SIG and SAN rifles and gear

[beltfed]

Meh - having to remove the optic is not an ideal set up IMO. Especially when there are other quality optic options out there that solve the issue.

If you needed to switch from optics to irons, it is likely due to the optics going down for some reason or another - why would you want them left on if that was the case?

 

[Scocou]

If you needed to switch from optics to irons, it is likely due to the optics going down for some reason or another - why would you want them left on if that was the case?

+1... that's what I'm thinking. Co-witness is kinda' neat but pretty far from necessary IMO.

If you are proficient in use of a given optic that would be preferable to an alternative you may be less useful with.

Also, Z-Point is not a combat optic, which is likely the only situation co-witness might be required.

No offense intended Clobber', to each their own to meet their needs.

 

[Clobbersauras]

If you needed to switch from optics to irons, it is likely due to the optics going down for some reason or another - why would you want them left on if that was the case?

I don't want to de-rail the thread.....but

With most modern combat optics the main reason for failure would most likely be electronic. If the lenses aren't smashed or obscured then a co-witness solution is very fast to get back onto target/into engagement than having to fuss with a quick release mount (or worse - screws!) to use your irons.

Even a see-through mount would work better, though I find it hard to transition from the optic to see-throughs....at least in my limited experience. It is better than fussing with a quick detach mount though. In the event the optics get smashed the see-through mount has obvious advantages to the co-witness set up.

Co-witness is the way to go IMHO. Sums up what I was trying to get at. Although that being said, I've seen many photos of modern soldiers having no rear back up sight at all on their rifle, just an optic....so what do I know?

 

[greentips]

Why are none of you carbine and CQB guys using an Aimpoint Micro, Zeiss Zpoint, etc? They are the only optics you can use and still get co-witness with the irons - or even use the irons for that matter.... Someone posted that it works. Spending that much money and not having the irons to rely on would bug the crap out of me.....

One day I'll own a carbine...oh yes.....

Co-witness is useless if the optics is fogged up due to rain and temperature - you still need to rip the optic out.

As for aimpoint failing - if you are so close that you don't have time to open a lever, you are probably close enough to use the tube as a ghost ring.

The Swiss arms is not very well set up for co-witnessing - due to the arrangement of the stock and the design of the sights.

 

[Scocou]

I don't want to de-rail the thread.....but

With most modern combat optics the main reason for failure would most likely be electronic. If the lenses aren't smashed or obscured then a co-witness solution is very fast to get back onto target/into engagement than having to fuss with a quick release mount (or worse - screws!) to use your irons.

Even a see-through mount would work better, though I find it hard to transition from the optic to see-throughs....at least in my limited experience. It is better than fussing with a quick detach mount though. In the event the optics get smashed the see-through mount has obvious advantages to the co-witness set up.

Co-witness is the way to go IMHO. Sums up what I was trying to get at. Although that being said, I've seen many photos of modern soldiers having no rear back up sight at all on their rifle, just an optic....so what do I know?

That train has left the station, thread derailed (sorry OP). People will just roll past to the pics anyhow.

IMO co-witness was a term invented to make some guy feel better about his irons obscuring his optics' sight picture .

Co-witness might be useful to witness your sights are 'on'. I can't see that being so paranoid is worth choosing a less preferable optic to gain this "functionality". If your preferred optic happens to co-witness, so be it. I would have a really hard time recommending a consumer-grade optic (Z-Point) for use on a serious combat firearm.

Fuss with quick release? Even the TA51 style screws take, oh... 6 seconds to unfasten. Too long? See below;

See-through mount is an OK feature, but if the target is so close as to preclude the use of an ACOG you should point-and-shoot.

Based on your point above, the lesson should be: don't use a battery powered optic that is susceptible to electronic failure.

Further, the Z-Point is not exclusively powered by batteries so is not likely, by your own rationale, to require co-witness for the reason you state as important (electronic failure).

Aimpoint Micro? Meh... looks like a POS to me (maybe OK on a shottie for turkey huntin'). Sorry to be blunt but you asked why .

Cheers

 

[Scocou]

The Swiss arms is not very well set up for co-witnessing - due to the arrangement of the stock and the design of the sights.

+1... a hooded sight blocks too much of the optics' sight picture, IMO.

 

[BigUglyMan]

The target version of the Black Special has back up irons, though you have to remove the scope to use them.

 

[can14]

Anyone else have a SIG 542 7.62 rifle???

 

[LibertyorDeath]

I've been thinking about trading the CQB for a Carbine... sadly, I don't have all the other Swiss 'parts' that you do.

RULE #1 of gun ownership never sell any guns

 

[ghostie]

I'm pleased to say I recently gained membership to the Swiss Arms club. Love this gun. Put in a few pics of my SIG pistols to go with it (228, 229, 239).