SKS is still in service in Ukraine! Look this!

Putin is a very bad news, especially considering the fact that the current western leaders are no match to his guts. He is gutsy, ballsy, smart and vengeful and has a huge ambitions. He is openly challenging the west with his action in Ukraine. And the guy who is sitting now at White House is no match to him.... If it would've been Raigan there now, we would've be seeing the NATO troops in Crimea and no Ukraine issues right now. He did a very dangerous movie- the same thing that Hitler did- he raised the Russian nationalism to the whole new level! Even people who hated him before are now supporting him. He was able to turn his enemies to his followers. Russian propaganda is a very powerful thing....
Nobody knows his next move, we can only guess: it can be one of the Baltic countries where Russians are asking for help, it can be Alaska where local "natives" all of the sudden start speaking Russian and wanting to join Mufer Rusia.....
 
flashman said:
Correct; part of Art 13 of the Third Geneva convention reads "Likewise, prisoners of war must at all times be protected, particularly against acts of violence or intimidation and against insults and public curiosity."

Parading them through the streets would certainly be a violation of that.

Restraining or binding hands is generally no problem, as long as it's done humanely and not as punishment. Detainees in Afg would routinely be zipcuffed, with blacked out goggles & ear defenders put on them; nothing wrong with that as long as it's done for security reasons and not as punishment. IE you couldn't leave someone like that for days, but securing them for a few hours while they are evacuated back through the system to custody is no problem. Restraining the hands of prisoners who have long since been disarmed and are firmly under the control of dozens of armed soldiers seems needlessly humiliating, and unnecessary, but I don't think it crosses the line into war crime.
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You are mixing up the definition of a POW and Detainee. Two majorly separate things. POW have many more rights, they keep their protective clothing, detainees don't. Personal papers POW keep, detainees don't. you cannot bound and blind fold POW, they receive the same minimum treatment your soldiers get. A Canadian gets a hooch, the POW gets a hooch behind wire. Detainees go in a cage two different things.
 
Putin will keep pushing until he gets kicked in the nuts for it. Economic sanctions are meaningless to him - he knows huge chunks of Europe will freeze in the dark come winter without cheap Russian natural gas, so he's got both leverage and guaranteed cash-flow.

Obama is a blowhard academic, with no concept of how the game plays out in the real world. As much as Dubya was a colossal failure, Obama makes him look good in comparison. The divisions in the American public and political world have just gotten deeper, and that makes him even weaker on the world stage than he was when he at least had popular support. Putin knows that Obama has no popular support to call on to rally sentiment against Russian actions. Even though Americans distrust Putin, they trust their own president even less.

To the average American, they can at least understand Putin - a macho, militaristic leader with bravado and balls. Even if they don't like what he's doing, a huge chunk of America will grant him grudging respect for having the guts to do it.

Those same Americans have watched Obama dicker and waffle and prevaricate around the world stage, have no clue where the man really stands, and largely suspect him of just being a gutless coward.

The most dangerous part of all this...

If a strong, fire-breathing, militaristic hawk steps into the Presidential race, Americans will be inclined to go with whoever that may be. Americans may be war weary and sick of playing "world cop," but they also can't tolerate being seen as weak.
 
Don't worry we'll probably see Obama on the platform of the boarding steps of air force 1 waving a piece of paper proclaiming we are going to have peace for our time.
 
ESnel said:
Don't worry we'll probably see Obama on the platform of the boarding steps of air force 1 waving a piece of paper proclaiming we are going to have peace for our time.
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I can see him do that ... a prelude to the nastiest war ever ?

Time to order an ar I guess ...
 
No, I'm not. As far as Canada was concerned, there is no difference. The Canadian position was that even if we weren't bound by treaty, we were bound by custom to afford detainees taken in Afg all the protections of the 3rd Geneva Convention, just as for POWs. By law we would only have to follow Article 3. There is no such thing as a different set of standards for "detainees" as far as Canada applied it, it's simply terminology we used as POW would be nonsensical since we weren't in a declared state of war with anyone. It does not imply or allow a different standard of treatment - a prisoner is either protected by the provisions of the 3rd GC or they are not, regardless of whether you call them POW, detainee, or whatever. There's no "half pregnant" here. Every single person detained by a power during armed conflict is covered either by the 3rd GC (POWs) or the 4th GC (Civilians).
Don't take my word for it though, take DNDs and the MND at the time; http://www.macleans.ca/politics/ottawa/how-the-geneva-conventions-applied-in-afghanistan/
http://www.parl.gc.ca/HousePublicat...0&Language=E&Mode=1&Parl=39&Ses=1#SOB-1558415

I don't know where you got your information on what is and isn't acceptable treatment, but it's mostly incorrect. Yes, they are afforded the same level of comfort as for your own forces. Everyone gets to keep PPE and personal documents. Absolutely, yes, you can blindfold and restrain POWs - if you disagree, please quote the relevant article from the 3rd GC which prohibits it.


RedApe said:
You are mixing up the definition of a POW and Detainee. Two majorly separate things. POW have many more rights, they keep their protective clothing, detainees don't. Personal papers POW keep, detainees don't. you cannot bound and blind fold POW, they receive the same minimum treatment your soldiers get. A Canadian gets a hooch, the POW gets a hooch behind wire. Detainees go in a cage two different things.
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tokguy said:
I know it seems nitpicky; so beg pardon, but...Afganistan isn't a war is it? Therefore the Geneva Convention does not apply correct?
I thought police actions were not bound to the Geneva convention as they are not a 'War'.
Or am I mistaken?
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You are. The 3rd Geneva Convention applies to contracting partied involved in a "declared war or any other armed conflict", including armed conflict not of an international character.
 
This might sound ###ist, but I am very disturbed by the picture of the young lady guarding the prisoners.

126913879_14089392103961n.jpg
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I am reminded of the blunt words of Liudmila Pavlichenko during an interview with American commentator Alice Hughes, 1942.

"I am amazed at the kind of questions put to me by the women press correspondents in Washington. Don't they know there is a war? They asked me silly questions such as do I use powder and rouge and nail polish and do I curl my hair? One reporter even criticized the length of the skirt of my uniform, saying that in America women wear shorter skirts and besides my uniform made me look fat.

"This made me angry. I wear my uniform with honor. It has the Order of Lenin on it. It has been covered with blood in battle. It is plain to see that with American women what is important is whether they wear silk underwear under their uniforms. What the uniform stands for, they have yet to learn."
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We live in interesting times.
 
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One thing I've learned from this thread, and that is I'm glad I kept my bayonet on. I was always wondering if there was still as use for it. Apparently, it's good for goading captives along :)
 
ickster said:
One thing I've learned from this thread, and that is I'm glad I kept my bayonet on. I was always wondering if there was still as use for it. Apparently, it's good for goading captives along :)
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Also good for Deer hunting in case of Zombie Deer:

 
Let me ask you a question.

If Taliban or Iraqis before that, paraded captured Canadian service men as a show off in a specifically staged PR event. Would you post a picture commenting on a rifle in a hands of guard? Just curious where the line is. How about couple of Brits under Argentinian convoy in a mud? US soldier dragged on a street by his feet? Or it is only ok because these are people you never knew from two nations you never had a connection to?

Is this the most interesting and amusing part in a ONGOING civil war where people die left and right as we speak? A ####ing blond and a surplus rifle?

Well, I wish you a great calm life so you will never know what it is.
 
mikethebike said:
sks, good gun, good design, only drawback is the 10 rounds, but then again, Ukraine is short on ammo, so maybe 10 rounds is a good thing, no spray and pray...
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I don't get how Ukraine is short on ammo, I just bought 1000 rnds of 7.62 box says dominion arms manufactured in Ukraine.
 
Yes you are both right. Parading PWs about like this is against the Geniva Convention. That being said the GC only applies to actual war, NOT civil wars, rebelions or inserections such as what is happening right now. So in other words there is no issue and the ICRC (red cross) and the War Crimes commity can go sulk in a corner.
 
Ecks said:
Yes you are both right. Parading PWs about like this is against the Geniva Convention. That being said the GC only applies to actual war, NOT civil wars, rebelions or inserections such as what is happening right now. So in other words there is no issue and the ICRC (red cross) and the War Crimes commity can go sulk in a corner.
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Not trying to be a d!ck (it just comes naturally), but that is 100% wrong.

The Geneva Convention applies "... in times of armed conflict and seek to protect people who are not or are no longer taking part in hostilities; these include the sick and wounded of armed forces on the field, wounded, sick, and shipwrecked members of armed forces at sea, prisoners of war, and civilians."

No get out of jail free card for war crimes committed during a civilian conflict, civil war, or insurrection.
 
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