Poor shooting Rem 700 youth model

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AKAalbertacoyotecaller

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I have a couple model 700 youths in 243. Bought them for the kids to deer hunt. I ran 100gr factory ammo out of them for the few years they used them. Never great shooters. Around 1.25” groups. I have finally tried to get them to shoot better and have reloaded 100, 95, 90 gr for them using a few different recipes. I can’t get anywhere under 1.5”.

Twist rate is 1:9.125”. I have tried anything light weight in projectiles yet but are these just poor performers? Factory stocks aren’t that great. Barrels are thin.

Anyone else have issues with these? Should be able to find a hand load that’s at least an inch or better.
 
Factory shot 1.25" and can only get 1.5" with handloads?

Both are perfectly acceptable for deer out to 300 or more - moa is a ~3" circle at 300, 1.5moa only brings that up to 4.5". Trigger time is more important than half an MoA in ammo, so just get something good enough and get the kids to the range.

As for the gun, maybe it likes light bullets, maybe that's all it's good for. We're pretty spoiled by modern manufacturing processes where making a very accurate rifle is relatively easy, but unless it's coming with a guarantee I wouldn't be all that surprised by a factory rifle that can't quite get there.
 
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I ran a Savage with the same twist rate primarily as a varmint rifle years ago, laser beam up to 90 grains. When I went up to 100 they started keyholing even when pushed as fast as I dared.
If you are getting 1.25” for hunting purposes I’d stick with that.
If groups don’t tighten up when speed increases, you might try a lighter bullet
 
AKAalbertacoyotecaller said:
I have a couple model 700 youths in 243. Bought them for the kids to deer hunt. I ran 100gr factory ammo out of them for the few years they used them. Never great shooters. Around 1.25” groups. I have finally tried to get them to shoot better and have reloaded 100, 95, 90 gr for them using a few different recipes. I can’t get anywhere under 1.5”.

Twist rate is 1:9.125”. I have tried anything light weight in projectiles yet but are these just poor performers? Factory stocks aren’t that great. Barrels are thin.

Anyone else have issues with these? Should be able to find a hand load that’s at least an inch or better.
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Like everyone else said, its gonna do the job. Might not get bragging rights about punching tiny little groups but as far as "hit big game in vital organs" you have a lot of potential there.

Thin barrels should still shoot very well if its a good barrel on a good gun but no doubt a better stock would tighten that up some.

Some other platforms like Tikka, Sauer, Browning etc are not known for repeated inconsistency and bankruptcies and would give you better results perhaps, but totally unneccessary.
 
I understand that I only need to have an inch or so for a hunting rifle. I understand this won’t be a long range shooter in its configuration. I understand twist rates etc. I was thinking it should be able to shoot up to 90s decently. I don’t think 1.5” is decent with hand loads to be honest.

I am going to try some lighter bullets and see what it can do with them.
 
AKAalbertacoyotecaller said:
I understand that I only need to have an inch or so for a hunting rifle. I understand this won’t be a long range shooter in its configuration. I understand twist rates etc. I was thinking it should be able to shoot up to 90s decently. I don’t think 1.5” is decent with hand loads to be honest.

I am going to try some lighter bullets and see what it can do with them.
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Hope it works out!
 
Hey OP,
I run a R700 in 243.
Its not a youth model but it is a Frankenbuild and it has an 18" barrel.
I find mine quite easy to load for and I have shot many critters, including black bear, with 85gr Barnes TSX bullets going 2812 out of an 18" barrel, reaching out to 289 yards (so far).

I actually sought out the SPS youth models for years because those short barrels were noticeably stiffer than the standard 24" sps and I found them easier to make accurate.

I have also had excellent results with 95gr Nosler BT's but I don't hunt with those.

The factory tupperware stocks are plain garbage so you may still be bound by that to some degree.

Happy to share recipes if you like.

Starline Brass, standard trim length, RWS LRP, 36.5gr Varget, 85Gr Barnes TSX, COAL:2.825, 2812fps out of my 18" barrel
Starline Brass, standard trim, RWS LRP, 33gr H4895, COAL: 2.710, cant remember the velocity but very accurate.
 
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AKAalbertacoyotecaller said:
I understand that I only need to have an inch or so for a hunting rifle. I understand this won’t be a long range shooter in its configuration. I understand twist rates etc. I was thinking it should be able to shoot up to 90s decently. I don’t think 1.5” is decent with hand loads to be honest.

I am going to try some lighter bullets and see what it can do with them.
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My 1:10 twists (mossberg atr100 and Henry Single Shot) both shoot/shot 100gr bullets just fine. Maybe not sub-MoA, but i have no reason to expect either of those rifles to be sub-MoA guns either.

I don't think the issue is twist/stability. I think they are either picky guns or just not sub MoA guns. My Rem700 in 7mm08 is not my most accurate gun, I've shot sub-MoA groups but it's not consistently subMoA. It happens.
 
Redneck Hippy said:
I ran a Savage with the same twist rate primarily as a varmint rifle years ago, laser beam up to 90 grains. When I went up to 100 they started keyholing even when pushed as fast as I dared.
If you are getting 1.25” for hunting purposes I’d stick with that.
If groups don’t tighten up when speed increases, you might try a lighter bullet
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Agreed, I also ran a Savage 110 Predator in 243Win with the same 1:9.125 twist. It took awhile to figure out it liked between 68-90gr range with 75’s being best. It can be seen below

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/for...-in-243win-anybody-have-one-opinions.1308822/
 
Those thin barrel 700 are prone to open up the groups as the barrel heats up, have you tried to let the barrel cool down to ambiant temperature between shots?
If you get 1.25” with factory you should be able to get better than that with reloads imo.
These are also pretty light and sometime light rifle are harder to master than heavier rifles.
Is the action bedded? Are the screws torked to specks? These are the few things I would address before getting to a conclusion. And to be honest 1.25-1.50 is totally acceptable to 300m imo.
 
DGY said:
Those thin barrel 700 are prone to open up the groups as the barrel heats up, have you tried to let the barrel cool down to ambiant temperature between shots?
If you get 1.25” with factory you should be able to get better than that with reloads imo.
These are also pretty light and sometime light rifle are harder to master than heavier rifles.
Is the action bedded? Are the screws torked to specks? These are the few things I would address before getting to a conclusion. And to be honest 1.25-1.50 is totally acceptable to 300m imo.
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Same can be said for a host of pencil barrel setups ie; 700 Mtn, M77 UL or Weatherby #1&#2 barrels etc

OP - could be your setup might lime a certain projectile over another. What have you tried so far?
 
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so some of you think 1 1/2 moa is acceptable? My SU 16 can do better than that .. lol
I’d try some different bullets or powder
 
I used to have an ATA Turqua in 243 with a 1 in 8 twist.
The rifle Key holed my 100 grain bullet hand loads, but it shot 90 grains and below very well, ~3/4 inch and less at 100 yards.

Today, I own a Tikka 3X Varmint in 243 with a 1 in 8 inch twist, and it groups 90 grs Speer Hot core bullets over 35 grs Varget, into 1/2 inch at 100 yards, didn't try 100 grs bullets yet.

In your case I would load with 70 - 85 grs bullets.
 
I was shooting a couple 223s the other day with 77smks. Both well under an inch with the Tikka shooting well under half inch.

I can’t get anywhere shoot and reloading isn’t an issue. I think it’s twist and stock mainly. I have two of these youth models. Both are the same. I have some lighter bullets from a Ruger 77 in 243 I shot the barrel out of years ago. I will try some lighter bullets, was just hoping that I could shoot these 90 gr accubonds so they could be used on deer and black bear for younger kids.
 
45C said:
so some of you think 1 1/2 moa is acceptable?
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The whole world thought it was acceptable until pretty recently...

If you can't hit a deer at 250yds with a 2moa rifle, switching to a 1moa rifle isn't going to fix the problem. I love me a sub-MoA rifle as much as the next guy, but from the standpoint of hunting it's hardly necessary unless you're taking shots that 99% of hunters absolutely shouldn't be taking.
 
45C said:
so some of you think 1 1/2 moa is acceptable? My SU 16 can do better than that .. lol
I’d try some different bullets or powder
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Its perfectly acceptable, especially if we aren't talking about 3 shot groups lol. how far out does big game have to be before thats not in the vitals? lol


Now if anyone gets all bricked up over lil clusters of holes, more power to them! They should absolutely try to achieve that. But if the purpose is killing big game animals....yep, I'd rather not be spending my time trying different ammo combinations, sending components into the berm for an extra .2 moa tighter etc etc
 
I don't know if yours came from the factory with a pressure point but several 700s that I have owned shot much better after removing. A free floating pencil thin barrel often needs more clearance than one would think.

As far as the 1.5 inch groups being acceptable. Most youth and the vast majority of adults would be extremely lucky to shoot 1.5 inch groups with a rifle capable of shooting bug holes. So if you have a rifle that is only capable of 1.5 inch groups and a kid that is only capable of 1.5 inch groups now you may be pushing 3 or even 4 inches off the bench. Add to that some cold hands, no bench and the excitement of the hunt and you might be looking at a less than ideal shot.

I think 1-2 inch groups are totally acceptable for hunting if the hunter/rifle can consistently produce those groups in the field. For kids starting out, I think we should eliminate as many negative factors as possible.
 
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