Possible Pinned PMAG Supplier To Canada...!!!
- Thread starter kenjuudo
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rommelrommel
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Not new, but demand greatly outstrips Magpul's production capacity. Give it a bit and they'll be everywhere for 10-15 bucks a piece.
TheGamerXxX
CGN frequent flyer
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- North of the 49, Manitoba
I dont think we'll ever see them at 10-15 bux a piece here in Canada... I mean everybody along the way has to make the money too... unless they opened up a plant here... hmm...
Luke
Luke
Permits...shipping...border fees...tax...tariffs...gas...more permits and taxes...blah blah blah...
Permits...shipping...border fees...tax...tariffs...gas...more permits and taxes...blah blah blah...
Exactly...
Who's doing the export ???
Good luck.
The worst part is, they probably cost about <$2 to make. Just a injection mold that probably does about 20 - 30 a shot. Some wire and a machine to bend the springs, which could be outsourced.
I am suprised no one is making their own up here. (their own version, compliant with any existing patents.)
Clear window inserts and other features are pretty easy to incorporate into the design.
HDPE is cheap
Just my 2 cents
I am suprised no one is making their own up here. (their own version, compliant with any existing patents.)
Clear window inserts and other features are pretty easy to incorporate into the design.
HDPE is cheap
Just my 2 cents
Who says they aren't? BTW they use impact modified, long fibre reinforced PA66, HDPE is not up to the task.
Also, there are no patents/applications found for the Pmag, only a "patent pending" marking on the mags themselves, FWIW.
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I wish the export registration was only $1,200 per year.
Just to enlighten those who don't know... under the NEW US State Department regulations, it now costs us $2,750 US dollars plus $250 for ever permit we processed in the previous 12 month period... that worked out to just under $30,000 for our renewal. That's just for the priviledge to continue to submit export permit applications. Every new permit application we submit means a $250 charge for next years renewal.
For a US company to sell mags to 50 different Gunnutz would mean that they would have to process 50 different export permits since each end user must have a different export permit. The US State Department doesn't recognize "Gunnutz group buys".
There is a clause that allows the exporter to pay a % of each permit (3% of it's value) but that only works if he doesn't process any other export permits of value... if he also does wholesale exports to dealers then the 3% thing won't be of much help to him.
Considering that every thread I read seems to trash dealers because they overcharge for magazines and almost every post indicates that buyers only want to pay what they see mags advertised for in the US... it's no wonder that no-one in Canada wants to bother importing magazines... why would they?
I spoke to Magpul at the SHOT Show. They laughed when I suggested that they make a 10 round capped verison of the magazine. They were telling me how they received orders almost overnight for over 750,000 magazines and are months behind in their backorder list... making a custom product for someone in quantities of a couple thousand is a joke to them. Why would they bother?
I can't find a distributor in the US with PMags in stock... anyone who has any can sell them instantly in the US... why would they bother to add cost by pinning them... unless of course they expect to charge for that service and make money doing it. I suggest that once your US Vendor finds out what it's going to cost them to legally export those items they will have second thoughts about doing it... and if they do proceed, I seriously doubt you'll be buying them for $10 a magazine as many posts on Gunnutz claim is what should be charged.
I'd buy 1,000 right now at $10 each and he doesn't even have to export them... just ship them to my US office. The US market is so dry right now I could sell them overnight for $15 to $20 each.
I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade... but there's a total lack of reality sometimes and some of the posts I read are just not based on fact. The fact is that it costs money to legally export stuff from the US and dealers aren't going to go to the time and expense of importing stuff unless they make money doing it... so many people have indicated that charging $20 or more for a PMAG in Canada is a "rip-off"... it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the reason you don't see dealers selling PMAGS up here in quantity is that they can't sell them for $15 to $20 and make money so they don't bother importing them.
If people were willing to spend $40 and not accuse the dealer of ripping them off at that price I suggest to you that you'd see lots of dealers importing them and selling them. It would be worth their time and effort to do so.
Sometimes these FORUMs are their own worst enemy... comments that get made can have very negative effects. We evaluated the PMAGs back in the beginning... did evaluations on the product and on what would be involved in having them pinned for Canada. I still have those units sitting here. The conclusion was that too many people were commenting about "inflated" prices, etc.. We couldn't import them and make money selling them for $20 or $25 and we had no desire to be accused of over-charging... so we simply shelved the whole thing. I have no doubt that other dealers reacted the same way as we did. It's the ONLY thing that explains why you haven't seen a lot more of them imported and sold in Canada.
Just my opinion... s**t on me for saying it... but it's how I see it.
Mark
Just to enlighten those who don't know... under the NEW US State Department regulations, it now costs us $2,750 US dollars plus $250 for ever permit we processed in the previous 12 month period... that worked out to just under $30,000 for our renewal. That's just for the priviledge to continue to submit export permit applications. Every new permit application we submit means a $250 charge for next years renewal.
For a US company to sell mags to 50 different Gunnutz would mean that they would have to process 50 different export permits since each end user must have a different export permit. The US State Department doesn't recognize "Gunnutz group buys".
There is a clause that allows the exporter to pay a % of each permit (3% of it's value) but that only works if he doesn't process any other export permits of value... if he also does wholesale exports to dealers then the 3% thing won't be of much help to him.
Considering that every thread I read seems to trash dealers because they overcharge for magazines and almost every post indicates that buyers only want to pay what they see mags advertised for in the US... it's no wonder that no-one in Canada wants to bother importing magazines... why would they?
I spoke to Magpul at the SHOT Show. They laughed when I suggested that they make a 10 round capped verison of the magazine. They were telling me how they received orders almost overnight for over 750,000 magazines and are months behind in their backorder list... making a custom product for someone in quantities of a couple thousand is a joke to them. Why would they bother?
I can't find a distributor in the US with PMags in stock... anyone who has any can sell them instantly in the US... why would they bother to add cost by pinning them... unless of course they expect to charge for that service and make money doing it. I suggest that once your US Vendor finds out what it's going to cost them to legally export those items they will have second thoughts about doing it... and if they do proceed, I seriously doubt you'll be buying them for $10 a magazine as many posts on Gunnutz claim is what should be charged.
I'd buy 1,000 right now at $10 each and he doesn't even have to export them... just ship them to my US office. The US market is so dry right now I could sell them overnight for $15 to $20 each.
I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade... but there's a total lack of reality sometimes and some of the posts I read are just not based on fact. The fact is that it costs money to legally export stuff from the US and dealers aren't going to go to the time and expense of importing stuff unless they make money doing it... so many people have indicated that charging $20 or more for a PMAG in Canada is a "rip-off"... it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the reason you don't see dealers selling PMAGS up here in quantity is that they can't sell them for $15 to $20 and make money so they don't bother importing them.
If people were willing to spend $40 and not accuse the dealer of ripping them off at that price I suggest to you that you'd see lots of dealers importing them and selling them. It would be worth their time and effort to do so.
Sometimes these FORUMs are their own worst enemy... comments that get made can have very negative effects. We evaluated the PMAGs back in the beginning... did evaluations on the product and on what would be involved in having them pinned for Canada. I still have those units sitting here. The conclusion was that too many people were commenting about "inflated" prices, etc.. We couldn't import them and make money selling them for $20 or $25 and we had no desire to be accused of over-charging... so we simply shelved the whole thing. I have no doubt that other dealers reacted the same way as we did. It's the ONLY thing that explains why you haven't seen a lot more of them imported and sold in Canada.
Just my opinion... s**t on me for saying it... but it's how I see it.
Mark
If you're afraid of trolls bashing you EVEN THOUGH you're selling out at said price.... Then I suggest you do what any big corporation does when confronted with that problem.... Start a front company and/or funnel the product through a third party who isn't afraid of being flamed.
PS: I would buy 10-20, right now, at 40$.
And if I remember correctly you and I sat at OTAB in October 2007 and discussed this very subject... we talked about importing the PMAG's and about pinning them, etc..
Am I wrong... did you not also finally just walk away from it to a great degree because of everyone's comments that $40 or $45 was too much for the items.
Well the reality is that at $20 or $25 there's no profit in it (actually a loss at today's cost structure)... so walk away. And we all did just that.
Mark
Well thats great and all.........but we were all asking for these things over a year ago. They were available then, and the export fees were not what they are now, and still you guys never bothered. So I guess we are really f**ked now 
Well thats great and all.........but we were all asking for these things over a year ago. They were available then, and the export fees were not what they are now, and still you guys never bothered. So I guess we are really f**ked now
I disagree. If enough people make it clear that they understand that they are going to cost more in Canada than the US.. that $40 is not an unreasonable price and that there is a large demand at $40 (just an estimate)... then I suggest to you that you will find they'll become available here.
Magpul is making product... they are shipping to distributors and product can be had (it just has to be waited for). If there's a demand in Canada (at a price that dealers can make profit at) then that demand will get filled... it's how our economy works.
Like I said... if your US Vendor is willing to supply us (or other exporter/importers) pinned PMAG's then the export side isn't going to be an issue... it just needs to be done in volume to keep the per unit costs reasonable. I have no doubt that CanAm or TSE or Wolverine or others would be more than happy to handle the product... if there's a profit to be made. We would reconsider it as well.
Mark
That said, it makes sense to "group buy" and pre-pay the dealer. Maybe the price drops from $40 to $35 (just an example). Were not the US, so that pricing is not realistic. If a group by helps the dealer for the permit and the individual gets a discount, it's a "win, win" IMO.
Very true, completed in PM.
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