Scope on Canadian C7`s
- Thread starter spartan1980
- Start date
The Elcan is an outstanding piece of kit for known distance shooting. Laying out at the 200 with all the time in the world to get a great site picture and taking your time to gently squeeze off your rounds.
That being said, for room clearing and CQB or even advance to contact,you can't beat an old iron sight, both eyes open instinctive shooting. All the fancy new sights are great for their application. As far as one all around great sight there isn't one. The elcan I found (personal experience) creates tunnel vision and a genaeral convergeance on the objective instead of fighting through the objective it leads to bunching of troops on the objective which all too quickly becomes the X and we all know the X is not a fun place to be!
That being said, for room clearing and CQB or even advance to contact,you can't beat an old iron sight, both eyes open instinctive shooting. All the fancy new sights are great for their application. As far as one all around great sight there isn't one. The elcan I found (personal experience) creates tunnel vision and a genaeral convergeance on the objective instead of fighting through the objective it leads to bunching of troops on the objective which all too quickly becomes the X and we all know the X is not a fun place to be!
The Elcan for its time was cutting edge, but with any new technology it had "teething" problems. The external adjustment and mount were simply bad ideas that were poorly executed. They eventually fixed the mount problem, but you're still left trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
For range work and Service Rifle competition the Elcan was great, but the wandering zero problem and lack of ruggedness does not make for a great combat sight. In that regard I'll defer to the guys who actually heard shots fired in anger and who returned fire using this system.
There are better options and a lot more of them available today. In terms of magnification, the S&B Short Dot reigns supreme, but the latest IOR Valdada is definitely growing on me. There are good choices for low-power, large eye relief models now available from Night Force and in the Leupold MK 4 line as well. Last, but not least, the ACOG from Trijicon. It is a great combat sight that has proven itself in battle and does almost as well on the range. Not the ideal CQB sight, but for a general purpose combat sight for a service rifle, it does everything pretty well and has sufficient magnification to reach out and touch all but the most distant of targets.
For close in and "fun" work under 300-400 yards you can't go wrong with one of the better Aimpoints. They're rugged, waterproof and hold their zero. The EoTech is a great CQB sight, but it isn't as rugged as the Aimpoint. I love it though! Given the years of combat service both types of sight have given in Iraq and Afghanistan the comments made by customdeluxe are simply silly.
When it is all said and done, for 99.99% of us who won't hear a shot fired in anger, it all boils down to personal preference and what our wallets can afford to pimp out our range queens!
Don't forget to check out KevinB's review of combat optics as well! IIRC, he's basically user-tested just about every single combat sight now available at some point or other during his long and storied career...and before he became just another corporate shill! Just kidding Kev! At the end of the day, you can trust his comments and advice a lot more than most of us talking heads here!
The ELCAN is too damn heavy for the level of performance received. The last thing an assault rifle needs is more weight...especially with the taclight, LADs and BUIS that are required. Magnification is nice, but the ELCAN does not interface with NVDs like AIMPOINT or EOTECH. The Army hunts at night!!!!
Used an EOTech this tour with no issues. Made hits out to three hundred with it and held its zero for the tour (8months of busy).
I like the Aimpoint T-1 though. smaller, lighter, longer battery life....hmmmmmm.
Used an EOTech this tour with no issues. Made hits out to three hundred with it and held its zero for the tour (8months of busy).
I like the Aimpoint T-1 though. smaller, lighter, longer battery life....hmmmmmm.
customdeluxe
Member
Sorry I didn't realize that the aim point was such a popular peice of kit, and I wasn't trying to get anyone going. I just didn't see too many of them outside the wire. The guys I talked to that had them said that they thought they were junk, and I didn't notice anything about them that was very impressive. I noticed one guy that had an optic mounted with it to give some magnification, which just seemed kind of mickeymouse to me, why not just use and acog for the same money. The Elcan A2 is an excellent sight. I zeroed it a month before going over and never touched it again. I don't know what they did to improve the elcan but it worked. The last month or so of the tour I used an acog. Personally I liked it better because I am starting to get kind of squinty and the little bit of extra magnification was nice. So again sorry about calling the aimpoint a POS. What exactly is a troll??
Comparing junk to junk, the Elcan was never a sound design, sure good glass but poor choice of mount. Even with the latest gen I am replacing at least 5 a month at work,and that is without heavy use.
I could write volumes on why the Elcan is junk and what should replace it but it has all been said before.
FWIW most of the troops in my unit chose to purchase their own optic (ACOG, Aimpoint,and EOTech) rather than rely on the Elcan in combat,that is pretty telling on the lack of confidence the lads have with the Elcan (and rightfully so). I would rather shoot with irons than that POS.
I initially used the issued Elcan at the beginning of my tour. In approximately 2 month period, I had to zero it 3 times.
I finally gave in and had my wife send over my personal Eotech 512 (without NV capability). I used that for the remainder of my tour (8 months) and never had to zero it again. I did verify zero at least a couple of times a month...no problems.
The other half of my team were American PMT's, who were all equiped with Aimpoints. I can tell you that these guys were out the wire almost every day for their 1 year tour. From personal experience, I know these guys sent lead back the other way on numerous occassions. I never heard any complaints from any of them, about their sighting systmes.
I finally gave in and had my wife send over my personal Eotech 512 (without NV capability). I used that for the remainder of my tour (8 months) and never had to zero it again. I did verify zero at least a couple of times a month...no problems.
The other half of my team were American PMT's, who were all equiped with Aimpoints. I can tell you that these guys were out the wire almost every day for their 1 year tour. From personal experience, I know these guys sent lead back the other way on numerous occassions. I never heard any complaints from any of them, about their sighting systmes.
the Dr Optic up top is nothing more than a poor way of attempting to get a reflexive sight built into a design that is not up to it.
Ideally if you had a Elcan Spectre type flip magnification into a ACOG with better glass and a useful red dot, that does not loose zero when going from 1-4x.
Its out there is the heavy and expensive S&B Short Dot -- but it need to be lighter, and cheaper. plus no one really uses the middle powers - so the flip of the Spectre is the more effective method.
And for the love of God - can we please get a decent mounting system for it.
Ideally if you had a Elcan Spectre type flip magnification into a ACOG with better glass and a useful red dot, that does not loose zero when going from 1-4x.
Its out there is the heavy and expensive S&B Short Dot -- but it need to be lighter, and cheaper. plus no one really uses the middle powers - so the flip of the Spectre is the more effective method.
And for the love of God - can we please get a decent mounting system for it.
