Primers

Yes, H4351

I have been using 200's with three with W760 , all hunting loads , one in 7-08 one in 7WSM one in .270, never had an issue.

Use my BR primers with H4350.

Using 215's in my , 338LM , but not liking the cratering and flattening even though loads are safe and accurate.Hence wanting to change to CCI for cup hardness.
 
Kelly, I hear you talking, but it was me who riled up a bunch on here a few years ago by stating, from my experience, a magnum primer was not needed in anything at any time! This resulted in helping Boomer set up our test of powder and bullets, which was fairly extensive, very accurately done by Boomer, who lives in one of the coldest places in northern Canada, done during a cold spell in the dead of winter. This test showed that with several types of primers and powder with various cartridges of great difference, they all shot, very close to each other, hot or cold.
Because after all, smokeless powder had been in use for about 60 years before some company coined the name, magnum, for their primers and Winchester had been making their ball powder for thirty years, before the advent of the magnum primer.
However, this is not to say that previously the primers didn't have the fire power to ignite the powders in use. As was pointed out, Winchester, of course, would certainly make primers good enough to be 100% reliable in all conditions, for their ball powders they developed in 1933 and commonly used in Alaska, but they just didn't have the title of magnum on them.
There are so many variables involved, not the least of which I pointed out from a lab test I had seen, where the power of the strike of the firing pin had more effect on the fire power of the primer than did the type of primer being used.
I grew up in a very cold area at a time when the settlers killed game all year, sometimes in temperatures as low as 45 and 50 degrees below zero. They all knew they had to clean every speck of oil from the actions lf their rifles with kerosene, then their rifles would work well all winter with our CIL, Dominion ammunition, or a US brand, if they happened to have any.


I am going to edit this piece, on the date of Feb 16, 2018.
There are just too many variables for anyone to think they have the properties of primers and powders figured out. We see too many changes that are contrary to what we thought we figured out.
We take too much for granted and presume too much, about anything to do with primers and powder.
For example, We believe firmly, that if all else is equal, more powder will give more velocity to the bullet, in all normal circumstances, where a safe load is at least 15 grains of H110. I dug up an old book of my reloading a S&W, 357 Magnum with 6 1/2 half inch barrel. The date was Nov. 23, 1990 and the temperature was 40 degrees F. I was loading Keith bullets that weighed 168 grains with H110 powder. 12 grains gave 1124 fps, 13 grains gave 1152, 14 grains of H110 gave an av. of 1329 and six shots had an es of only 17, best yet.
So I loaded up three rounds, everything the same, except I put in 15 grains of H110.
I fired two of them and got 1088 from one and 1101 from the other.
Thinking something was wrong, I pulled the bullets of the remaining two and confirmed, yes they held 15 grains of H110.
I went home in disgust and dug out my bottle of Jack Daniels.
 
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Well H4351 , IMO by reading your posts it is a relation to the firing pin and cup and in my case it won't matter as mine appears to be kicking the crap out of that primer.

When it cools off a bit I will head out and see, I loaded a few tonight with the CCI's of both , see where it takes me.
 
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2) A lab test of all the primers in existence, came up with the results that a standard RWS rifle primer had more fire power than any of the magnum primers tested.

This is interesting as McPherson rates the RWS primers as the mildest of those he tested. He does elaborate further by showing the RWS is very hot burning (especially LR Mag) but with low brisance.
 
Well H4351 , IMO by reading your posts it is a relation to the firing pin and cup and in my case it won't matter as mine appears to be kicking the crap out of that primer.

When it cools off a bit I will head out and see, I loaded a few tonight with the CCI's of both , see where it takes me.

Kelly, just one of the great many reasons results vary so much.
BL
 
Yesterday I had some misfires with Rem 9 1/2 LR primers. I had recently cleaned that rifle though, and several of the strikes looked a bit light. I used some solvent to take the oil out of the bolt; kerosene is a good idea. Probably what we would have used growing up in Telegraph Creek. I also pulled the bullets and used new brass and primers. (The pockets were loose and I have lots of 30-06 brass). My guess was it could be hard to pin down what was the problem. If the newly reloaded rounds misbehave I'll know better.
 
I use Remington 7 1/2 primers in my AR15 rifles because that was what Remington used in their 5.56 ammo when they ran our Lake City Army Ammunition Plant.
Why argue with success, they loaded Winchester ball powders in the 5.56 so I will assume Remington tuned their primers to light off ball powders.
Look at the primer photos below, the Remington primers look like the Remington engineers were listening to the Doors song "Light My Fire" during primer development. ;)

Primer Flash Test Photos
http://www.6mmbr.com/primerpix.html
 
This is interesting as McPherson rates the RWS primers as the mildest of those he tested. He does elaborate further by showing the RWS is very hot burning (especially LR Mag) but with low brisance.

Look pretty hot too me,


RWS (German) Large Rifle

GASRWSLR.jpg


CCI BR2

GASCCIBR2LR.jpg



Federal 210m Large Rifle
GASFed210mLR.jpg


PMC (Russian) Large Rifle
GASPMCLR.jpg


Remington 9.5 Large Rifle
GASRem95LR.jpg


Winchester Large Rifle
GASWWLR.jpg
 
Every military or commercial manufacturer of primers will have the proper equipment to make the best primers for lighting up the powder in the cartridge they are using.
We are all assuming that bigger and brighter are best. But we do not know that. Maybe a smaller fire will get the bullet going faster. But the primer makers know what's best!
 
Back in the day there was only one large primer, and they were all equivalent to what a Magnum primer is today (ie Win Staynless large rifle primers)
The "non-magnum" or "standard" primer is the NEWER invention.
Here is a good article on how the different temps/gasses produced by primers affect ignition and pressure curves in the lab. Hotter longer flame with less gas production seemed to be better for consistency.
http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammo/ammunition_st_mamotaip_200909/
 
Every military or commercial manufacturer of primers will have the proper equipment to make the best primers for lighting up the powder in the cartridge they are using.
We are all assuming that bigger and brighter are best. But we do not know that. Maybe a smaller fire will get the bullet going faster. But the primer makers know what's best!
Other than commercial use I'm sure that the manufacturers are trying to find that middle ground so their primers work well in as many firearms as possible reducing the need to have too many product offerings and therefore building low turn over inventory which cuts into profits.
 
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