Precision rimfire rifle choice

If you happened upon a particularly accurate lot of HV ammunition, it can work up to 100 M or so,
but when it goes through the sonic threshold, it will mess with accuracy.
I still have a couple of bricks of the old PMC Zapper with the plain lead bullet. The lot # I have
is very accurate in my 541T [Sporter] Remington, and I have won matches with it on occasion.
D.
 
Longboat said:
5/10 are less than half inch with conditions that require wind call. Not sure how you don't see it in the pic? First pic has 7/10 less than .7 in breeze. Yeah 3 changed POI. Not sure why.

Not sure why it is so hard to believe that in absolutely zero wind the gun will hold about the size of a dime at 100? Indoors with no external factors the gun could do it.

When I said dime sized originally I didn't measure. I just remember shooting 3 ten shot groups last fall and saying holy sh*t those are dime sized which they were very close to.

Sorry for the misinformation as a dime is .709 I now see. So maybe the groups were .75 MOA.

Anyone here goes to the Stittsville Shooting Range DM me and you can see it for yourself.

Commence degrading me lol...
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My best advice... stop talking, start listening.

I suspect you are a young or new shooter, possibly both. If you had much experience at all you would have resisted throwing out the numbers and conjecture that you have.

At any rate, take care and good shooting... keep at it... but don't set yourself up for disappointment with unrealistic expectations.
 
I'm 42 and have been shooting over 30 years. And sticking to what I said. My pic with 7/10 in the small group I had done 3 times in a row last fall with no fliers. Yesterday 3/10 went out if the group. My uglier group yesterday was pretty windy. But still got half the shots within .490

It was probobly over half MOA yeah and maybe barely larger than a dime last fall. I didn't expect all hell to break loose because I said .5 by memory without measuring when maybe it was maybe more like .75. The RPR still kind of blew my mind either way. Didn't expect anything like that.

I only keep targets filed I do load development on.

Don't care who believes it and who doesn't. Makes absolutely no difference to anything at all.
 
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RabidM4U5 said:
The ammo I shoot has a cupped base, a bullet pulled from a casing balanced just slightly ahead of center towards the nose. Consider how shotgun slugs fired from a smooth bore maintain some semblance of accuracy without spin, nose heavy design. Much like the birdie used in badminton. Then compare to a centerfire bullet like a ballistic tip, very long and slender nose, definitely base heavy. Just speculating, but if such a bullet had any wayward force applied to the nose, such as in the trans-sonic zone, that long nose could act like a lever on the center of gravity in the base and destabilize it. If the nose itself is the center of gravity, it's much more difficult to destabilize it with forces acting on the nose. I can picture perhaps "knuckleballing" around in the turbulence, but not actually destabilizing a nose heavy projectile. Just thoughts, don't hold me to it.

There lies a certain difficulty in producing meaningful data from extreme long range testing, such as 400m, with .22 LR. At that range, vertical dispersion due to MV variation is considerable, approximately 4 inches per 10 fps for SV ammo. 10 MPH crosswind drift is 65 inches. Combine that with general accuracy of the weapon, the random effects of updrafts, down drafts, and wind swirls all the way to the target, not to mention the cartridges themselves possibly having defects that could affect trajectory, and there's no telling where those rounds are going to end up, much less what is attributable to the trans-sonic zone when the HV ammo is tested. While interesting to think about, it is well beyond the design limits of this cartridge.
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Well beyond, which is why its so much fun.

Yes the difficulty in measuring the effect of trans-sonic shift by paper results alone. That is why some people use doppler radar...

Longboat said:
I'm 42 and have been shooting over 30 years. And sticking to what I said. My pic with 7/10 in the small group I had done 3 times in a row last fall with no fliers. Yesterday 3/10 went out if the group. My uglier group yesterday was pretty windy. But still got half the shots within .490

It was probobly over half MOA yeah and maybe barely larger than a dime last fall. I didn't expect all hell to break loose because I said .5 by memory without measuring when maybe it was maybe more like .75. The RPR still kind of blew my mind either way. Didn't expect anything like that.

I only keep targets filed I do load development on.

Don't care who believes it and who doesn't. Makes absolutely no difference to anything at all.
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Not sure what community of people you roll with, but on the internet, no one counts 7 out of 10 shots as a 10 shot group.

All hell didn't break loose when you made an unbelievable claim on the internet. You simply got called out for it.

Stay classy.
 
I didn't say it was a 10 shot group. I'm saying it's capable of that 7 group with no fliers. It's been done. If it makes anyone feel any better garbage ammo the gun does not like is probobly 4-6 MOA.

Maybe I got an amazing box of CCI SV or won the lottery 3 times as was stated. I'm curious myself.

I will try some match ammo this weekend. See how it goes. If it sucks I will post pics and admit it. If it's awesome and too hard to believe, there will be plenty of CGN witnesses there on Saturday.
 
Ryan.M.Anderson said:
Whoa, are you saying you are trying new ammo at a match (I am assuming you are at the CPRS match on Saturday)?

You are crazy!
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Well if they start at 10? And I get there at 9 that gives me an hour to play. If Eley match or something seems better or less or no fliers why not.

I'm not going there to win. I'm clueless about the format and what goes on in the matches lol. I may even just check things out for Saturday. I have a 338 LM to break in I'm itching too shoot as well.

If I decide to sign up and get my ass tuned I'm ok with that too!

This is Stittsville Ont I'm talking too. Not out your end of the country. It's a different deal it's ORPS I think it is...
 
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Longboat said:
I didn't say it was a 10 shot group. I'm saying it's capable of that 7 group with no fliers. It's been done. If it makes anyone feel any better garbage ammo the gun does not like is probobly 4-6 MOA.

Maybe I got an amazing box of CCI SV or won the lottery 3 times as was stated. I'm curious myself.

I will try some match ammo this weekend. See how it goes. If it sucks I will post pics and admit it. If it's awesome and too hard to believe, there will be plenty of CGN witnesses there on Saturday.
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I don't compete (ever) and seldom discuss the groups I'm getting/not getting...but make no mistake, bullet holes are judged by the company they keep. lol So even if 9 bullets went through EXACTLY the same hole and your 10th shot landed 6" to the right (center-to-center :) ) that's a 10-shot, 6" group. Doesn't matter that things were going swimmingly until the last trigger pull~every shot "counts", good or bad.

Fliers happen, we all get those..but primo ammo (ie, not CCI SV), no wind, and lots of practice with a quality rifle on a steady rest usually results in better/smaller groups more consistently. At least that's what I tell myself. :) btw, I quite like CCI SV and think it's sort of the gold standard for affordable, decently accurate ammo that most of my guns will shoot well.
 
Eagleye said:
I really like 22 Benchrest, and have 3 real shooters to work with: a Suhl 150 standard, prepped by Jim Williams;
a Remington 40X from the custom shop; a Remington 37, also race-prepped.

I have shot a lot of 50 Meter targets that are in the .1's and .2's. But 100 M targets under .5"? probably 30 total in my shooting career.
These were always shot in absolutely calm conditions, and with ammo [ELEY or RWS Match] that the rifles have shown they like and
that perform consistently. Below is a picture of 5 - 50M 5 shot groups fired on a "good" day.

I won a gold medal in a 100M shoot with 5-10 shot groups that averaged .662", C to C. Only one group was under .5" [.477"]

I would be totally flabbergasted to see a Ruger anything shoot several 10 shot groups under .5moa at 100 using CCI SV ammo.
Dave.
U98onPt.jpg
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I have been shooting rim fire bench rest for a number of years.
There are many good .22,s out there that shoot very well.
I have owned and shot CZ 455, Norinco NS522 and Anschutz Match 54 for BR and all do well.
They cover a range of $200 to $2000, not including optics.

Quality ammo is main factor. Bulk produced ammo like CCI std. vol. is a good all round training ammo, but do not expect MOA at 100 m. But it does very well at 50 m.
By chance, during a blue moon anything can happen, but overall it is not going to perform that well.

My experience is that quality ammo ($60.00/ brick or above), quality optics with high magnification
(35 to 45 power) and a good platform (rifle) is the starting point.
After that it is the dummy holding the rifle who ruins the shot.

The photo from Eagle eye target is typical of what to expect after many years of practice, with everything coming together, just right.
If you ever get a target under .100, you will keep it. And most likely the grin on your face will have made your day.

BTW well done Eagle eye.
 
.22LRGUY said:
I don't compete (ever) and seldom discuss the groups I'm getting/not getting...but make no mistake, bullet holes are judged by the company they keep. lol So even if 9 bullets went through EXACTLY the same hole and your 10th shot landed 6" to the right (center-to-center :) ) that's a 10-shot, 6" group. Doesn't matter that things were going swimmingly until the last trigger pull~every shot "counts", good or bad.

Fliers happen, we all get those..but primo ammo (ie, not CCI SV), no wind, and lots of practice with a quality rifle on a steady rest usually results in better/smaller groups more consistently. At least that's what I tell myself. :) btw, I quite like CCI SV and think it's sort of the gold standard for affordable, decently accurate ammo that most of my guns will shoot well.
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The guys that I shoot BR with, we shoot 5 rdns for a group. We have a saying, "401", that means there was a flyer that ruined the group. Happens more then we like.
 
Please post video if the Ruger precision doing a .5 @100 m there’s going to be a lot of upset Voduu owners out the if you could pull that off! NOT saying it’s Impossible put highly unlikely! Voduu on a good day might do the odd .5 @100m if you ever sell your rifle it’s now triple the price you paid for it. Lol
But hey I’ve Sean stranger things life Look forward to seeing the miracle.
Thanks.
MAKE ME A BELEAVER!
 
I think Longbow you mean well and am sure you have been shooting a long time as most of us here in the Rimfire section have.

Most of us here reload for Cenerfire rifles and trim and weigh cases and powder and pretty much can produce a round that would still have a hard time putting 10 shots into a dime at 100m. It’s definitely something all of us reloaders have probably done, but with Rimfire it’s incredibly difficult because the ammo cannot be tailored to our needs.

So you have to understand that if someone achieves a 10 shot dime size group 3x with any ammo in the best rifle barrel configuration that he has achieved the one true goal that seems virtually unobtainable in his life.

Most of these guys are here because they have achieved most of their goals in centerfire or know that it’s possible to achieve what they need to get, but Rimfire is almost Like black magic.

I also shoot different types of Airguns myself and this is like Rimfire where it’s not like other rifles and are different disciplines that require a different way of thinking with different variables.

Each one of these is time consuming and difficult to master and that’s why we do it.
I will end with that I love all Ruger products but have never ever liked anything they have out of the box and they need to be modified to be great.
 
.22LRGUY said:
I don't compete (ever) and seldom discuss the groups I'm getting/not getting...but make no mistake, bullet holes are judged by the company they keep. lol So even if 9 bullets went through EXACTLY the same hole and your 10th shot landed 6" to the right (center-to-center :) ) that's a 10-shot, 6" group. Doesn't matter that things were going swimmingly until the last trigger pull~every shot "counts", good or bad.

Fliers happen, we all get those..but primo ammo (ie, not CCI SV), no wind, and lots of practice with a quality rifle on a steady rest usually results in better/smaller groups more consistently. At least that's what I tell myself. :) btw, I quite like CCI SV and think it's sort of the gold standard for affordable, decently accurate ammo that most of my guns will shoot well.
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Just went out today with a new lot of AE to try... now i need to find more, it is shooting with Fed 711B and a whisker less than Tenex at 100....
 
Longboat said:
I'm 42 and have been shooting over 30 years. And sticking to what I said. My pic with 7/10 in the small group I had done 3 times in a row last fall with no fliers. Yesterday 3/10 went out if the group. My uglier group yesterday was pretty windy. But still got half the shots within .490

It was probobly over half MOA yeah and maybe barely larger than a dime last fall. I didn't expect all hell to break loose because I said .5 by memory without measuring when maybe it was maybe more like .75. The RPR still kind of blew my mind either way. Didn't expect anything like that.

I only keep targets filed I do load development on.

Don't care who believes it and who doesn't. Makes absolutely no difference to anything at all.
Click to expand...

You really should stop talking... you just keep digging deeper.
 
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