber. I believe Norma makes ammo, but it's going to be right up there with African calibers for price. Good handloads are right there with factory 300wm. I'm a big believer in having the proper headstamp on my brass. Suggest you search the EE for actual 308nm brass, even that will be pricey, say about $2/.

Necking down the larger diameter neck of 338wm, your going to end up with more material. Neck turning, trimming, and wasting primers fireforming makes that 308nm brass sound better and better.
 
nowarningshot said:
Well, 458wm and 264wm came out in 1958. When they didn't immediately come out with a 30cal version, nimrods made the 30-338, which Norma adopted as the 308nm. When the 300wm came out, it pretty much killed the 308nm. Should help you pinpoint the year your rifle was converted, especially since the model 700 came out in 1962, replacing the 725.

The 308nm is just slightly behind the 300wm. Being that it's pretty much obsolete, it's a reloader caliber. I believe Norma makes ammo, but it's going to be right up there with African calibers for price. Good handloads are right there with factory 300wm. I'm a big believer in having the proper headstamp on my brass. Suggest you search the EE for actual 308nm brass, even that will be pricey, say about $2/.

Necking down the larger diameter neck of 338wm, your going to end up with more material. Neck turning, trimming, and wasting primers fireforming makes that 308nm brass sound better and better.
Click to expand...

Time passes, but the above is pretty accurate. I live in boonies in Manitoba, so postage / shipping always an issue for me. In May 2018, I got a set of used RCBS 308 NM dies and 50 new 308 NM Norma brass for $160.00 - I later moved on those dies for $60.00, when I came into a set of Bonanza "Bench Rest" 308 NM dies that came with a rifle. In Jun. 2018, I got 50 new 308 NM Norma brass mailed to me for $100.00. In Jan. 2019, I got 32 handloads and 20 new brass mailed to me for $100.00 - I pulled the bullets, dumped powder and primers, to salvage that 308 NM brass. In Mar. 2023 I got 50 new 308 NM Norma brass primed with Fed 215 primers for $150.00. I am not claiming to be the world's best "shopper" and not indicative, at all, about "best price" - but I ended up with those 202 x 308 NM Norma brass here.
 
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