Picture of the day

[Dark Alley Dan]

Jimmy Stewart was the real deal. And Clark Gable flew as an air gunner, doubtless nailing the female half of the population of England in his spare time.

Meanwhile, where was John Wayne, the "Flying Leatherneck/Halls of Montezuma/Longest Day" celluloid war hero? Making movies, apparently:

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1055/was-john-wayne-a-draft-dodger

 

[diopter]

That's a good way to keep the Papparazzi at bay

 

[green]

For John Wayne super patriot getting killed would have really hurt his career. When Wayne appeared before the troops in the south Pacific he was soundly jeered as a draft dodger according to James Michener who was older than JW but on active duty. Dodged the draft when his country could have been defeated by major powers. JW was not nearly as charitable to the Viet Nam resisters as he was to himself. Made some good westerns though.

 

[donor]

Absurdly/amazingly low B-52 flyby of the USS Ranger… everybody would get fired for this in the 21st century.

On picture that B-52 looks a little like big RC model,in reality I'm sure it was a jaw dropper.

Soviet Tu-95s were tested on beginning of their carrier in low level strike/recon but they were deemed unsuitable for it-Tu-16 was was and still is used for it to this day.
Avro Vulcan I think was designed for just that in mind-low level sustained flight with ground mapping radar.I might be wrong since I can't find source confirming that.

 

[Sharps '63]

Another Viet Nam era draft dodger was Muhammed Ali (aka Cassius Clay). Said it was contrary to his Black Muslim faith.

The Everley Brothers and Elvis Presley served. Didn't cause any moral turmoil for them.

JWdDodged the draft when his country could have been defeated by major powers. JW was not nearly as charitable to the Viet Nam resisters as he was to himself.

 

[grelmar]

Speaking of actors...

As an actor, he made a pretty good stuntman.

 

[screwtape]

For John Wayne super patriot getting killed would have really hurt his career. When Wayne appeared before the troops in the south Pacific he was soundly jeered as a draft dodger according to James Michener who was older than JW but on active duty. Dodged the draft when his country could have been defeated by major powers. JW was not nearly as charitable to the Viet Nam resisters as he was to himself. Made some good westerns though.

To be fair to Wayne, my understanding is that he wanted to enlist but the studio intervened, on the grounds that he could better serve the country by using his status and star-power in making propaganda films and doing war bond drives and so forth. Supposedly, it was a decision that he always personally regretted:

Certainly the Wikipedia entry suggests that the issue wasn't as black and white as some here are suggesting:

America's entry into World War II resulted in a deluge of support for the war effort from all sectors of society, and Hollywood was no exception. Wayne was exempted from service due to his age (34 at the time of Pearl Harbor) and family status, classified as 3-A (family deferment). He repeatedly wrote John Ford saying he wanted to enlist, on one occasion inquiring whether he could get into Ford's military unit, but consistently kept postponing it until after "he finished just one or two pictures".[SUP][4][/SUP][SUP]:212[/SUP] Wayne did not attempt to prevent his reclassification as 1-A (draft eligible), but Republic Studios was emphatically resistant to losing him. Herbert J. Yates, President of Republic, threatened Wayne with a lawsuit if he walked away from his contract,[SUP][4][/SUP][SUP]:220[/SUP] and Republic Pictures intervened in the Selective Service process, requesting Wayne's further deferment.[SUP][4][/SUP][SUP]:213
[/SUP]
Wayne toured U.S. bases and hospitals in the South Pacific for three months in 1943 and 1944.[SUP][4][/SUP][SUP]:253[/SUP] with the USO[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][28][/SUP][SUP][29][/SUP] By many accounts, Wayne's failure to serve in the military was the most painful part of his life.[SUP][4][/SUP][SUP]:212[/SUP] His widow later suggested that his patriotism in later decades sprang from guilt, writing: "He would become a 'superpatriot' for the rest of his life trying to atone for staying home."[SUP][30]
[/SUP]
U.S. National Archives records indicate that Wayne had, in fact, made an application [SUP][31][/SUP] to serve in the OSS, that day's equivalent of the CIA, and had been accepted within the U.S. Army's allotted billet to the OSS. William Donovan, OSS Commander, wrote Wayne a letter informing him of his acceptance in to the Field Photographic Unit, but the letter went to his estranged wife Josephine's home. She never told him about it.[SUP][32][/SUP] Donovan also issued an OSS Certificate of Service to Wayne.[SUP][33]

[/SUP]

 

[vandoo66]

Another Viet Nam era draft dodger was Muhammed Ali (aka Cassius Clay). Said it was contrary to his Black Muslim faith.

The Everley Brothers and Elvis Presley served. Didn't cause any moral turmoil for them.

Well in all fairness, when have you ever seen a Muslim use a firearm in anger???

 

[bearhunter]

Bob Hope never joined a branch of the US armed forces either. He always talked about how much he admired those who did and I believe he did almost 50 USO tours. I went to a show in LA that he put on while the Viet Nam War was on. It would be his last show for a public audience for a couple of years. He had requested to be part of the USO program going on at the time and donated a lot of his time along with others for impromptu shows on out of the way bases while on those tours. He never once refused to do a USO tour and his goal was to do at least 50. Poor health and old age finally caught up with him before that happened.

I don't have to tell anyone here the battleground is only one of the ways wars are fought. Some people just have better uses at the time to be more productive to the overall effort.

 

[Cold Warrior]

Another Viet Nam era draft dodger was Muhammed Ali (aka Cassius Clay). Said it was contrary to his Black Muslim faith.
The Everley Brothers and Elvis Presley served. Didn't cause any moral turmoil for them.

Why did you mention Ali? He's not a movie actor, and he was not a "draft dodger". He didn't 'dodge' anything-- he refused to participate in 'the white man's war against the yellow man' and willingly accepted a prison sentence because of his moral beliefs. I might not agree with him, but I respect his courageous decision.
Let's leave politics out of this thread and just enjoy the pictures, as I'm sure the OP intended.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Muhammad_Ali_NYWTS.jpg/330px-Muhammad_Ali_NYWTS.jpg


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Ali

 

[Silfield]

James Stewart and Walter Matthau both served at USAF Old Buckenham which is still going as an airfield, my wife did a few freefall jumps from there and I just booked my dad a flight in a Boeing Stearman which fly's from there. Its an interesting place (any only a couple of miles from my home!)
http://www.oldbuck.com/en/home/

 

[Dark Alley Dan]

So who else went?

Mel Brooks!

Mel Brooks is best known as the writer-director behind the laugh-a-minute comedies “Young Frankenstein,” “Blazing Saddles” and “Spaceballs.” But along with writing killer one-liners, he is also an old hand at defusing German mines. Born Melvin Kaminsky in Brooklyn, New York, Brooks enlisted in the army in 1944 at the age of 17. He later served in 1104th Engineer Combat Battalion, a unit that braved sniper fire and shelling to build bridges, clear blocked roads and deactivate landmines ahead of advancing Allied forces. Ever the comedian, Brooks once used a bullhorn to serenade nearby enemy troops along the German-French border with the Al Jolson song “Toot, Toot, Tootsie”—and received a round of applause in return.

 

[Cocked&Locked]

On picture that B-52 looks a little like big RC model,in reality I'm sure it was a jaw dropper.

Soviet Tu-95s were tested on beginning of their carrier in low level strike/recon but they were deemed unsuitable for it-Tu-16 was was and still is used for it to this day.
Avro Vulcan I think was designed for just that in mind-low level sustained flight with ground mapping radar.I might be wrong since I can't find source confirming that.

I'm pretty sure that the pilot and co pilot's arse holes where chewing knobs of foam out of their seat cushions and that they were a bit lower then they really intended!

Vulcan was originally designed as a high altitude level bomber, but when it was realized that with the speed of fighter and missile development it's survivability would be zero it was switched to a low level mission. where it's survivability was slightly more then zero. It was the only one of the three british bombers able to make the transition, and even so it experienced accelerated air frame fatigue because of it.

 

[propliner]

I'm pretty sure that the pilot and co pilot's arse holes where chewing knobs of foam out of their seat cushions and that they were a bit lower then they really intended.

Flying 15-20 feet above the ocean is a blast in a big, stable airplane. We used to do it for hours above the Arctic Ocean. Why? Because it was fun! The sensation of speed was very cool. Sometimes it felt like the props were almost touching the water, and they probably almost were. There was no real pucker factor.

 

[Sharps '63]

Keep politics out of war? It is to laugh .....

Ali may not have been an actor per se, but as a celebrity, he did a lot of publicity "play acting" to promote himself.

A lot of poor blacks served in Viet Nam, "fighting the whiteman's war against the yellow man." Ali made a living out of pummeling other men into submission - white and black.
A better protest would have been to run to Canada or Sweden instead of having his high priced lawyers keep him out of jail.

Why did you mention Ali? He's not a movie actor, and he was not a "draft dodger". He didn't 'dodge' anything-- he refused to participate in 'the white man's war against the yellow man' and willingly accepted a prison sentence because of his moral beliefs. I might not agree with him, but I respect his courageous decision.
Let's leave politics out of this thread and just enjoy the pictures, as I'm sure the OP intended.QUOTE]

 

[Gibbs505]

Keep politics out of war? It is to laugh .....

Ali may not have been an actor per se, but as a celebrity, he did a lot of publicity "play acting" to promote himself.

A lot of poor blacks served in Viet Nam, "fighting the whiteman's war against the yellow man." Ali made a living out of pummeling other men into submission - white and black.
A better protest would have been to run to Canada or Sweden instead of having his high priced lawyers keep him out of jail.

Why did you mention Ali? He's not a movie actor, and he was not a "draft dodger". He didn't 'dodge' anything-- he refused to participate in 'the white man's war against the yellow man' and willingly accepted a prison sentence because of his moral beliefs. I might not agree with him, but I respect his courageous decision.
Let's leave politics out of this thread and just enjoy the pictures, as I'm sure the OP intended.

Yes a lot of blacks did. However the truth is more complex. Here are the stats:

RACE AND ETHNIC BACKGROUND...
•88.4% of the men who actually served in Vietnam were Caucasian; 10.6% (275,000) were black; 1% belonged to other races.
•86.3% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasian (includes Hispanics); 12.5% (7,241) were black; 1.2% belonged to other races.
•170,000 Hispanics served in Vietnam; 3,070 (5.2% of total) died there.
•70% of enlisted men killed were of North-west European descent.
•86.8% of the men who were killed as a result of hostile action were Caucasian; 12.1% (5,711) were black; 1.1% belonged to other races.
•14.6% (1,530) of non-combat deaths were among blacks.
•34% of blacks who enlisted volunteered for the combat arms.
•Overall, blacks suffered 12.5% of the deaths in Vietnam at a time when the percentage of blacks of military age was 13.5% of the total population.
•Religion of Dead: Protestant -- 64.4%; Catholic -- 28.9%; other/none -- 6.7%

Also interesting ....

SOCIO-ECONOMIC STATUS...
•76% of the men sent to Vietnam were from lower middle/working class backgrounds.
•Thee-fourths had family incomes above the poverty level; 50% were from middle income backgrounds.
•Some 23% of Vietnam vets had fathers with professional, managerial or technical occupations.
•79% of the men who served in Vietnam had a high school education or better when they entered the military service. (63% of Korean War vets and only 45% of WWII vets had completed high school upon separation.)
•Deaths by region per 100,000 of pupulation: South -- 31%, West -- 29.9%; Midwest -- 28.4%; Northeast -- 23.5%.

Source
http://history-world.org/vietnam_war_statistics.htm

 

[camster]

ground effect fun

 

[shredder]

For John Wayne super patriot getting killed would have really hurt his career. When Wayne appeared before the troops in the south Pacific he was soundly jeered as a draft dodger according to James Michener who was older than JW but on active duty. Dodged the draft when his country could have been defeated by major powers. JW was not nearly as charitable to the Viet Nam resisters as he was to himself. Made some good westerns though.

As I understand it, he DID attempt to enlist, but was deemed a) too old - 34 at the time of the attack on Pearl Harbor, and b) his studio managed to have him declared as "working in a war-related industry" (the film industry was declared war-related, no doubt due to the need to make-remake training films and pictures to boost morale on the home front). Much like shipbuilding and the aircraft industries, those who worked in the film industry were not draft-eligible. They COULD volunteer if they wished, but the draft boards wouldn't draft them.

 

[grelmar]

ground effect fun

The Soviets built a 500 ton cargo plane to take advantage of the ground effect... Interesting physics involved.

 

[fraserdw]

As I understand it, he DID attempt to enlist, but was deemed a) too old - 34 at the time of the attack on Pearl Harbor, and b) his studio managed to have him declared as "working in a war-related industry" (the film industry was declared war-related, no doubt due to the need to make-remake training films and pictures to boost morale on the home front). Much like shipbuilding and the aircraft industries, those who worked in the film industry were not draft-eligible. They COULD volunteer if they wished, but the draft boards wouldn't draft them.

You didn't read any of the discussion, did you?