Poll for the Ruger no. 1 .303

[Gatehouse]

I can run factory data or hand loads for practicly any powder , barrel length, cartridge, etc.
26" of barrel on a No.1 still makes for a very short rifle when compared to a bolt action!
Cat

What is the difference between a .308 w/ 22"/24"/26" barrel?

Assuming one coudl load the .303 to nip at the heels of the .308 in this stronger action, maybe we will see what sort of velocity gain can be expected.

 

[popcan]

A lot of the voters might think the same as me ... I originally voted for the medium sporter, but if we are going to move to a shorter bbl, then I'd completely switch and go with the RSI.

I'm warming up to the idea, actually!

 

[rem338win]

That's my take on it as well cat, 26" may seem long, and worries a lot of guys. But you have to consider the single action still makes for a handy little rifle

But an even handier package is available. And 20oz is a huge difference when it comes down to hunting with it.
If we where discussing a 300 H&H or a 358 Norma I would be all for the 1S.

The vote in round figures.

RSI - 27%
1A - 21%
1S - 31%

Time to redo the poll or compromise with the 1A rifle?
I do like the longer 24" barrel. As already said, easy to have the barrel cut shorter if you want.

Ok, and then have you considered the expense of having the front site removed and replaced? No thanks, I would rather keep the $300 and use it on the 4x Leupold I plan on putting on my rifle.

 

[1899]

Like I said, I am on the fence with this one, but I've already chosen a scope for the RSI - Leupold 2.5x for me.

 

[Amphibious]

I want to be able to pick up my No1 303B and not feel like I'm holding one chambered in 300 Mag

1A or RSI in that order

exactly.

 

[1899]

Well I found a very interesting test from South Africa. The loads were tested in 3 Lee Enfield rifles - the barrel lengths were 24.5"; 19" and 14".

Here are some results:

215gr Woodleigh - 35.0gr of S335
24.5" - 2077 fps
19" - 1995fps
14" - 1968fps

150gr Hornady - 40.0gr of S335
24.5" - 2600fps
19" - 2502fps
14" - 2380fps

180gr Sierra - 37.0gr of S335
24.5" - 2277fps
19" - 2306fps
14" - 2228fps

174gr Hornady - 38.0gr of S335
24.5" - 2379fps
19" - 2263fps
14" - 2203fps

215gr Rhino - 34.0gr of S335
24.5" - 1998fps
19" - 2011fps
14" - 1956fps

As can be seen from the data we were in for a few surprises. The velocity of both monolithics (GS custom and Rhino) was higher in the 19-inch barrel than in the long barrel, probably because the 19-inch barrel is new. As for the 180 gr. Sierra all I can think of is a big bearing surface that produced higher pressures in the tighter new barrel

So some of the loads gave higher velocity in the 19" barrel than in the 24.5" barrel.

Barrel length has been discussed ‘ad nauseum’ for centuries. With the advent of black powder, which is, compared with modern propellant, quite slow burning. To get the most out of a black powder rifle, a long barrel ensured that all the powder burned while the bullet was still in the barrel, using all its energy to propel the bullet out the barrel. A long barrel also increased the sight radius, the distance between back and front sight. Very important when not using a telescopic sight. Modern nitrocellulose propellants have changed all that. Very fast burning propellant like that used for shotguns burn completely in about 12 inches of the barrel. The magnum propellant used in the big case magnums need to be slower burning, because in many instances the case is over bore capacity; meaning a big case necked down to a small caliber bullet.

To conclude our findings; A short rifle gives u the advantage of being lighter, handles easier and the deference in velocity is negligible

The full article:

http://www.bateleurarms.com/Pigs,%20Babes%20and%20short%20barrels.htm

 

[Slugo]

RSI by FAR holds the most appeal to me.

 

[pharaoh2]

I have to be honest, the full length stock is nice but it's not really my cup of tea. What about a compromise? Since this is going to be a one off build, why not just request a 24 inch barrel?

 

[SuperCub]

What about a compromise? Since this is going to be a one off build, why not just request a 24 inch barrel?

A 1-A with 24" bbl would do it for me.



.

 

[StoneHorse]

Well I found a very interesting test from South Africa. The loads were tested in 3 Lee Enfield rifles - the barrel lengths were 24.5"; 19" and 14".

Any mention of muzzle blast between the 14" and 24.5" barrel?
Oh, thanks for posting the data.

 

[deadman]

can't speak for anybody else, but for me, the longer barrel would be strictly a nostalgia thing, more for the rifle's aesthetic than anything else, which is sort of what i understood the reason for this run of .303 rifles to be.

that being said, maybe i should just go buy one of the ruger's that is already built with a longer barrel, because it sounds like the majority want a shorter rifle. i like all the different configurations of the ruger single shot, for different reasons.

i'm not going to cancel my order if its not exactly the same as i've been dreaming of, partly because i want to be a part of making this happen(i've ordered four), and its going to be a fun gun regardless of which model gets chosen.

personally, i couldn't care less about 100 fps or 500 fps, 7 lbs or 8 lbs. if weight saving is what you are concerned about, buy the lightest rifle. if speed is what you are concerned about, buy the fastest rifle.

if you want to see a canadian commemorative ruger, stop whining about cancelling your order if its not exactly what you want. everybody has to get behind this to make it happen.

the poll was supposed to be strictly for everyone's interest, and i definitely am not an authority, or an organizer of this venture.

 

[StoneHorse]

But an even handier package is available. And 20oz is a huge difference when it comes down to hunting with it.
If we where discussing a 300 H&H or a 358 Norma I would be all for the 1S.



Ok, and then have you considered the expense of having the front site removed and replaced? No thanks, I would rather keep the $300 and use it on the 4x Leupold I plan on putting on my rifle.

If the 1S has a 24" barrel, I don't need to consider anything more, done deal .
The 1A with a 22" barrel would be a very close second .
The RSI a distant third .

After a second look at deadman's post (#131), I have to agree.

 

[1899]

Any mention of muzzle blast between the 14" and 24.5" barrel?
Oh, thanks for posting the data.

Going from 24" to 19" on the same rifle:

Muzzle blast was hardly different and the well-designed stock made the slight increase in recoil trivial.

No mention of the blast from the 14"er because:

This MkIII is fitted with a new barrel, chopped to 14 inches and threaded to accept a suppressor. This gun is used mainly for game cropping near water holes and predator control near areas where regular gunshots would cause too much disturbance.

Would it be that bad for us to have suppressors too?

 

[StoneHorse]

Thanks 1899. That is what I wanted to know.

"Would it be that bad for us to have suppressors too?"

That would be another story.

 

[Northern Boater]

can't speak for anybody else, but for me, the longer barrel would be strictly a nostalgia thing, more for the rifle's aesthetic than anything else, which is sort of what i understood the reason for this run of .303 rifles to be.

that being said, maybe i should just go buy one of the ruger's that is already built with a longer barrel, because it sounds like the majority want a shorter rifle. i like all the different configurations of the ruger single shot, for different reasons.

i'm not going to cancel my order if its not exactly the same as i've been dreaming of, partly because i want to be a part of making this happen(i've ordered four), and its going to be a fun gun regardless of which model gets chosen.

personally, i couldn't care less about 100 fps or 500 fps, 7 lbs or 8 lbs. if weight saving is what you are concerned about, buy the lightest rifle. if speed is what you are concerned about, buy the fastest rifle.

if you want to see a canadian commemorative ruger, stop whining about cancelling your order if its not exactly what you want. everybody has to get behind this to make it happen.

the poll was supposed to be strictly for everyone's interest, and i definitely am not an authority, or an organizer of this venture.

Agreed, I have committed to one regardless of the configuration, but will definately be unhappy if the bbl is under 24", it is a commemerative and in my mind should reflect the single shots of the era that were chambered in 303, with a tube of at least 26". I have hunted with several Ruger and Browning single shots with 26" bbls and overall length is the same as a short action 22" bolt gun, which hardly makes it the unwieldy club many are speaking of. If its the RSI it will likely be on the exchange forum shortly after I receive it, I like and own a few mannlicher type guns but Ruger does a poor job aesthetically and the stock is clubby in my mind, if they were contoured like the old Brno's or Mannlicher's that would be different.

 

[Hi-Standard]

Agreed, I have committed to one regardless of the configuration, but will definately be unhappy if the bbl is under 24", it is a commemerative and in my mind should reflect the single shots of the era that were chambered in 303, with a tube of at least 26". I have hunted with several Ruger and Browning single shots with 26" bbls and overall length is the same as a short action 22" bolt gun, which hardly makes it the unwieldy club many are speaking of. If its the RSI it will likely be on the exchange forum shortly after I receive it, I like and own a few mannlicher type guns but Ruger does a poor job aesthetically and the stock is clubby in my mind, if they were contoured like the old Brno's or Mannlicher's that would be different.

Agreed Northern Boater, and anyone who thinks a 22" short action is unwieldy might consider getting a BB gun I'm just kidding of coarse. Now a full wood mint Ross, that's unwieldy But I don't think anybody on this board would complain about carrying that through the woods!

 

[Amphibious]

But I don't think anybody on this board would complain about carrying that through the woods!

here's one that would. I'm glad you're speaking for all of us and all, but part of the reason some of us want a short pipe is we don't feel like we're carrying some milsurp POS through the woods.

just a thought.

 

[tiriaq]

I rebarrelled a No. 1 to .303 years ago, used a .30-40 extractor.
A classic single shot rifle should not be a stumpy little carbine. 26" would be better, followed by 24". Henry forend would be appropriate.
The single shot action is so short in comparison to a bolt action, that a longer barrel is a very different proposition as far as handling is concerned.

 

[catnthehatt]

For those interested, I just ran the numbers on quikload, and with 46 grains of Hh335 and a max ceiling of 52,939PSI with a 150 grain Speer, the velocity difference from 26" to 22" is a whopping 100FPS!!
Wow, a real show stopper - just about the same as the 308 versus the 30'06!!
Cat

 

[StoneHorse]

For me, its not a matter of velocity when it comes to barrel length. It is about aesthetics & balance. You are right, who really cares if you are getting +/- 100 FPS in the .303