Reticles for LR?
- Thread starter coldblood
- Start date
I do yes. If you look in the how to use mildots sticky post I have put some good info in there.
To answer ur Q.
First off a fixed zoom scope is a must. Sizes change between mil dots when the zoom is changed. I use a 10x and shoot to a mile. Not a issue.
.5 hesh marks are key. There are two types of mildots. USMC & Army. One is a circle and one is a oval. Know witch one u have because the size from center is important. (ie, army is usually .2 mil)
Little math. 3.6 will be ur key #. At 100y the distance between 1 mill is 3.6"
To find the distance between a mil you just multiply 3.6 x the range. (ie, for 500y the math is 3.6 x 5 = 18) so u have 18" between 1 mil at 500y
As far as ranging goes you can do it accurately when you know the exact size of the target. When you do not know the exact size a lazier is best used.
Math for this
Height in inches
-------------------- X 27.78 = range
Size in mils
Still saying that not 100% needed.
Train your self to judge random distances. This will be the best key to get you in the ball park.
To answer ur Q.
First off a fixed zoom scope is a must. Sizes change between mil dots when the zoom is changed. I use a 10x and shoot to a mile. Not a issue.
.5 hesh marks are key. There are two types of mildots. USMC & Army. One is a circle and one is a oval. Know witch one u have because the size from center is important. (ie, army is usually .2 mil)
Little math. 3.6 will be ur key #. At 100y the distance between 1 mill is 3.6"
To find the distance between a mil you just multiply 3.6 x the range. (ie, for 500y the math is 3.6 x 5 = 18) so u have 18" between 1 mil at 500y
As far as ranging goes you can do it accurately when you know the exact size of the target. When you do not know the exact size a lazier is best used.
Math for this
Height in inches
-------------------- X 27.78 = range
Size in mils
Still saying that not 100% needed.
Train your self to judge random distances. This will be the best key to get you in the ball park.
The long range shooting I do is f-class and I realy like a fine cross hair with 1/8 minute dot.
I find a mildot to have to large of a dot for target but some guys suse them, look through a few diferent scopes and see what works best for you.
I find a mildot to have to large of a dot for target but some guys suse them, look through a few diferent scopes and see what works best for you.
Thank you guys. Much appreciated. I have read here about FFP. So, I guess, if I buy a FFP scope, the reticle won't change with mag, right? So if I understand correctly, for what I want I need either fixed mag or varible mag with FFP scope with mildot reticle. That narrows things down quite a bit. 
@ AKD: I will read the sticky and will check the scope you suggested.
@ AKD: I will read the sticky and will check the scope you suggested.
Yes a FFP (front focal plane) will allow you to change the zoom and still use mil dots. Just comes with a price.
Mil dots are the way to go. Once you get the hang of them it's easy and life is good. No more dialing the turrets every time you want to change targets.
Mil dots are the way to go. Once you get the hang of them it's easy and life is good. No more dialing the turrets every time you want to change targets.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
What does LR shooting mean to you?
I assume you mean general plinking and smoking rocks. here the mildot and picket fence reticle are the most commonly used.
Depending on distances shot, either FFP or SFP scopes work well. FFP reticles will get large at high mag which can cover the smaller targets. SFP will stay small but the spacing of the reticle only 'works' at one mag (although it is just as easy to make a table for the various mag levels - in general, we don't change our mag so this is moot)
If LR shooting is beyond 500yds to you, reticle subtension is not all that accurate. most shooters will use a laser rangefinder for precise distance measurements.
have a look at my website for tech articles on optics set up.
Let me know if I can help with a scope.
Jerry
I assume you mean general plinking and smoking rocks. here the mildot and picket fence reticle are the most commonly used.
Depending on distances shot, either FFP or SFP scopes work well. FFP reticles will get large at high mag which can cover the smaller targets. SFP will stay small but the spacing of the reticle only 'works' at one mag (although it is just as easy to make a table for the various mag levels - in general, we don't change our mag so this is moot)
If LR shooting is beyond 500yds to you, reticle subtension is not all that accurate. most shooters will use a laser rangefinder for precise distance measurements.
have a look at my website for tech articles on optics set up.
Let me know if I can help with a scope.
Jerry
I will let you know when I will get this all figured out.
Thank you Jerry. I will.
Nothing. But say your zeroed at 100y and a target pops up at 600y. If your profishant with mil dots you can engage much quicker.
Anyone can turn there turrets. Learning mil dots is a rewarding personal advancement.
I have never seen anyone at a match not dial in a scope when we switch from shooting at 300 to 600 .
Maybe for a tactical shoot or something the mildots would be fine ,I guess it just depends what type of long range shooting one wants to do.
Maybe for a tactical shoot or something the mildots would be fine ,I guess it just depends what type of long range shooting one wants to do.
- Location
- Virden, MB
Personally I prefer a fine crosshair. Things get complicated and I get lost. I would rather dial in my ranges. Thats why I pick scopes with target turrets so I can dial on the fly. Mildots are great but I would rather just take a second, use a rangefinder and then dial it in. FFP makes the reticule too big at smaller targets at long range.
Fixed 10X for me. Lase, and then crank the come-ups, mildots for the wind.
Works to 1000, and only the one check of your dope needed for a quick'ish shot.
I don't formally compete, but it gets fair serious between us LR Bro's.
How fast one can hit .... matters.
Works to 1000, and only the one check of your dope needed for a quick'ish shot.
I don't formally compete, but it gets fair serious between us LR Bro's.
How fast one can hit .... matters.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
Playing devils advocate...
how do you know it is 600yds?
If you know that it is 600yds AND are using a 90gr 22cal VLD from a 223 going 2700fps, JBM tells us you will need 20mins of up to reach from a 100yds zero.
The average 308 load would fall a more.... (175gr Mk going 2600fps needs 25.3mins)
Standard mildot reticles have 36 mins along the entire reticle or 18min from center to any one end.
How far down the fat part of the stadia is 2 min? Can you still see your target? What happens when the come up is not to a full minute for that distance?
How long does it take you go turn a dial 1 rev and 5 numbers and aim dead center? With some new gen scope and 20mins per rev. Just go once around.
I know what you are suggesting but when distances get long, the odds of using a reticle for hold over becomes far more problematic. here the picket fence reticle can be better.
If you knew the distances could reach out to whatever, a SFP scope might actually be better as you can adjust the mag to give you MORE reticle adj.
There is not 1 way to look at a problem
YMMV.
Jerry
The voice of experience.
Ironic, that as I post this, the arti guys are on excercise up the hill. Their TOF's?, about 4 seconds.
I like how you said minutes. To keep it simple with mil dots you should use inches for drop rather than moa. Saves you a step in math. Ie, we know @ 300y 1 mil is 10.8", say ur drop is 10". It is easer for the brain to look at that and make a guess hold over rather than look at 3.33moa and convert it. Just saves you a step in math.
With my 6xc I do spin turret but not until 700y. That is my secondary zero and it gives me the distance I need if I need it.
Ps. At 1000y a mil dot is a 9" circle. You can still aim at a 1moa target and be accurate.
Even my self I do not shoot off mil dots 100% of the time. The goal it to be a good rifle man and that includes all aspects.
And how do u know it's 600y ? If you don't know the exact size of the target laze it. If you don't have a range finder than you do a estimated shoot with a fallow up.
*this is from my cell phone*
With my 6xc I do spin turret but not until 700y. That is my secondary zero and it gives me the distance I need if I need it.
Ps. At 1000y a mil dot is a 9" circle. You can still aim at a 1moa target and be accurate.
Even my self I do not shoot off mil dots 100% of the time. The goal it to be a good rifle man and that includes all aspects.
And how do u know it's 600y ? If you don't know the exact size of the target laze it. If you don't have a range finder than you do a estimated shoot with a fallow up.
*this is from my cell phone*
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I was recently doing a job where i might be presented with a fast moving target(up to 30kmh) as it was coming towards me. There is no time to dial so with the reticle I had I knew with a 100m zero the first mildot was 300m, the second 425m, the third was 537m, the fourth 623m and the top of the duplex was 737m. With that said a real mildot reticle is not the way to go because the dot blocks out the target at longer ranges. A TMR or P4 fine with hash marks is the way to go so that you have a aiming mark and a visual on the target at the same.time.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
My guess is that your "target" was a bit bigger then a charging GOPHER
We know reticle ranging is not very precise. Our eyes just don't work that great through the scope. BUT for the application which these reticles were orig designed (min of large hard object), the slight error just doesn't matter.
I am guessing an arty shell has a bit of leeway to flatten whatever it is sent at. So the quick and close enough ranging works superbly.
Look at the target ranging of the Dragunov PSOP scopes. Brilliant. In this application, is anyone going to care if it hit the "wrong" button?
BUT for LR precision shooting as in hitting itty bitty targets like pop cans, clays, gophers and gongs, that 1/4 to 1 min of error both in calc and/or round up WILL cause you to miss.
On my hunting rifle, I am going to put on a Sightron SII Big Sky 3-9 w/ HHR reticle. Their version of a BDC. All I need to know is the general value of each line and put it on target - a target inside 400yds. The target will be big enough that a inch here or there on impact will have zero change in result.
For this type of situation, reticle for drop can work superbly BUT it is very crude and the further you go, the less likely it will work.
Reticles with MOA spacing become far more useful in this situation.
And if you use a reticle, do think in MOA. Way less math involved.
Jerry
Do you guys have pictures through the scopes you use? Do you know if manufacturers show pictures like that? All I find is a schematic with measurements of how thick the lines are on the reticle but not the actual pictures through their scopes...
