shotshell issues

[Beretta687EELL]

I'd hate to think how many Winchester Super Target shells I have shot. They have never stuck in any of my guns. I have seen a few that they stuck in, Perazzi TMs and Lujtics come to mind.

The early new style AAs had some issues with the base wad coming loose. I had that happen to me with perhaps 1/2 dozen shells. I never had a base wad enter the barrel. They were always stuck in the hull. They would also split periodically on the first firing. I haven't seen that happen for some time, but there may be some older new style hulls out there.

The old AAs had the plastic base of the tube compression formed and then that was inserted into the brass base of the shell. The new style AAs, like most shells made today, have a plastic tube inserted into the metal base and then a plastic base wad is pressed into the hull.

 

[3macs1]

Very interested in the AA info .I am wondering if someone could cross section a AA and the AAhs .so we could see the difference.I have heard of the base comeing loose in the AAhs .I have no experince with them so I can't say .I bought 500 AA from a member in the EE they don't look any different than some old AA s I have.

Here is the old aa. Compression formed one piece with tapered walls

In the center is the new AA hs, Straight walled two piece hull with seperate base wad. Apples and oranges from my limited experience with them.

 

[BCFred]

The early new style AAs had some issues with the base wad coming loose. I had that happen to me with perhaps 1/2 dozen shells. I never had a base wad enter the barrel. They were always stuck in the hull. They would also split periodically on the first firing. I haven't seen that happen for some time, but there may be some older new style hulls out there.

The old AAs had the plastic base of the tube compression formed and then that was inserted into the brass base of the shell. The new style AAs, like most shells made today, have a plastic tube inserted into the metal base and then a plastic base wad is pressed into the hull.

Yes, it was my impression that the base wad issue was happening in the early shells too and that there was a possibility some of the old hulls would still be floating around. In fact, if memory serves, I was shown an article at Redneck Shooting Supplies some time ago reporting that Winchester actually changed the plastic being used in the base wad and 'inadvertantly' solved the problem. Whatever the case, it would certainly be easy enough to miss a base wad stuck in the hull during reloading if one wasn't in the habit of looking in each hull before reloading it. I believe the increasing popularity of Remington hulls comes from the fact they are compression formed as well. I know I was influenced by the debate going on and have been more attracted to the Remington hulls since.
Kind of nice photos 3macs1...

 

[3macs1]

Kind of nice photos 3macs1...[/QUOTE]

Cannot take credit for these Fred. I saved these pics and many others of cut hulls from a post a few years back on another site.
If there are any others you want to see split let me know and I may have it. take care

 

[Bogman]

Reddog, Quit freekin whining and just shoot On another note just bring the shells back to the guy you got them from he may buy them back

 

[Covey Ridge]

Very interested in the AA info .I am wondering if someone could cross section a AA and the AAhs .so we could see the difference.I have heard of the base comeing loose in the AAhs .I have no experince with them so I can't say .I bought 500 AA from a member in the EE they don't look any different than some old AA s I have.

I have never heard of the base comming loose in the new AA from a first hand account. The old AAs have no base wad to come loose and this was not an issue. At one time nearly all base wads were made of rolled paper and there was always a warning about the problem. Now most companies, including winchester have a plastic base wad. I have never heard an account of a plastic base wad commong loose, but there probably is some. As far as I know remington is the only company that makes a single one peice hull like the old AA. Even the much favored gold medal have a plastic base wad. Federal Top Guns are the only paper base wads that I know.

I will cut a couple old and new AAs and attempt to post a pic.

 

[3macs1]

I have never heard of the base comming loose in the new AA from a first hand account. The old AAs have no base wad to come loose and this was not an issue. At one time nearly all base wads were made of rolled paper and there was always a warning about the problem. Now most companies, including winchester have a plastic base wad. I have never heard an account of a plastic base wad commong loose, but there probably is some. As far as I know remington is the only company that makes a single one peice hull like the old AA. Even the much favored gold medal have a plastic base wad. Federal Top Guns are the only paper base wads that I know.

I will cut a couple old and new AAs and attempt to post a pic.

Covey don't cut your fingers. I kept one of every hull produced from 410 -10ga cut in half for reloading reference right from the late 60's until about 5 years ago.Guess I am going to have up see what trash has been made since then to get my bag up to date.
So if there is something you want to see the inside of I probally have it.
Those three are a winchester universal, a win comp formed aa and a win e pert target. I have some win HS just have not split one and put it in the bag.
That last pic should take you back. Remember shooting the black trap AA's or paper federal champions. I bet you do.

 

[Covey Ridge]

Old on Left

 

[rembolt]

Excellent info guys thanks for the pics .after haveing a closer look at the new batch I got from the EE I see they do have a seperate base wad .i will cut one and post a pic also as they look to be different again from what has already been posted.well after cutting it open I see the only difference is the the base wad is made of red plastic rather than white.had a close look at the way its constructed and the only way I can see the base wad coming loose would be with repeated fireings and not resizeing the base.the primer pocket and the out side of the base seem to lock the parts together very well.

 

[Covey Ridge]

We had better not cut too many of these at .05 each

 

[Covey Ridge]

Covey don't cut your fingers. I kept one of every hull produced from 410 -10ga cut in half for reloading reference

I slept a little late and responded to rembolts post first thing after breakfast and 3rd cup of coffee. Should have scrolled the thread a bit more, I should have known you were on ther job hours earlier. Now I have waisted two good hulls

 

[Claybuster]

We had better not cut too many of these at .05 each

The least you might have done is cut a well-used older AA hull.

And where are you getting once-fired old style at 5 cents apiece?

 

[Covey Ridge]

The least you might have done is cut a well-used older AA hull.

And where are you getting once-fired old style at 5 cents apiece?

Well you make a good point as usual but I do not have any well used ones on hand. The most I ever keep any thing is to the third firing or a round of skeet with my 391 which ever comes first. I sometimes pick up during a round of skeet but I pick better ones than I let fly

I don't actually ever buy hulls. 5 cents is the price WSS in Calgary was selling AA HS hulls for. The a.h.e.i.a. range sells once fired AAs for 6 cents after shoots. Other times they do not mind if we pick. Every once in a while I will see trap help about to clean up a rich trap or skeet field. I often tip them to dump into the back of my truck instead of the garbage bin

In spite of doing quite a bit of shooting my hull collection seems to be growing.

 

[Claybuster]

Well you make a good point as usual but I do not have any well used ones on hand. The most I ever keep any thing is to the third firing or a round of skeet with my 391 which ever comes first. I sometimes pick up during a round of skeet but I pick better ones than I let fly

I don't actually ever buy hulls. 5 cents is the price WSS in Calgary was selling AA HS hulls for. The a.h.e.i.a. range sells once fired AAs for 6 cents after shoots. Other times they do not mind if we pick. Every once in a while I will see trap help about to clean up a rich trap or skeet field. I often tip them to dump into the back of my truck instead of the garbage bin

In spite of doing quite a bit of shooting my hull collection seems to be growing.

Mine too. I never buy 12 gauge HS hulls. Any time there is a registered shoot at our club the barrels are filled with them.

 

[Win/64]

Well you make a good point as usual but I do not have any well used ones on hand. The most I ever keep any thing is to the third firing or a round of skeet with my 391 which ever comes first. I sometimes pick up during a round of skeet but I pick better ones than I let fly

I don't actually ever buy hulls. 5 cents is the price WSS in Calgary was selling AA HS hulls for. The a.h.e.i.a. range sells once fired AAs for 6 cents after shoots. Other times they do not mind if we pick. Every once in a while I will see trap help about to clean up a rich trap or skeet field. I often tip them to dump into the back of my truck instead of the garbage bin

In spite of doing quite a bit of shooting my hull collection seems to be growing.

At 5 or 6 cents a Hull I would not be reloading.

 

[Covey Ridge]

At 5 or 6 cents a Hull I would not be reloading.

A while back I saw AAs for sale on EE for .13/hull

 

[Win/64]

I prefer Nitros or STS's over any other hull they just work the best in my loader.

 

[3macs1]

At 5 or 6 cents a Hull I would not be reloading.

From a guy that won't pay 200 for a super x1 barrel I am not suprised.
They have been 10 cents a hull here since I can remember for compression formed.
Think that is high how about 25 cents now each for a 28ga old AA they were always 15 and this will blow your socks off 75-100 for a 16ga AA compression formed.

 

[3macs1]

I slept a little late and responded to rembolts post first thing after breakfast and 3rd cup of coffee. Should have scrolled the thread a bit more, I should have known you were on ther job hours earlier. Now I have waisted two good hulls

Just woke up my self in the old lazy boy. Mrs is gone, girls are with boy friends, MMMMMMM might be a night to watch some hockey and sip some rum.
Now you didnot answer my question in the other post.
Do you remember shooting the black AA trap loads and paper federal champions. My money says you do??s Those black ones were hot, we thought the red lasted 6 reloads and the black 12

 

[Win/64]

From a guy that won't pay 200 for a super x1 barrel I am not suprised.
They have been 10 cents a hull here since I can remember for compression formed.
Think that is high how about 25 cents now each for a 28ga old AA they were always 15 and this will blow your socks off 75-100 for a 16ga AA compression formed.

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