Ruger 1911 Navy Seal Edition

[r34skyline]

So why did you insist on comparing retail prices in your very first post of this thread when bashing the manufacturer? You really do sound confused after all...

The change in retail costs are not in the same proportion to manufacturing cost, perhaps they are marking up $60 for the grips but it costs them $55. Or it costs them $5. Similar to the DLC coating. You can go by the retail markup, but for all you know it's extra profit or none at all, I'm simply highlighting that your calculation of running it retail to retail is not entirely accurate nor is it that simple. The grips I know are not that expensive because I know the raw cost of rosewood right now, and even if ruger was paying HK money to their employee that grip would cost at tops 35 per gun, the DLC I have no clue but if they charge $70 on a sr9 if it is anything like glocks tennifer finish, unless they are still paying off the machinery it won't cost them over 100 per gun on something like a full size 1911 and I am being very generous when I say 100.

Incidentally you don't happen to run your own business do you? If so my deepest condolences.

Really? I haven't?

Lets see what you said exactly :



You think that adding custom gold logos, DLC refinishing, polishing, design and production of custom grips, test runs, salaries of the people working on this special project, etc....adds up to 50 bucks extra per gun???? On a limited run of 500??


And you insist on me disproving that, and call MY calculations simplistic and innacurate????



Yah, you're DEFINITELY not running a business.....

It's a dressed sr1911, you seriously think they did any significant amount of testing?

And again with the assumptions. Ah well you are free to think what you will, this is a semi freeish country after all.

 

[Runningfool]

Aside from the production costs, you also have to factor in the cost of a whole host of other things that add up to to real dollars Ruger has to lay out. Some of these like marketing and professional photos have already been touched on. What about the cost of interrupting the standard production to put these 500 guns through? And don't discount the cost of meetings with the big wigs to get this started, art designers who mock up potential designs, more meetings to decide which design to go with, consultations with their coatings people, consultations with their grip suppliers. Let's not forget that someone has to oversee the whole thing. Someone has to keep track of the donation portion of this project and eventually make up one of those big fake cheques to hand over, again with a professional photographer in place to capture it all.

 

[sewktbk]

And you haven't disproven what I initially stated.

Really? I haven't?

Lets see what you said exactly :

Let's say $50 extra per gun, and they are donating $100 per gun to the seal foundation, so if they are charging any more than $150 over the normal gun for a run of 500 guns they are making more profit off it

You think that adding custom gold logos, DLC refinishing, polishing, design and production of custom grips, test runs, salaries of the people working on this special project, etc....adds up to 50 bucks extra per gun???? On a limited run of 500??


And you insist on me disproving that, and call MY calculations simplistic and innacurate????



Yah, you're DEFINITELY not running a business.....

Incidentally you don't happen to run your own business do you?

I do. Two actually. And successfully so.

 

[sewktbk]

It's a dressed sr1911, you seriously think they did any significant amount of testing?

Oh wow. You just like make matters worst for yourself don't you.

When I say tests, I mean production tests. When you design custom grips, put on custom gold logos, refinish a gun...you have to run PRODUCTION tests. As in make sure what you are doing works before you put it into full production.

Or did you think Ruger pressed the pre-programmed "make ready-to-use cheap custom grips" and "pre-tested custom gold logos" buttons on their gun-making machine??? lol....
Why am I even here... You've lowered the intelligence of this discussion to such a low level that I'm insulting myself answering you...

 

[Runningfool]

Actually even going by swektbks simplistic and inaccurate math, ruger is making around 100k in extra profit off these guns. I don't know if they got in trouble or dissappointed their fans at shot show or the reasoning for making this gun, but I can gurantee you they are gonna make extra money off it.

Ruger is just starting to catch up with demand for their 1911s. Honestly, if I was the CEO and someone was telling me we should make a special edition run of 500 guns cause we could charge an extra couple hundred bucks for them I'd tell them to f-off and get back to work!

 

[r34skyline]

Ruger is just starting to catch up with demand for their 1911s. Honestly, if I was the CEO and someone was telling me we should make a special edition run of 500 guns cause we could charge an extra couple hundred bucks for them I'd tell them to f-off and get back to work!

Extra couple hundred? The markup is rumoured around 4-600, even going very extreme with 200-300 extra per gun which is a silly amount of extra money for a manufacturer to spend on a variant of a gun (including the 50k ruger has already cut the nsf) they are gonna make a comfortable 6 figures of extra profit along with a nice little boost in reputation from naive clowns that think this is being done because ruger felt like giving back to the community. You want one because it gives you a boner fill your socks(not literally) but don't be silly, ruger is getting something back from this.

As for that stopping the production line, what? Just grab 1 sr1911 out of 10 and chuck it in a different bin. Till you get your 500, give a couple extra that may or may not pass qc just to be safe.

Or did you think Ruger pressed the pre-programmed "make ready-to-use cheap custom grips" and "pre-tested custom gold logos" buttons on their gun-making machine??? lol....
Why am I even here... You've lowered the intelligence of this discussion to such a low level that I'm insulting myself answering you...

I was going to ask you that very same question. And while it's cute that you think you are being clever with your passive aggressive jibberish, it ain't working. Just saying. You are not the chap in charge of bringing those wondrous straight bolt aks in are you? I do remember you were pushing them hard a while back. Not sure I would classify that as a business success.

You think those grips are handmade? Those grips can be chucked out in a matter of minutes, the whole batch of 500 can be done in a couple of weeks. And finished and passed through qc in another couple weeks tops.

 

[sewktbk]

I was going to ask you that very same question. And while it's cute that you think you are being clever with your passive aggressive jibberish, it ain't working. Just saying. You are not the chap in charge of bringing those wondrous straight bolt aks in are you? I do remember you were pushing them hard a while back. Not sure I would classify that as a business success.

wha...what meds are you on?

You think those grips are handmade? Those grips can be chucked out in a matter of minutes, the whole batch of 500 can be done in a couple of weeks. And finished and passed through qc in another couple weeks tops.

Yah...and in your world, all those couple of weeks are worth 20 bucks a piece in the end! Salaries, machinery, raw materials, varnishing. 20 Bucks!

 

[r34skyline]

wha...what meds are you on?



Yah...and in your world, all those couple of weeks are worth 20 bucks a piece in the end!

How much are you paying the monkey that presses the enter button on the machine and makes sure it doesn't explode?

The machinery is the same as the ones ruger use for their standard grip panels. Rosewood is not that expensive. Varnishing? Are normal sr1911 grip panels not varnished?

http://shopruger.com/sr1911-eaglewings-cocobolo-grips/productinfo/19853/

That is retailed at 34.95 each, so what it costs ruger 34.90 to make one of those?

It's a different software uploaded onto the machine, the costs for producing the different grips ends at the design stage.

 

[sewktbk]

How much are you paying the monkey that presses the enter button on the machine and makes sure it doesn't explode?

So employees are monkeys now. And you want us to listen to you when it comes to business knowledge. Dear god this was funny for a while, now its pathetic.

No wonder you are so clueless about cost calculation, you have no grasp whatsoever on the value of labour, materials, and manufacturing in general. None.

That is retailed at 34.95 each, so what it costs ruger 34.90 to make one of those?

Hey genius, they didn't make only 500 of those. Let me explain to you another concept that you seem to completely ignore ; The less you make of a product, the higher the per-unit production cost is.

At this point I feel like you're either trolling, or i'm argueing with a teenager who skipped highschool.

 

[r34skyline]

So employees are monkeys now. And you want us to listen to you when it comes to business knowledge. Dear god this was funny for a while, now its pathetic.

No wonder you are so clueless about cost calculation, you have no grasp whatsoever on the value of labour, materials, and manufacturing in general. None.

Bye now.

I wasn't aware you required a PHD to press a button or two on a machine that makes decorative pieces of wood.

You haven't told us what the guys wage would be. What would you pay a guy whos job description comes to something as simple as that? You claim to run 2 successful businesses. If that were your "valued" irreplacable employee what would you pay him/her per hour?

Hey genius, they didn't make only 500 of those. Let me explain to you another concept that you seem to completely ignore ; The less you make of a product, the higher the per-unit production cost is.

At this point I feel like you're either trolling, or i'm argueing with a teenager who skipped highschool.

What difference does it make between 500 and 5000 in an item that takes the same skill and time to make as a normal unit? The cost difference ended at the design department, what in this special grip makes it so extraordinary that ruger either had to hire craftsmen to handmake a custom grip, or buy a new machine altogether specifically for this 500? It's a different design uploaded and the machine cut a different pattern on the wood. Base material same, time to make, for any of those computerized machines the difference would be minute. Same finish, same labour. The only difference is design.

 

[Runningfool]

Extra couple hundred? The markup is rumoured around 4-600, even going very extreme with 200-300 extra per gun which is a silly amount of extra money for a manufacturer to spend on a variant of a gun (including the 50k ruger has already cut the nsf) they are gonna make a comfortable 6 figures of extra profit along with a nice little boost in reputation from naive clowns that think this is being done because ruger felt like giving back to the community...

You need to brush up on your math. You've already stated that the msrp on a standard ruger 1911 is $829 and the price of the NS edition is $1200. That gives us a difference of $371. $100 gets donated right? So now we are at $271. And you seem to think that all it costs Ruger is an extra $50 per pistol to design and produce the NS edition. So by your own account, that leaves Ruger making an extra $221 per pistol not $4-600 as you stated above (but it does fall within your very extreme estimate of $2-300).

...As for that stopping the production line, what? Just grab 1 sr1911 out of 10 and chuck it in a different bin. Till you get your 500, give a couple extra that may or may not pass qc just to be safe...

You're joking right? You thinking they can just grab one out of ten assembled guns, chuck it in a bin, and later give it a quick spray? Or did you mean to say that they could just grab a few frames and slides and chuck them in a different bin? Though that would be kind of tough seeing as the special edition guns have have special serial numbers.

 

[r34skyline]

You need to brush up on your math. You've already stated that the msrp on a standard ruger 1911 is $829 and the price of the NS edition is $1200. That gives us a difference of $371. $100 gets donated right? So now we are at $271. And you seem to think that all it costs Ruger is an extra $50 per pistol to design and produce the NS edition. So by your own account, that leaves Ruger making an extra $221 per pistol not $4-600 as you stated above (but it does fall within your very extreme estimate of $2-300).



You're joking right? You thinking they can just grab one out of ten assembled guns, chuck it in a bin, and later give it a quick spray? Or did you mean to say that they could just grab a few frames and slides and chuck them in a different bin? Though that would be kind of tough seeing as the special edition guns have have special serial numbers.

That is what I meant, Are the slides and stuff serialized right away or at the end? Pick the components before serialization, it's not that hard. There is no difference in frame composition. it's a different external finish.

The NS edition has no official price. it is rumoured at 1200-1300. I said 400-600 gross markup over the standard ruger before factoring in the losses from making the special edition. which is around 371-471. so maybe the 400-500 would be more accurate.

 

[Runningfool]

...Rosewood is not that expensive....

Interesting but I'm not sure how that relates at all to the gun we are talking about.

I don't particularly like this gun, I don't particularly like special editions of any guns for that matter. I also don't believe that Ruger is making this special edition out of the kindness of their heart. I just don't see any extra profit on the direct sale of this gun vs. their standard 1911...The alterations to a small lot of pistols costs a lot more than you suggest.
The marketing exposure and goodwill associated with this pistol is where Ruger will make their money. Even if Ruger was making direct profit as you suggest, large companies simply don't go through the headaches and risk of designing, producing, and distributing a special edition for $100K.

 

[sewktbk]

The NS edition has no official price. it is rumoured at 1200-1300.

Wrong again. They retail for $1100 in the states.

http://www.jgsales.com/ruger-sr1911...e,-semi-auto-pistol,-45acp,-new.-p-62551.html

You see how it would serve you better to actually know what you're talking about?

I said 400-600 gross markup over the standard ruger before factoring in the losses from making the special edition. which is around 371-471. so maybe the 400-500 would be more accurate.

OK lets start from the beginning. I'll try to make it real easy for you.

You have a regular Ruger 1911 that goes for $700.
http://www.gunsamerica.com/955584795/Ruger_SR1911_45_ACP_NE.htm


You have a special edition one that goes for $1100. 100 of which goes to charity.

So $1100 minus $100 = $1000

Right? You're still following? Hope I didn't lose you there with all my algebra...

Thats a $300 difference between the limited-run special edition and the regular 1911.

Lets keep your COMPLETELY INSANE evaluation that all it costs ruger to make these guns is $50 a piece extra. This would include The custom finish, the gold logos, the custom grips, custom serial numbers, the marketing, and all project management + design + pre-production costs and salaries. (I'm still unsure how you think your per-unit evaluation of all that makes any sense, but since you are unable to wrap your head around anything else, lets use that number)

$300 - $50 = $250.

So even if we use your own ridiculous numbers, it still doesn't add up to your claim.

 

[TW25B]

You have a special edition one that goes for $1100. 100 of which goes to charity.

So $1100 minus $100 = $1000

Right? You're still following? Hope I didn't lose you there with all my algebra...

Thats a $300 difference between the limited-run special edition and the regular 1911.

Lets keep your COMPLETELY INSANE evaluation that all it costs ruger to make these guns is $50 a piece extra. This would include The custom finish, the gold logos, the custom grips, custom serial numbers, the marketing, and all project management + design + pre-production costs and salaries. (I'm still unsure how you think your per-unit evaluation of all that makes any sense, but since you are unable to wrap your head around anything else, lets use that number)

$300 - $50 = $250.

So even if we use your own ridiculous numbers, it still doesn't add up to your claim.

Are you suggesting it costs ruger $300 extra per gun?

 

[sewktbk]

Are you suggesting it costs ruger $300 extra per gun?

No, I'm suggesting it doesn't cost them $50 extra per gun like r34skyline claims. As I already explained in detail, it probably costs them something closer to 100-150 per gun if you really take everything into account. Product development and design, testing, raw materials, marketing, salaries. This number would go down if they made more of said gun, but remember, the core difference here is that its a limited run. So for the same development and manufacturing process that it would cost them to make 50,000 gun, they are only making 500. Hence why their per-unit cost is higher.

We all know Ruger is going to make a bit more money off these guns compared to their regular 1911. Can you blame them? Do you not understand that making a profit is the very reason these companies exist? Thats not a rip off by any stretch of the term, unless you're against the very idea of investing money and having a return on your investment.

Do you expect them to only break even on their expenses?

If we've established that they are not ripping off anyone AND are taking the opportunity they have as a business to donate 50k to a foundation, sell a nice product, and make customers happy, then I guess the point I'm making is I don't understand why anyone here is whining and calling them evil.

Remember, Ruger could have easily come up with the same gun, in the same limited quantity and with the same features, call it some other fancy name, sell it for the same 1100 price tag and put it all in their pockets instead of donating a portion of the retail price to a foundation. So it really boggles the mind that some of you are butthurt about what they're doing.

 

[hamerdwolfpussy]

I wonder if they are as sloppy and loose as the normal rugger 1911 or if they have taken the time to fit the slide and trigger bar correctly

 

[Shooter1of38]

#### it. I'm buying one for sure. Hell, I may even pay $1800, just to ensure I've overpaid enough.


You think they'll make a double barrelled version.....


that I would buy!

 

[sewktbk]

^^Lol one isn't enough?

 

[Shooter1of38]

^^Lol one isn't enough?

That's crazy talk!