Nice picture . 9MM Schmeisser if I'm not mistaken .
Policy of carrying enemy small arms in Canadian Army,
- Thread starter x westie
- Start date
Nice picture . 9MM Schmeisser if I'm not mistaken .
stg 44
I forgot to mention, one German weapon that was in high demand and they picked up at every opportunity were "PANZERFAUSTS." They were just to handy as well as effective.
In my Uncle's words "EVEN THE MOST STUPID TROOPER COULD USE ONE TO GOOD EFFECT"
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In my Uncle's words "EVEN THE MOST STUPID TROOPER COULD USE ONE TO GOOD EFFECT"
TURF THE LIBERALS IN 2019
Liberals really like POOR people, they're making more of them every day
If you can't vote CPC, stay at home in protest
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Tell me some of your military service now.....
Like how some of the guys would try to use Canadian Tire money in the bars. Those Cypriots were wise to that one though.
We used to have a donation box for a girl's orphanage that we supported in Jerusalem and would find that some of the big spenders would drop in C Tire money when they were feeling flush.
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Like how some of the guys would try to use Canadian Tire money in the bars. Those Cypriots were wise to that one though.
Purple. Thank God you are around to introduce some levity I can relate to.
Peace brother.
Edit: One of my biggest regrets serving over there is not going to tour an orphanage our section commander organized, somewhere just outside Nicosia?Lefkosa?
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Long ago and far away there was a mobile brothel on the coast highway around Netanya run by some enterprising Israeli girls. They were set up in trailers on a hill to catch the passing UN traffic, and apparently did a bang up business. Unsurprisingly, it was known as 'BJ Hill'. Never heard if anybody tried C Tire money there; those gals would have insisted on USD all the way.
Unsurprisingly, it was known as 'BJ Hill'. Never heard if anybody tried C Tire money there; those gals would have insisted on USD all the way.Dude, that's pathetic and lame. Whether one had service or not is irrelevant to knowing the history. Indeed I knew less about some actions I was involved in than historians did later when they could put together the overall picture and had the benefit of hindsight. Fog of war and all that... the guy on the ground usually has a limited and narrow perspective and tends to be an unreliable narrator. I guess the difference is I understand and accept that and don't think my having been in a particular battle gives me any degree of authority in speaking to what happened outside my own limited arcs.
Unfortunately my tours didn't have brothels and bars, just lots of fire fights and IEDs. On one of my tours we had almost as many KIA as during the 30 years of deploying battalions to Cyprus.
But absolutely none of that is relevant to the issue. None of it.
Long ago and far away there was a mobile brothel on the coast highway around Netanya run by some enterprising Israeli girls. They were set up in trailers on a hill to catch the passing UN traffic, and apparently did a bang up business.
They're all Romanian and Russian now, and they definitely know more about international finance than all of us put together.
Dude...Erma man. It was often erroneously called "Schmeisser" by the Allies, although Hugo Schmeisser was not involved in the design or production of the weapon
I like Sgt Rock comics too, but please...it's Milsurp. Get it right, k?
To answer the original question, from all the first hand accounts I've heard and the first hand experience I've had, the answer is, like anything, "it depends."
In the Army, what you can get away with is directly proportional to the size of the team you're operating in and how close to the flagpole you are. Small groups away from much oversight can more or less do as they please. Different units and formations would have different or no instructions regarding captured enemy weapons or foreign friendly weapons. Today, it's technically it's prohibited under modern DAODs, much like wearing non issue kit , etc... technically prohibited yet often ignored. I'n sure there was an equivalent order in the WW2 and Korean war eras. There's also the matter of expediency, where you could rely on a captured weapon for a few days or weeks and then be supplied with another issue one. I know WW2 and Korea vets that used enemy weapons for significant periods, and guys that just stuffed a Luger in their pack to bring home. The real answer is that there's no hard and fast answer.
In the modern era, again it depends. I carried a VZ58 and PM md 63 once or twice for kicks, but didn't make a habit of it. It wasn't an issue nor of any particular interest to anyone.
In the Army, what you can get away with is directly proportional to the size of the team you're operating in and how close to the flagpole you are. Small groups away from much oversight can more or less do as they please. Different units and formations would have different or no instructions regarding captured enemy weapons or foreign friendly weapons. Today, it's technically it's prohibited under modern DAODs, much like wearing non issue kit , etc... technically prohibited yet often ignored. I'n sure there was an equivalent order in the WW2 and Korean war eras. There's also the matter of expediency, where you could rely on a captured weapon for a few days or weeks and then be supplied with another issue one. I know WW2 and Korea vets that used enemy weapons for significant periods, and guys that just stuffed a Luger in their pack to bring home. The real answer is that there's no hard and fast answer.
In the modern era, again it depends. I carried a VZ58 and PM md 63 once or twice for kicks, but didn't make a habit of it. It wasn't an issue nor of any particular interest to anyone.
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Not only were captured weapons used, but captured vehicles too. Sometimes both together, like with that Schwimmwagen that has allied markings painted on and buddy toting a G43.
I have a pic somewhere of an armoured recce crew with a few MP40s also but I can't find it.
I have a pic somewhere of an armoured recce crew with a few MP40s also but I can't find it.
interesting point - I was told by a man who had served in the LRDG that during an operation in Italy he had to contact a ‘partisan’ who promptly turned him into the local Italian military for a reward ... when the Italians picked him up they told him that they in turn had informed the German authorities ( as required to do) of his capture and the Germans were on the way to pick him up and by the way — was he aware of the recent German order that any allied soldier captured with a ‘long knife’ (the F&S ) was to be considered a spy and shot? He got away as you probably surmised - which is another story.
My father served through Sicily and Italy etc and landed at Pachino armed with a thompson. I wasnt aware of this until I read a publication about this ... but had wondered where the 45acp rounds came from I would occasionally find in his effects. So they were in the system and Canadians armed with thompsons are illustrated in Charles Comforts painting ‘Hitler Line’.
It is also quite correct that ‘losing’ your issued weapon (or any other serialized item) was not a smart idea and could result in a significnt pay deduction (and other punishment as determined) - a thompson smg was (according to my father) an expensive item of equipment relative to a soldiers pay so it wasnt considered a trivial issue. While my father was RQ there were times when ‘fighting patrols’ were the recorded justification for equipment that was the. written off due to being ‘lost in action’ .
He brought a number of pistols back home after serving in NW Europe and occupation and all were registered with the RCMP - p38, several lugers, Enfields ... As a kid I was fascinated with the ‘Broomhandle’ C96 and asked why he didnt t have one. He mentioned he had one in Italy but left it in a desk drawer ‘for the next guy’ - he wasnt impressed with it he said. Several of the pistols he kept werent acquired in Italy but I believe primarily came from the enormous German stores captured in Holland; while they were disarming the Germans there. He said an old friend had encouraged him to ‘pick up a few’ because thats what most guys were doing with the view they would fetch a few dollars when they got home - father said there were many sheds packed to the roofs with pistols. As an aside - in Holland - he said they used the huge stocks of German helmets to create road beds for the vehicles by crushing them into the ground with tanks.
As for use of US weapons by Canadian troops - IIRC there are scenes/footage taken at Ortona where at least one Canadian soldier appears to have a M1 Carbine. And fwiw another officer in my old Regiment who served in France and Holland was quite specific that they much preferred US BAR’s to the BREN and grabbed them whenever they could; I dont want to get into a debate about what was better as I dont know - but he apparently did and members of the company he commanded had a strong preference for the BAR.
Based on what I have in my possession the preference for captured enemy equipment included German binoculars (the big night optics) compasses and the small infantry and artillery periscopes. Other (unusual) items acquired were a few small Olivetti portable typewriters (invaluable in HQ Coy) and a few field radios that permitted listening to non military radio brodcasts ... oh yes - while on occupation acquisitions included a zeiss ikonta and a few instruments (barograph and chronometers) that the kreigsmarine had no further use for. And a whole lot of other miscellany including an escape and evasion kit he had been issued early in the war and from which the gold went ‘missing in action’ — according to a rumour that gold may have been recovered in equal amounts by the members of the platoon he commanded when they landed in Brest
For what its worth those are the details as I know it from what my father, and other who were there, told me.
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The Thompson was officially adopted by both Canada and Britain. We used them in combat in WW2 before the Americans did, at Hong Kong.
Additionally, US tanks supplied to the allies came kitted out with crew weapons and MGs, ie Thompsons and 1919s.
I had the pleasure of touring through Italy with the dusty looking gent in the pic below. He carried a Thompson throughout the war. Didn't much care for it. The other pic is of him with his new Italian girlfriend.
LdSH(RC) Stuarts with 1919s
Not Canadian, but in WWII, the US 83rd were specifically ordered to use whatever they could grab with a running drivetrain to keep up with the fast moving armoured divisions. They earned the nickname "The Ragtag Circus" because they got very good at keeping a wide assortment of captured and pilfered vehicles on the road.
