price to play IPSC

[maxpig]

Our cost is $160, that includes:

$50 for the Course fee
$50 Instructors fee, and
$60 for your first years membership.

Training new shooters is not where we should be scrimping...

I don't want to be around anyone who has not received some type of training and been evaluated to confirm he can do this safely. Two days at black badge under the scrutiny of the instructor is a small price for us to pay for safety.

A new shooter could pay 100.00 and get black badge training in Ontario without becoming a member? especially if s/he just wants the training to feel more comfortable with holster competition and not really participate in Ontario... or is that a break down into elements just to help explain costs??

if I remember correctly (and i'm sure you will correct me if I'm wrong) you have 1 year to shoot Qualifier to receive full black badge until then ur provisional... So breaking it down like that would give the impression that a person who was willing to take the course say in January 2007 would have until February 2008 to shoot that qualifier.... if s/he actually decides to of course.... then why pay for 2007??

you may say why would anyone do that?? well that's not the point ... I could take the training this year not pay membership fees... be allowed to have more than 5 rounds in my mag when I'm at my local range ( our club limits rounds in mag unless practicing IDPA, PPC or IPSC) because I completed the BB course and if I like the sport enuf I'll join up in 2008..... but most importantly I can now take that traing and shoot IDPA , CDP, PPC, CAS or USPSA knowing i'm comfortable with holster drawn sports...

really you should only say price is 160.00 and not break it down because that gives me the impression I can haggle... hey mr. Trainer do you think I can pay you only 25.00??? or my membership arguement... course fee is course fee no haggling there ... unless Quigley you are open to negotiations??

R.O. courses in essence are free 35.00 for 1st timers and free for refreshers ( diffence is you don't get a shirt or overlays). and our Futures Program in Ontario free to anyone under 18??or 21... So arguement on skimping on training doesn't hold water because if the training is given in a competent manner price is meaningless.

I think what Madness was saying the cost of joining may seem too prohibitive to new comers... not the cost of a round golf or bullets or equipment.... you have a new guy show up at a match and say I really would like to "try" this sport out... and the first thing out of our mouths is well you need to spend 160.00 for training before you can do anything..... that scares them off right away because they are already doing the math.... equipment 2000+ course and travel expenses... hell I may not even like the sport or have time (we all know they'll be hooked after their first real match) but it's that barrier we need to overcome... pay the instructor, pay the course fee.... first year membership free..... 100.00 always sounds better than 160.00 ...

like some professions do .. first sample is free cause after that your hooked and will be a customer for life...

think about it how many new members fall off after taking their BB?? lack of funds, lack of time or cost of travelling to a good outdoor match... lowering the startup costs benefits us all....

Think outside the box.... it's a numbers game the more members you have the more revenue you generate.... and the quality of training isn't the issue...

sorry it was so long winded

 

[MOBILE 1]

Our cost is $160, that includes:

$50 for the Course fee
$50 Instructors fee, and
$60 for your first years membership.

Training new shooters is not where we should be scrimping...

If this is true ( I am not calling you a liar , you know me better than that ).
Why are Instructors charging any were from $175.00 to $200 for a black badge course.

This is my question. If the black badge course is to be the same across the country , should the fees be the same across the country.

 

[Quigley]

If this is true ( I am not calling you a liar , you know me better than that ).
Why are Instructors charging any were from $175.00 to $200 for a black badge course.

This is my question. If the black badge course is to be the same across the country , should the fees be the same across the country.

Regarding the cost for Ontario...this is the price we set. Some Instructors were charging the Instructors fee and some were not. So prices did vary. We decided to make it a fixed fee of $160 including the Instructors fee so it would cost the same in Ottawa as it di in Toronto and so on...

The only additional fee that could apply is if the host facility is charging a rental fee for the range (most do not)

 

[Quigley]

oops...double tap

 

[Quigley]

A new shooter could pay 100.00 and get black badge training in Ontario without becoming a member? especially if s/he just wants the training to feel more comfortable with holster competition and not really participate in Ontario... or is that a break down into elements just to help explain costs??

if I remember correctly (and i'm sure you will correct me if I'm wrong) you have 1 year to shoot Qualifier to receive full black badge until then ur provisional... So breaking it down like that would give the impression that a person who was willing to take the course say in January 2007 would have until February 2008 to shoot that qualifier.... if s/he actually decides to of course.... then why pay for 2007??

you may say why would anyone do that?? well that's not the point ... I could take the training this year not pay membership fees... be allowed to have more than 5 rounds in my mag when I'm at my local range ( our club limits rounds in mag unless practicing IDPA, PPC or IPSC) because I completed the BB course and if I like the sport enuf I'll join up in 2008..... but most importantly I can now take that traing and shoot IDPA , CDP, PPC, CAS or USPSA knowing i'm comfortable with holster drawn sports...

really you should only say price is 160.00 and not break it down because that gives me the impression I can haggle... hey mr. Trainer do you think I can pay you only 25.00??? or my membership arguement... course fee is course fee no haggling there ... unless Quigley you are open to negotiations??

R.O. courses in essence are free 35.00 for 1st timers and free for refreshers ( diffence is you don't get a shirt or overlays). and our Futures Program in Ontario free to anyone under 18??or 21... So arguement on skimping on training doesn't hold water because if the training is given in a competent manner price is meaningless.

I think what Madness was saying the cost of joining may seem too prohibitive to new comers... not the cost of a round golf or bullets or equipment.... you have a new guy show up at a match and say I really would like to "try" this sport out... and the first thing out of our mouths is well you need to spend 160.00 for training before you can do anything..... that scares them off right away because they are already doing the math.... equipment 2000+ course and travel expenses... hell I may not even like the sport or have time (we all know they'll be hooked after their first real match) but it's that barrier we need to overcome... pay the instructor, pay the course fee.... first year membership free..... 100.00 always sounds better than 160.00 ...

like some professions do .. first sample is free cause after that your hooked and will be a customer for life...

think about it how many new members fall off after taking their BB?? lack of funds, lack of time or cost of travelling to a good outdoor match... lowering the startup costs benefits us all....

Think outside the box.... it's a numbers game the more members you have the more revenue you generate.... and the quality of training isn't the issue...

sorry it was so long winded

No haggling...it's a fixed fee. If someone takes the course and does not shoot the qualifier in the same year...they would have to pay their membership the following year (just like you and me) and depending on the lenght between the time they took the course and shot the match (if we're talking years) they would have to retake the BB Course (no cost...again depending on the lenght of time)

Regarding the cost to new shooters etc...we lose more people after the first year than I care to think about...and it's not because of the cost. That's where we need to concentrate our efforts (figure out how to keep them)

Cheers

 

[Dragoon]

This is my question. If the black badge course is to be the same across the country , should the fees be the same across the country.

Is the price of gasoline the same accross the country? the price of beer? housing? Are wages the same?

 

[Dansy]

A new shooter could pay 100.00 and get black badge training in Ontario without becoming a member?

I don't think any provinces(sections) are in the instruction business as per say....they teach the BB to recruit new shooters......being a member is essential to the grow of the organization......not the grow of the Police force.....

 

[MOBILE 1]

Is the price of gasoline the same accross the country? the price of beer? housing? Are wages the same?

None of the above are regulated at a national level were the black badge course is.

 

[ckc123]

If this is true ( I am not calling you a liar , you know me better than that ).
Why are Instructors charging any were from $175.00 to $200 for a black badge course.

This is my question. If the black badge course is to be the same across the country , should the fees be the same across the country.

And who said the cost for the range time is the same across the country???

Eg at our range we don't charge a penny for the 2 1/2 of reserved range time.. however the range down the street charges quite a bit for a course..

Same instructors doing the course..

 

[ckc123]

None of the above are regulated at a national level were the black badge course is.

The Content of the course is regulated, not the environement in which it is..


Eg. Shell has 91 octane is regulated to be the same across canada, but local taxes and supply costs (shipping) are different.. hense different $$$

same thing with BB costs.. range time costs are different. (amongst other things)

 

[MOBILE 1]

And who said the cost for the range time is the same across the country???

Eg at our range we don't charge a penny for the 2 1/2 of reserved range time.. however the range down the street charges quite a bit for a course..

Same instructors doing the course..

All right keep the range fees out of the cost of the black badge course.
Let see how long the ranges that charge you out the A$$ keep doing so.

I point being there are instructors ripping people of. And that is BULL $HIT.
I am told that the cost of the black badger course is $160.00 in Ontario . I have in instructor tell me that for him to come to my range ( which does not charge for the course ) it is going to be $175 and stay at my house to save money.

You wounder why people leave this sport. They are tiered of being F*#ked over.

All this is is a money grab nothing more nothing less.

 

[Quigley]

All right keep the range fees out of the cost of the black badge course.
Let see how long the ranges that charge you out the A$$ keep doing so.

I point being there are instructors ripping people of. And that is BULL $HIT.
I am told that the cost of the black badger course is $160.00 in Ontario . I have in instructor tell me that for him to come to my range ( which does not charge for the course ) it is going to be $175 and stay at my house to save money.

You wounder why people leave this sport. They are tiered of being F*#ked over.

All this is is a money grab nothing more nothing less.

Keep in mind the standardized pricing in Ontario is reletively new (within the last 3 months)

 

[Rudi]

I took the Black Badge course last weekend. It was fun! I really enjoyed it!

Two weeks ago we went to the fun park at the Central Island with my daughter, and I spent almost the same money in 1 day, and only my daughter had fun.

Do you work for free??? Perhaps not. Why do you expect that anybody, like the instructor works for free for you?

The price of the gun, the ammo, the gas to get to the course and the holster/extra magazines dwarfs the cost of the membership/instructor fees anyway.

I make money to spend it. If I feel that it would be just wasting, then I would choose not to spend it. I can always choose to take or not to take the course, and I can stick to bullseye shooting.

 

[stormbringer]

I can stick to bullseye shooting.

Dear god no!!

The HUMANITY!!

 

[Quigley]

I took the Black Badge course last weekend. It was fun! I really enjoyed it!

Two weeks ago we went to the fun park at the Central Island with my daughter, and I spent almost the same money in 1 day, and only my daughter had fun.

Do you work for free??? Perhaps not. Why do you expect that anybody, like the instructor works for free for you?

The price of the gun, the ammo, the gas to get to the course and the holster/extra magazines dwarfs the cost of the membership/instructor fees anyway.

I make money to spend it. If I feel that it would be just wasting, then I would choose not to spend it. I can always choose to take or not to take the course, and I can stick to bullseye shooting.

Welcome aboard Rudi

 

[Walter Hornby]

Rudi

out of the mouths of babes! if you make nationals this year, look me up and i am sure i can find you a beer or three!

 

[redbirddog]

As a New Black Badge in my first full year.

I think the costs are fair.

The training in 2 days is great and its either makes or breaks you into sticking with it or quiting.

Some of the guys on my course have got out of it, some have not.

Ive spent more on a crappy supper out than on my black badge course and I will always remember that weekend of learning. And one day I hope to be able to train other interested people in IPSC.

Its not for everyone but the basis of it is safety and its important.

p.s. the more you do not like it the better my odds at geting on to a squad list at the next match!

 

[Dragoon]

None of the above are regulated at a national level were the black badge course is.

OK, so who's rate do we go with? NB, NS, Alberta? Ontario? And what do you mean by regulated?

 

[Sosa]

All right keep the range fees out of the cost of the black badge course.
Let see how long the ranges that charge you out the A$$ keep doing so.

I point being there are instructors ripping people of. And that is BULL $HIT.
I am told that the cost of the black badger course is $160.00 in Ontario . I have in instructor tell me that for him to come to my range ( which does not charge for the course ) it is going to be $175 and stay at my house to save money.

You wounder why people leave this sport. They are tiered of being F*#ked over.

All this is is a money grab nothing more nothing less.

I'm sorry to hear that you think that. I know several BB instructors and can assure you that none of them are in this for the money. For two full days of training you are complaining about $15 and a hotel room. I don't know many people that will travel out of town to put on a course for other people and do it for nothing! I sure that most people leaving IPSC have reasons other than being bent over for money. You don;t need to spend $2000 on gear, buy a used semi, some used mags, a fobus holster and an uncle mike mag pouch your in for less than $1000, besides which most clubs will let you shoot a club match without a BB (under supervision) and most guys I know would loan you a gun, mags and ammo for a couple of stages. If your involved in the sport I don't see how you can look at the level of volunteer work in this sport and think that its a money grab. Once you belong to IPSC you can shoot almost anywhere in the world!

 

[marlin60]

Green fees for golf is far more expencive then a day shooting.

I use this one a lot, as I know more people who golf than shoot.

For a middle of the road golfer I think the costs are almost identical.
Good clubs=good pistol
green fees=ammo...

accessories, add-ons and upgrades are a regular thing (new putter or driver vs. new mags, sights etc.)