paying for access to land

Kelly Timoffee said:
If they want to grant access that's fine, to close family or friends but in the end it if you are a nobody asking for access, take a walk.

How many times have people said , yes, sure, go ahead only to find their land and property destroyed or said "individual" is bringing their buddies to hunt this awesome spot and it is suddenly over run.

Paying is a good way to keep people responsible and the dead beats out, to a point but every little bit helps.
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I disagree. I don't think that just family and friends should be trusted nor do I think charging people for access is one bit more successful of weeding out dead beats or irresponsible people at all. While family and friends is a good start, sometimes they are not all that great of people to have around and dont pull their own weight. And certainly charging strangers can bring on a pile of other issues when you have to deal with all the crap from people who feel entitled because they have paid. Im sure everyone has heard of the horror stories between landlords and tenants. Just because people pay, doesnt mean they give a crap. I find the opposite to be true....people pay so they dont have to give a crap!

I believe that the best option for property owners to be secure with who they are granting access to is to build a relationship with the kind of people they WANT on their land and the kind of people who show gratitude by helping the landowner with things they need help with. From here, new friendships are developed often times very valuable friendships. This takes time and sometimes a lot of faith at first, but in my experience its the long term relationships between landowners and the people that they give access to that continually provides the most positive experience for all involved.

And if a landowner choses not to grant access to anyone, thats completely fine too...its their land and their choice.

I will share a funny personal story....I got a phone call recently from a landowner that I’ve built a relationship with as he needed help with some stuff. It was no big deal to go up the following day as I also wanted to prep for the pending turkey season. My sister called my mother that day and my mother happened to tell her that I had gone to the farm because the landowner called. My sisters response was, “oh thats nice, when we asked for help to paint the cottage he said he was busy”. Well that was true! But what is also true is that I have received about a dozen invites to her cottage since 1986 and each and every time it was because there was work that needed to be done. Sure family and friends should count on each other, but one doesnt have to look to hard to find people who dont understand the concept of reciprocation. My sister still hasnt discovered that we live in a world of two way streets....
 
Pay for access to hunt is illegal in Alberta, thank God! There are many places in Alberta where wildlife is over populated. If land owners charged for access it would create more complications, such as: more crop loss, road kills (injured/killed motorists), more hunting pressure on Crown Land, less hunters, hunter disputes, etc.
 
I get a laugh out of people that condemn charging/paying for access with one breath while discussing their swap labour scheme; connections, friendships of convenience and door to door begging with the next.
 
I don't believe paying cash for access is the end all be all solution for everyone.
This assumes you have disposable income. I suggest a different approach but requires time, commitment by other means.

Becoming a friend to the farmer who loses livestock to predation is often a sure fire way to gain further hunting opportunities.
When you become trusted it's not rocket science when you are invited for coffee and small talk. This is when you start to become friends.
Maybe small tasks around the farm could be yours? Are you scared of shovelling manure from the horse stable sometimes? Many farm tasks just require a will and a strong back. You don't have to be a slave but make them aware you are available for emergency tasks or when other commited farm hands have a higher priority job.
How about a quick check of thier house and barn when they are visiting family in the city??

There's a myriad of ways to become useful to farm friends. It's called building trustworthy relationships.
 
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track said:
Pay for access to hunt is illegal in Alberta, thank God! There are many places in Alberta where wildlife is over populated. If land owners charged for access it would create more complications, such as: more crop loss, road kills (injured/killed motorists), more hunting pressure on Crown Land, less hunters, hunter disputes, etc.
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It happens more than you realize. If an unscrupulous owner operator of a guiding business has deep pockets it's fairly rare this crime becomes a daily news story.
It often stays hush because the guiding business offers a cash incentive out of the blue. Versus a farmer asking all hunters for an access fee.
 
There is a place near smiths falls that charges for access for WT and turkey. At the basic rates you're sharing the land with as many as 6 other hunters!
It's not for me. I've never used them. So I'don't know the success rate.

Considering the cost of land and the cost (time and materials) for trails, stands, feed plots, mineral pits, etc... Their rates are cheap!

http://whitetails.ca/
 
Landowners appreciate being asked politely and at the end of the hunt, being thanked. It's the decent thing to do. They worry about reckless shooting, the endangerment of their animals and damage to their property. Do your best to avoid these problems and they will be happy to let you enter.
 
Dogleg said:
I get a laugh out of people that condemn charging/paying for access with one breath while discussing their swap labour scheme; connections, friendships of convenience and door to door begging with the next.
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No offense, but this is a little caustic... many working grunts or young people can't afford to pay for the right to hunt private land, so they must look at other options... suggesting that they are "begging" and "scheming" when they ask for permission is a little harsh. I respect a landowners right to charge user fees AND to decline permission when asked, as they see fit... but there are many landowners who actually welcome hunters with open arms and actually like to see the land in multi-use. The ones that are welcoming should be justifiably appreciated. Case in point a friend texted me an hour ago, he is away turkey hunting and his dad's farm is devoid of turkeys this year, an old school mate said that he could try on his small acreage, and that he should go to talk to his neighbor... the neighbor invited he and his partner in for coffee and said there were tons of turkeys and he hated the damn things and hoped they could whack a few for him as he doesn't hunt... sounds like a partnership made in heaven, no reason for anyone in that transaction to feel like they are grovelling.
 
hoytcanon said:
No offense, but this is a little caustic... many working grunts or young people can't afford to pay for the right to hunt private land, so they must look at other options... suggesting that they are "begging" and "scheming" when they ask for permission is a little harsh. I respect a landowners right to charge user fees AND to decline permission when asked, as they see fit... but there are many landowners who actually welcome hunters with open arms and actually like to see the land in multi-use. The ones that are welcoming should be justifiably appreciated. Case in point a friend texted me an hour ago, he is away turkey hunting and his dad's farm is devoid of turkeys this year, an old school mate said that he could try on his small acreage, and that he should go to talk to his neighbor... the neighbor invited he and his partner in for coffee and said there were tons of turkeys and he hated the damn things and hoped they could whack a few for him as he doesn't hunt... sounds like a partnership made in heaven, no reason for anyone in that transaction to feel like they are grovelling.
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I get a kick out of guys criticizing someone who would either charge for access or swap work for it. They're the first to squawk when the government tries to tell us when, where, and how, to use our own property (guns). As far as I'm concerned - the landowner invested the money, pays the taxes and owns the land. So he/she is damned well free to do with it whatever they want, and that includes inviting or banning hunters, ATV's, snowmobiles, target shooters, hikers, mushroom pickers, you name it.
 
Brutus said:
It happens more than you realize. If an unscrupulous owner operator of a guiding business has deep pockets it's fairly rare this crime becomes a daily news story.
It often stays hush because the guiding business offers a cash incentive out of the blue. Versus a farmer asking all hunters for an access fee.
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It probably does occur, however personally, not where I hunt. My success for permission to hunt on private land is very close to 100%. I was never asked for compensation from a landowner. Alberta and Saskatchewan landowners are the best!...............I just stay faaaaar away from any metropolis.
 
hoytcanon said:
No offense, but this is a little caustic... many working grunts or young people can't afford to pay for the right to hunt private land, so they must look at other options... suggesting that they are "begging" and "scheming" when they ask for permission is a little harsh. I respect a landowners right to charge user fees AND to decline permission when asked, as they see fit... but there are many landowners who actually welcome hunters with open arms and actually like to see the land in multi-use. The ones that are welcoming should be justifiably appreciated. Case in point a friend texted me an hour ago, he is away turkey hunting and his dad's farm is devoid of turkeys this year, an old school mate said that he could try on his small acreage, and that he should go to talk to his neighbor... the neighbor invited he and his partner in for coffee and said there were tons of turkeys and he hated the damn things and hoped they could whack a few for him as he doesn't hunt... sounds like a partnership made in heaven, no reason for anyone in that transaction to feel like they are grovelling.
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Papaclaude said:
I get a kick out of guys criticizing someone who would either charge for access or swap work for it. They're the first to squawk when the government tries to tell us when, where, and how, to use our own property (guns). As far as I'm concerned - the landowner invested the money, pays the taxes and owns the land. So he/she is damned well free to do with it whatever they want, and that includes inviting or banning hunters, ATV's, snowmobiles, target shooters, hikers, mushroom pickers, you name it.
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Agree and agree!
 
Dogleg said:
I get a laugh out of people that condemn charging/paying for access with one breath while discussing their swap labour scheme; connections, friendships of convenience and door to door begging with the next.
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Seriously. It's absurd. Like exchanging my labour for money and giving that to a landowner is fundamentally any different than giving the landowner my labour directly. It's all an exchange of value. Some people have more time than money, and some people have more money than time.

When I go to scrounge wheelweights for casting, I NEVER ask for them. I offer to buy them. I know what the local scrapyard pays, and what they sell them for. Only once has a shop ever taken my money. One jokingly asked for some deer in exchange, which I happily brought the service manager a few months later. Same with land. I offer to pay for the right to hunt it. If the price is unreasonable, too easy - "thank you sir, I'll think about it."

It's never been unreasonable. Now I live in a place where I have more crown land within a half hour than I could hunt in two lifetimes, and I kind of miss building relationships with farmers.
 
hoytcanon said:
No offense, but this is a little caustic... many working grunts or young people can't afford to pay for the right to hunt private land, so they must look at other options... suggesting that they are "begging" and "scheming" when they ask for permission is a little harsh. I respect a landowners right to charge user fees AND to decline permission when asked, as they see fit... but there are many landowners who actually welcome hunters with open arms and actually like to see the land in multi-use. The ones that are welcoming should be justifiably appreciated. Case in point a friend texted me an hour ago, he is away turkey hunting and his dad's farm is devoid of turkeys this year, an old school mate said that he could try on his small acreage, and that he should go to talk to his neighbor... the neighbor invited he and his partner in for coffee and said there were tons of turkeys and he hated the damn things and hoped they could whack a few for him as he doesn't hunt... sounds like a partnership made in heaven, no reason for anyone in that transaction to feel like they are grovelling.
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Sure, but I take his point to be speaking to the guys that condemn the very idea of paying for access as some sort of return to the feudal system. If that person didn't condemn paying for access it's not the person Dogleg is talking about.
 
flashman2 said:
Seriously. It's absurd. Like exchanging my labour for money and giving that to a landowner is fundamentally any different than giving the landowner my labour directly. It's all an exchange of value. Some people have more time than money, and some people have more money than time.

When I go to scrounge wheelweights for casting, I NEVER ask for them. I offer to buy them. I know what the local scrapyard pays, and what they sell them for. Only once has a shop ever taken my money. One jokingly asked for some deer in exchange, which I happily brought the service manager a few months later. Same with land. I offer to pay for the right to hunt it. If the price is unreasonable, too easy - "thank you sir, I'll think about it."

It's never been unreasonable. Now I live in a place where I have more crown land within a half hour than I could hunt in two lifetimes, and I kind of miss building relationships with farmers.
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Exactly. What's the difference from a moral standpoint between offering to pay or to barter? Ironically; from a legal point of view in my province they are both the same and both illegal for the purposes of hunting.
 
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