Recommend me an accurate .22
- Thread starter Madmardigan
- Start date
Too bad there's no Anshultz or Anschutz dealers around. I hear they make a rifle that rivals the Marlin 2000. As for a rifle that shoots cheap ammo more accurately than a 10/22 shooting target grade, that doesn't really narrow it down much, does it?
All kidding aside, the CZ 452 is your best bet as well as the German-made rifles mentioned above. Keep your eyes open on the EE for something in your budget range.
- Location
- West Quebec
^^^^^ That was the model I was thinking of when he mentioned iron sites, have heard nothing but good with them
Too bad there's no Anshultz or Anschutz dealers around. I hear they make a rifle that rivals the Marlin 2000. As for a rifle that shoots cheap ammo more accurately than a 10/22 shooting target grade, that doesn't really narrow it down much, does it?
All kidding aside, the CZ 452 is your best bet as well as the German-made rifles mentioned above. Keep your eyes open on the EE for something in your budget range.
Unless I’m missing something (joke) Nordic Marksman (e) sells Annies and they have good sales every so often.
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I have 4 T-Bolts and all 4 have triggers made by a lawyer. You will have to do some serious tinkering or lay out some real cash and buy an after market trigger and there are very few choices out there
I agree that Savage is not normally a brand I'd go after, but the Savage BSEV has phenomenal reviews for accuracy.
You're not going to get irons on it, though, but with a scope it's pretty much the most accurate 22 you can get (from numerous comparison reviews I have seen).
It looks a bit funky, but it's the best there is.
https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2010/12/28/savage-mark-ii-bsev/
http://chuckhawks.com/savage_bsev.htm
You're not going to get irons on it, though, but with a scope it's pretty much the most accurate 22 you can get (from numerous comparison reviews I have seen).
It looks a bit funky, but it's the best there is.
https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2010/12/28/savage-mark-ii-bsev/
http://chuckhawks.com/savage_bsev.htm
I think the OPs comments; "I just want something that's quality, that will last, and will shoot a fly off a donkey's sphincter. Something I can hand down to my son one day.
I want something that I can appreciate the craftsmanship and engineering that went into building it. Something that's nice to look at.
What I need, is a gentlemen's rifle" kind of rules-out the Savage. I'm actually interested in the new Savage bolt guns and would like to try one eventually, but if it's an heirloom-grade rifle the OP is asking for..that launches the discussion into CZ/Anschutz territory. Just my opinion.
I'd say his heirloom and MOA accuracy qualifiers nix CZ from the list, given CZ only warrants 2 MOA for accuracy chances are you get a rifle that floats around 3/4" @ 50y + or -. Anschütz engineering shows craftsmanship you can appreciate, CZ is utilitarian. OP might have to stretch his budget to get what he's really after. Sako might be worth having a look at.
A secondary factor is that a CZ is likely to be a project gun, something suited to people who like to tinker and mod. It can take some work to get the shooting up to par, RFC has comprehensive info on what to do, from trigger tuning to bolt work, pillars and bedding, all the way up to *gasp* barrel replacement
The 455 is quickly becoming the 10/22 of the bolt world.An Anschütz is pretty well good to go out of the box, and their triggers have sear and pull weight adjustments built in if one desires to change the pull. Depending on trigger model, a spring swap might be necessary to get the pull under 1#. Other than that, this is a rifle for one who does not wish to tinker and modify.
I do believe the OP meant a local shop that he could visit and see/touch/feel an Anschütz in person, bit of a drive for him to Nordic, I'd say.
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I'd say his heirloom and MOA accuracy qualifiers nix CZ from the list, given CZ only warrants 2 MOA for accuracy chances are you get a rifle that floats around 3/4" @ 50y + or -. Anschütz engineering shows craftsmanship you can appreciate, CZ is utilitarian. OP might have to stretch his budget to get what he's really after. Sako might be worth having a look at.
A secondary factor is that a CZ is likely to be a project gun, something suited to people who like to tinker and mod. It can take some work to get the shooting up to par, RFC has comprehensive info on what to do, from trigger tuning to bolt work, pillars and bedding, all the way up to *gasp* barrel replacement
An Anschütz is pretty well good to go out of the box, and their triggers have sear and pull weight adjustments built in if one desires to change the pull. Depending on trigger model, a spring swap might be necessary to get the pull under 1#. Other than that, this is a rifle for one who does not wish to tinker and modify.
I do believe the OP meant a local shop that he could visit and see/touch/feel an Anschütz in person, bit of a drive for him to Nordic, I'd say.
^not sure I'd agree with that statement, I'm basing my opinion on experiences owning CZ/BRNO and Anschutz. I also assumed the the OP's $800 budget might be the outer limit of what he wants to pay. As for the "heirloom" opinion~I'd also respectfully disagree with your opinion on that. There is nothing (in my opinion) that rivals the build quality AND accuracy of CZ/BRNOs for the price. The are also (in my experience owning/shooting them) more forgiving when it comes to shooting inexpensive ammo better than it should. I can't say the same about my Anschutz 64 MP R. It has a slight accuracy edge over my 452 Varmint, but it takes match-grade ammo to achieve it. The Anschutz is a finer firearm, but shooting econo ammo...my CZ/BRNO can do as well, mostly better. Last I checked (Back to the "heirloom" thing) CZ 452s and 453s/BRNOs are appreciating in value, not the other way around.
When I said "All kidding aside..." -- I meant it.
Regarding heirloom and accuracy (sounds like a great book title), on both counts Anschutz trumps CZ. To be sure, Anschutz costs more but there's a very good reason for that. CZ accuracy is, as Rabid says, not especially good. CZ USA says the standard for CZ accuracy is 2 MOA, that is 1 inch at 50 yards. That's not to say there aren't CZ bolt actions that do much better because there are such rifles, and I've had a couple of them. The point is that very CZ accuracy is the result of being lucky enough to get a good barrel. I've had CZ 455's that didn't come to me with very good barrels. I've had better luck with 452's.
Anschutz rifles shoot better right out of the box, without the tinkering often needed with CZ's referred to above. I don't know if any rifle that shoots bulk ammo anywhere nearly as good as match ammo. The bottom line is that if you are looking for consistent accuracy in .22LR match ammo is necessary. If a shooter doesn't wish to spend the money on match ammo that's his prerogative; but he shouldn't expect any rifle to shoot inexpensive ammo as well.
Having said all the above, I still think that the OP would be well served by a CZ 452 or a used Anschutz or Walther.
^I think I'd agree with most of that, but if I ever had a CZ/BRNO that would only shoot 1" @ 50 yards, I'd sell the thing. Hasn't been the case with either of the CZ452s I've had, nor with the BRNO 2E. In fact, my 452 Varmint 22LR shoots cheap ammo better than my 2 Anschutz. Flukey gun? I don't think so. I'd also never recommend a 455 anything, so I left that out of my advice to the OP. Admittedly, I have allot more time with CZ/BRNO than I do with my newest Anschutz (64 MP R) but in my experience shooting both...lots...with lots of ammo types, the CZ/BRNO gets surprisingly good results from very mediocre ammo. My 452 Varmint shoots 1/2" @ 50 yards using CCI Blazer 22~maybe I am lucky! Anyhow, if the OP said his budget was $2,000 or under, my advice would have been very Anschutz-centric, but for $800 all in, I can sure recommend CZ/BRNO with a clear conscience.
Shooter_01
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Durham Region, Ontario
I’m with you, .22LRGUY. My CZ’s are stellar performers and came that way from the factory.
CZ 452/453 Lux would be my recommendation, as well.
That is fair, what constitutes "heirloom" is somewhat subjective and variable person to person. Some people consider Cooey rifles to be heirloom *shrug*. I should make it clear my opinion is only that of the 455 series, as I have never seen, shot, handled or otherwise inspected a 452 or 453. I recognize that the 452/453's have not generated nearly the amount of complaints about issues as have the 455's. The 452 Grand Finale's could certainly be considered heirloom quality IMO, definitely a collectors item. CZ is in a niche for price and build quality, nobody else is comparable though in a few years time Savage might get there. As far as I see it, you either step down from a CZ, or step up, but nobody else is equal when buying new.
I'd also never recommend a 455 anything, but for $800 all in, I can sure recommend CZ/BRNO with a clear conscience.
Yeah, I bought three 455's in .22LR then swapped out the Full Stock with a .17 HMR barrel. I'm close to being satisfied with the accuracy from only one of those .22 LR barrels after a lot of work (Re-crown, pillars/bedding, ignition work, lighter trigger), and the .17 HMR gives me a reliable 1-1.5 MOA at 100 yards. Not too long ago, 1.5 MOA for 3 shots at 100 yards was considered good accuracy for centerfire hunting rifles, so I have no complaints about this caliber. Realistically used as intended, no prairie dog would survive in front of it. Really my point is that CZ 455 accuracy is highly variable, whereas Anschütz is consistently good (grauhanen's experience with CZ and Anschütz confirms this), though OP is looking at the used market for his budget. I'd love to see and shoot a 452 at some point, though I don't see myself buying one. I do agree with you that if one is going to buy a CZ, it shouldn't be a 455.
My CZ collection/experience, the one with the Boyd's stock is custom built (tinkering and tuning to the extreme) and while I don't have it completely dialed in yet, it does shoot quite well on average. I'm looking to shoot a really exceptional target with it before posting in the 1/2" challenge thread, I've already shot numerous targets that would qualify with it.
This target is the best performance I have shot to date out of a factory CZ 455, and it took a lot of work to get to this point.
I would say this target fairly represents CZ 455 accuracy, 1/2"-1" at 50 yards on average.
Comparatively, a 64 Annie with custom Shilen will shot gnats off a Donkey's sphincter...
My current 453 Lux is by FAR more accurate than either of my Annie's... and I have had half a dozen other 452/453's that are just as accurate as a battery of Annie 64's. If you compared one hundred of each, I am sure the Annie's would come out ahead, but IME CZ 452/453's are very accurate in their own right. I have no comment on 455's as I have never owned one.
I have owned several CZ 452/453 rimfire rifles. At the price I paid for them, they were stellar performers.
I know the OP said no to several domestic makes, but a Remington 541S or early issue T will outshoot the CZ
Rifles. Even the 581's Manitou mentioned will work. However, they are hard to find, and the price keeps going up.
But $800.00 is in the ballpark for the 541's. Problem: you would have to install sights on a 541. Eagleye.
I know the OP said no to several domestic makes, but a Remington 541S or early issue T will outshoot the CZ
Rifles. Even the 581's Manitou mentioned will work. However, they are hard to find, and the price keeps going up.
But $800.00 is in the ballpark for the 541's. Problem: you would have to install sights on a 541. Eagleye.
I have a first year of production 1958 Brno #5 deluxe version with open sights (front sight hood is not missing) and a first year of production 1957 Brno #4 with a Czech Klinsky stock and both sets of factory sights (diopter/open) with the special Brno engraved wood box for the spare front sight inserts. Let me know if it's something you would be interested in OP.
