SKS and the Bullpup Conversion Stock Issue.

The SKS's bolt position doesn't make it the greatest for a bull-pup. Wouldn't want to reach past a reciprocating bolt with either arm nor do I want it closer to my face.
 
sunray said:
"...
"...authors of bill 68 actually understood guns..." Not much understanding of English Common Law either. Mind you, Trudeau the Elder and his French gang(and Mulroney's Montreal Irish gang) have been trying to change the basis of Canadian law from English to French Common Law for eons. French Common Law says you're guilty until you prove yourself innocent. The FA's 'onus on the accused' does it.
"...intent was to ban..." The intent was to take another step towards no private ownership of firerarms of any kind in Canada.
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Well said! I m so glad someone actually realized this.
 
98/29 said:
Speaking of Bullpup SKS ...

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It turns that unwieldy Russian thing into such a joy to shoot.

I had a chance to try the SGWorks bullpup in US, aside from the trigger, it's such a comfortable platform.
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LOOKS pretty cool, but I'm not sure I'd want the side of my face pressed up right beside the action
 
fenceline said:
Which is impossible if starting with the SKS as the receiver, the part that constitutes the legal firearm, would have to be fitted to an extension that puts the trigger ahead of the action.

Such a device is commonly known as a stock, ie a bullpup stock.
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And what if one was to construct a slightly modified receiver using a CNC machine that fits the balance of the SKS parts?
 
ronjonjd said:
And what if one was to construct a slightly modified receiver using a CNC machine that fits the balance of the SKS parts?
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See post 18, this thread.

fenceline said:
Using a "new lower receiver" that accepts a modified barrel and an SKS trigger group wouldn't be putting an SKS into a new stock, it would be building a new gun. Legally the receiver is the firearm. If you change that part of the equation you aren't modifying a gun, you are designing a new gun.

Change your suggestion to any gun. Remove the trigger group from an AR, modify an AR barrel and build a new integrated bullpup receiver for those parts. You haven't modified an AR, you have just used AR parts in a new gun design.
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fenceline said:
No. Stock is an addition the firearms initial design that shortens the overall length of the gun. You can't add a stock and call it a new gun design. The receiver is what makes up the core of the firearm, and is why you need a licence to own a stripped receiver.

The Tavor, the type 97 and other non restricted bullpups are not receivers in a bullpup stock. The bullpup design is integrated into their overall function and design of the gun and is not a separate piece. The bullpup theme of the gun is not an addition, but is an integral part of the function of the gun. It isn't just a stock added to a receiver.
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You should re read the post you quoted. The poster said sks parts not an sks.
You could design a bull pup firearm that used all parts but the receiver... This would be a new firearm. As long as the stock and receiver were one unit it would be good to go. Parts are just parts, not the gun itself.
 
Kewl said:
You should re read the post you quoted. The poster said sks parts not an sks.
You could design a bull pup firearm that used all parts but the receiver... This would be a new firearm. As long as the stock and receiver were one unit it would be good to go. Parts are just parts, not the gun itself.
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Um ya. I get it. It wouldn't be an SKS in a bull pup stock. It would be a new gun and thus a totally different proposition. You repeated exactly what I've said.

My point was it wouldn't be an SKS anymore. And it wouldn't be a conversion stock. Apples and oranges.
 
It probably wouldn't be too hard to weld a plate on to the rear of the receiver for a buttpad and then build from there as a bullpup. I have thought about doing this myself, but don't really want to be a test case if arrested. And thanks to a guy at work getting stopped and his legal, short barrel shotgun seized because the cop thought it was prohibited, I'm pretty sure anything even remotely questionable will get me arrested here. He got pulled over in a roadblock looking for prohibited firearms specifically.
Kristian
 
turbo_bird said:
It probably wouldn't be too hard to weld a plate on to the rear of the receiver for a buttpad and then build from there as a bullpup. I have thought about doing this myself, but don't really want to be a test case if arrested. And thanks to a guy at work getting stopped and his legal, short barrel shotgun seized because the cop thought it was prohibited, I'm pretty sure anything even remotely questionable will get me arrested here. He got pulled over in a roadblock looking for prohibited firearms specifically.
Kristian
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You can't use the existing SKS receiver. You can't alter a firearm into a bullpup.
 
fenceline said:
You can't use the existing SKS receiver. You can't alter a firearm into a bullpup.
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The law refers to the stock, not the firearm. If the receiver was permanently altered in such a manner that the barrelled receiver unit could no longer be assembled with the original SKS stock, fire control group, and magazine, I cannot see why there would be a legal problem.
 
tiriaq said:
The law refers to the stock, not the firearm. If the receiver was permanently altered in such a manner that the barrelled receiver unit could no longer be assembled with the original SKS stock, fire control group, and magazine, I cannot see why there would be a legal problem.
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It refers to both the stock and the firearm.

It doesn't say whether you can permanently alter a receiver and how it mounts into the stock, or whether the bullpup stock is only illegal if it is temporary or removable.

Given how a converted auto is always considered a full auto, I wouldn't want to be the test case where I started with a non bull pup, and modified the stock, either permanently or temporarily, by mounting it to the receiver.

From the act...

Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 9

2. Any rifle, shotgun or carbine stock of the type known as the “bull-pup” design, being a stock that, when combined with a firearm, reduces the overall length of the firearm such that a substantial part of the reloading action or the magazine-well is located behind the trigger of the firearm when it is held in the normal firing position.

Given that the receiver is what constitutes the firearm, and the act mentions any stock added to the firearm to reduce its length, starting with a non bullpup, and altering it to a bullpup would be a tough fight in court.
 
If the receiver is the essence of the firearm, assembling it to a stock, a new lower unit, whatever, does not shorten it. If anything, any addition to the receiver lengthens it. For that reason, I would suggest that the law does not refer to a receiver.
 
tiriaq said:
If the receiver is the essence of the firearm, assembling it to a stock, a new lower unit, whatever, does not shorten it. If anything, any addition to the receiver lengthens it. For that reason, I would suggest that the law does not refer to a receiver.
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Do you need a pal to buy a stripped receiver? Yes. Because it is classified as a firearm.

Starting with a traditional receiver, and altering it into a bullpup, in my opinion, will be playing with legal fire. Ymmv, but I wouldn't go that route.

Starting from scratch, building a whole new gun. That would probably work, just like the type 97 or Tavor.
 
I have another question actually.

Is it illegal to own a bullpup stock? Say if you were in possession of an SGWorks stock, which is just some plastic and metal parts ... Is that illegal?
 
fenceline said:
No. Stock is an addition the firearms initial design that shortens the overall length of the gun. You can't add a stock and call it a new gun design. The receiver is what makes up the core of the firearm, and is why you need a licence to own a stripped receiver.

The Tavor, the type 97 and other non restricted bullpups are not receivers in a bullpup stock. The bullpup design is integrated into their overall function and design of the gun and is not a separate piece. The bullpup theme of the gun is not an addition, but is an integral part of the function of the gun. It isn't just a stock added to a receiver.
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Well explained, thanks.
 
fenceline said:
I know eh.
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I guess whatever keeps our neighbourhoods safe! Evil bullpups!

And I thought pinned magazines were ridiculous ... I mean if anyone was to ever go on a rampage or commit crimes with their firearm, what's stopping them from removing that pin?
 
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