Dark Alley Dan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Darkest Edmonton
100% agreed. A well-stocked library is a great comfort. 
Picture of the day
- Thread starter jwhc
- Start date
Dark Alley Dan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Darkest Edmonton
Been a couple of days.
Here's an A20 being "serviced" - more likely a bunch of lads drafted into modelling for the war effort, but still a nice shot:
"Yep, that's a propellor alright. You boys figured out if that's the crew hatch up front there yet? Is it on good and tight?"
Here's an A20 being "serviced" - more likely a bunch of lads drafted into modelling for the war effort, but still a nice shot:
"Yep, that's a propellor alright. You boys figured out if that's the crew hatch up front there yet? Is it on good and tight?"
Sporting Lad
Regular
- Location
- Vancouver Island
Amateur Models:
Oh yeah, the Public Information Officer has a pool of these guys 'on call' at HQ.
"OK guys, now pose around that bomber plane and look like you know what you're doing."
When they're not posing and acting like jackasses they sing in the Regimental Glee Club.
At least it kept them from seeing any real combat.
That must supposed to be the pilot in the helmet and shiny brown shoes:
"Ughh!... She just won't turn over this morning. Hey, somebody go retard the spark or something!"
Oh yeah, the Public Information Officer has a pool of these guys 'on call' at HQ.
"OK guys, now pose around that bomber plane and look like you know what you're doing."
When they're not posing and acting like jackasses they sing in the Regimental Glee Club.
At least it kept them from seeing any real combat.
That must supposed to be the pilot in the helmet and shiny brown shoes:
"Ughh!... She just won't turn over this morning. Hey, somebody go retard the spark or something!"
9X25 Mauser was also called the 9mm Mauser Export.
Think of a 7.63 Mauser cartridge opened up to a straight case, 128-grain slug and loaded to the nuts. That's it.
I have a GECO round here headstamped "GECO 9m/mM". It came in with a batch of 9mm Steyr ammo which came out of Chile after the old Steyrs did their last job of shooting all the Communists. I would assume from that cartridge that some of the SMGs or possibly commercial Mauser pistols chambered for the Export cartridge must have gone to Chile between the Wars.
Frank C. Barnes chronographed original rounds and put the results in COTW-6. He gives the MV as 1362 ft/sec with original DWM ammo, no indication as to barrel length although likely 5 inches, for 534 ft/lbs ME, beating out the legendary .45 Auto by 130 ft/lbs ME: a clear 32% advantage to the Mauser.
Coming out of a long barrel in a Kiraly-system SMG, velocity would be much higher and it would have been an effective 200-metre round.
Think of a 7.63 Mauser cartridge opened up to a straight case, 128-grain slug and loaded to the nuts. That's it.
I have a GECO round here headstamped "GECO 9m/mM". It came in with a batch of 9mm Steyr ammo which came out of Chile after the old Steyrs did their last job of shooting all the Communists. I would assume from that cartridge that some of the SMGs or possibly commercial Mauser pistols chambered for the Export cartridge must have gone to Chile between the Wars.
Frank C. Barnes chronographed original rounds and put the results in COTW-6. He gives the MV as 1362 ft/sec with original DWM ammo, no indication as to barrel length although likely 5 inches, for 534 ft/lbs ME, beating out the legendary .45 Auto by 130 ft/lbs ME: a clear 32% advantage to the Mauser.
Coming out of a long barrel in a Kiraly-system SMG, velocity would be much higher and it would have been an effective 200-metre round.
Sporting Lad
Regular
- Location
- Vancouver Island
Nope, he was just non-sequituring back to Dark Alley Dan's Hungarian SMG from a few posts back.
(ok, you can't verb "non-sequitur", but it's Saturday, and I hope the grammar nazis are sleeping in).
Dark Alley Dan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Darkest Edmonton
I'm enjoying this thread. Lots to learn, even for a guy pushing 50...
The Swiss Guard at the Vatican apparently used SIG SMGs chambered in 9x25. Here they are in the rack at bottom:
Neat piece of kit. The SIG MKPO. Pre-war design, folding mag well for easier storage. And they still have a few, just in case.
No pics of the SG carrying them around, but I did find this pic of them in 1943 with some very nice G98s:
And getting visited by some of Adolf's friendly peacekeepers:
Buddy looks like a militant art student. All he needs is a Dali moustache...
And for your general interest, here's a blog post from a seminarian who toured the armoury. Plenty of cool stuff in there. I'd like to see that myself someday, but I'm not Swiss, and not nearly Catholic enough to join the Priesthood.
http://tjpfm.########.ca/2009/09/nac-orientation-part-vi-swiss-guard.html
And a very nice overview of the armoury from a fellow gunnut:
http://www.guns.com/2014/04/13/guns-swiss-guard/
The Swiss Guard at the Vatican apparently used SIG SMGs chambered in 9x25. Here they are in the rack at bottom:
Neat piece of kit. The SIG MKPO. Pre-war design, folding mag well for easier storage. And they still have a few, just in case.
No pics of the SG carrying them around, but I did find this pic of them in 1943 with some very nice G98s:
And getting visited by some of Adolf's friendly peacekeepers:
Buddy looks like a militant art student. All he needs is a Dali moustache...
And for your general interest, here's a blog post from a seminarian who toured the armoury. Plenty of cool stuff in there. I'd like to see that myself someday, but I'm not Swiss, and not nearly Catholic enough to join the Priesthood.
http://tjpfm.########.ca/2009/09/nac-orientation-part-vi-swiss-guard.html
And a very nice overview of the armoury from a fellow gunnut:
http://www.guns.com/2014/04/13/guns-swiss-guard/
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Dark Alley Dan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Darkest Edmonton
New day, new pic, new hemisphere:
The happy lads of the IJA in China, 1939, bringing joy and happiness to the local hillbillies via the gentle harmonious effects of the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. Also on tap: gunfire, excessive violence, and a level of rape and pillage not seen in the neighbourhood since the excesses of Jengis Khan, back in the day.
Name that rifle being hauled by Happy lad #3... And I assume those are BREN guns, but somehow reckon I'm wrong. When did we send the Chinese folks the Long Branch guns? Were they already in service in China by 1939, waiting to be captured by the Japanese?
The happy lads of the IJA in China, 1939, bringing joy and happiness to the local hillbillies via the gentle harmonious effects of the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. Also on tap: gunfire, excessive violence, and a level of rape and pillage not seen in the neighbourhood since the excesses of Jengis Khan, back in the day.
Name that rifle being hauled by Happy lad #3... And I assume those are BREN guns, but somehow reckon I'm wrong. When did we send the Chinese folks the Long Branch guns? Were they already in service in China by 1939, waiting to be captured by the Japanese?
Sporting Lad
Regular
- Location
- Vancouver Island
I'm enjoying this thread. Lots to learn, even for a guy pushing 50...
...And getting visited by some of Adolf's friendly peacekeepers:
Buddy looks like a militant art student. All he needs is a Dali moustache...
]
Haha, yeah. I thought they wore those Conquistador style helmets, not berets!
Maybe he'd heard it was 'Dress like a Frenchman Day'."
("Dang! That was yesterday! Today it must be 'Dress like a German Day'!!""
New day, new pic, new hemisphere:
The happy lads of the IJA in China, 1939, bringing joy and happiness to the local hillbillies via the gentle harmonious effects of the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. Also on tap: gunfire, excessive violence, and a level of rape and pillage not seen in the neighbourhood since the excesses of Jengis Khan, back in the day.
Name that rifle being hauled by Happy lad #3... And I assume those are BREN guns, but somehow reckon I'm wrong. When did we send the Chinese folks the Long Branch guns? Were they already in service in China by 1939, waiting to be captured by the Japanese?
Rifle #3 is the FN Mle 1930, a Belgian modification of the M1918 BAR, which was supplied to China in the 1930s. The others aren't BRENs. They are Czech ZB vz 26s, the progenitor of the BREN. The Czechs also supplied these to the Chinese in the 1930s. Canadian made BRENs in 8x57mm were not shipped to the Chinese until later in WW2. The Nationalist Chinese got a huge amount or foreign ordnance incl large quantities of Inglis BRENs, Thompson SMGs, M1903 Springfields and M1917 Enfields. A lot of it was captured by the Chicoms and later turned our way in Korea.
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Dark Alley Dan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Darkest Edmonton
I've never held an M3 grease gun, but the damn thing looks like quite the "sheet metal wonder". The shot of the guy inserting the mag shows a mag well edge that looks sharp and/or unfinished. I get that they had to replace the labour-intensive-to-build, forged-steel-and-walnut, 900-pound Thompson with something a little more 20th century, but they certainly aren't a pretty thing, nor terribly inspiring to look at. Yes, they work, but lovely they ain't.
A catalogue of sharp edges and scratching, unpleasant bits.
Purple, thanks for the heads-up on the Japanese pic. Good stuff to know!
A catalogue of sharp edges and scratching, unpleasant bits.
Purple, thanks for the heads-up on the Japanese pic. Good stuff to know!
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I got to shoot an M3 "Grease Gun" even before I joined the Army. One of the WW2 vets in our neck of the woods had somehow brought one back from overseas. The barrel could be readily removed and the rest of it was quite compact with the telescoping stock. This one had been made on contract by the Guide Lamp Division of General Motors and he called it a Guide. It was fun to shoot, and in spite of the stamped construction, I though that it compared favourably with the C1 SMGs that we used in the Army. I sometimes wonder what happened to that gun. The original owner moved away and then passed on many yrs ago. No doubt it got buried or tossed into a slough at some point in time.
I really used to enjoy shooting the SMG. One of my old NCOs in the Armoured Corps showed me how to shoot it instinctively from the waist. You just centered it in the pit of the stomach and then corrected the aim by watching the impact of the rds on target.
I really used to enjoy shooting the SMG. One of my old NCOs in the Armoured Corps showed me how to shoot it instinctively from the waist. You just centered it in the pit of the stomach and then corrected the aim by watching the impact of the rds on target.
Sporting Lad
Regular
- Location
- Vancouver Island
I had one too...It was DEADLY!
I had an M-3 'grease gun' when I was in Armored A.I.T. at Ft. Knox. It was far and away the crudest POS I've ever had the misfortune of handling.
Our instructors kept on telling us how crudely made the AKs were, but we never actually examined one until years later. HAH! The AK looked like it had been made by a watchmaker next to the greasy gun! The trigger on mine was nearly an inch wide. The entire unit might've been manufactured in a kids' cap-gun factory--just larger scale stampings. What's worse-- the example I had was as likely to run away and empty all 30 rounds when I tried to
squeeze off a single semi-auto shot. NCO didn't believe me until next time at the range when I held it by the mag, touched the trigger, then held my right hand aloft while the gun went merrily 'tut-tut-tutting' 30 times. Then he caught on to what I'd been complaining about. The whole time he was screaming,
"KEEP THAT THING POINTED DOWN RANGE!!!!!!!!!"
Ha-ha! Good times. (8;^]
I had an M-3 'grease gun' when I was in Armored A.I.T. at Ft. Knox. It was far and away the crudest POS I've ever had the misfortune of handling.
Our instructors kept on telling us how crudely made the AKs were, but we never actually examined one until years later. HAH! The AK looked like it had been made by a watchmaker next to the greasy gun! The trigger on mine was nearly an inch wide. The entire unit might've been manufactured in a kids' cap-gun factory--just larger scale stampings. What's worse-- the example I had was as likely to run away and empty all 30 rounds when I tried to
squeeze off a single semi-auto shot. NCO didn't believe me until next time at the range when I held it by the mag, touched the trigger, then held my right hand aloft while the gun went merrily 'tut-tut-tutting' 30 times. Then he caught on to what I'd been complaining about. The whole time he was screaming,
"KEEP THAT THING POINTED DOWN RANGE!!!!!!!!!"
Ha-ha! Good times. (8;^]
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We got pushups or, worse, if we touched the mag on ours, perhaps for the reason you demonstrated to your NCO.
Sporting Lad
Regular
- Location
- Vancouver Island
Could be...
I dunno, I fired it exactly the way the movie star in the training film was firing it, except that I never stuck the mag into the dirt like he done. We always fired standing up.
I believe my gun was defective/worn out. Maybe your NCO just enjoyed being a prick.
I dunno, I fired it exactly the way the movie star in the training film was firing it, except that I never stuck the mag into the dirt like he done. We always fired standing up.
I believe my gun was defective/worn out. Maybe your NCO just enjoyed being a prick.
Dark Alley Dan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Darkest Edmonton
Maybe it was this guy:
Speaking of using rough-hewn subguns under a degree of external stress, here's an evocative pic:
October 42, apparently. The beginning of the end of the "good days" for Uncle Adolph's Happy Lads. The available evidence indicates that the PPSh was a fave amoungst the landsers. Everything I've read about them tells me they make a Cooey .22 look the very height of sophistication and refinement. But they worked, and worked, and worked, no matter what, and I guess that's what you're looking for. "Pride of ownership" is for after the war.
Speaking of using rough-hewn subguns under a degree of external stress, here's an evocative pic:
October 42, apparently. The beginning of the end of the "good days" for Uncle Adolph's Happy Lads. The available evidence indicates that the PPSh was a fave amoungst the landsers. Everything I've read about them tells me they make a Cooey .22 look the very height of sophistication and refinement. But they worked, and worked, and worked, no matter what, and I guess that's what you're looking for. "Pride of ownership" is for after the war.
