So the general consensus is the Vanguard S2 is the best of the budget rifles ?

galamb said:
True and I would go further to say that ANY rifle capable of MOA is dependent on the shooter.

I can clamp my Wby's and get MOA out of them. On a good day with a solid front support I can get MOA out them, but if I shoot them like I would in hunting situations an inch and a half is about as good as my "shaky" technique will produce.

But at least they let me shoot 1.5" @ 100. If they were "less accurate" all by themselves I would be, in turn, less accurate when I shot them - so there is still an advantage even if the rifle is better than I will ever be.

And when they do their accuracy testing, for all standard calibers, with Federal Blue Box ammo, which is close to the cheapest on the shelf, you can't ask for much more. It's not like they are telling you that you have to shoot 60 buck a box Nosler Premium to get moa.

Their test "off the shelf" ammo is listed here for each caliber: (does Weatherby recommend specific ammunition for each caliber to get the best accuracy?) http://www.weatherby.com/support/faqs.html
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:agree: My Vanguard .243 shoots just sweet for me at the ranges I tend to use it at.
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For a rifle that would remain just as it is from factory, the Vanguard would be my choice. Personally I think it has good value per dollar.

The Tikka T3 would be second choice, but neither being a truly "budget rifle" in my opinion.



But for me, I never have owned a rifle (or vehicle, or computer, or smartphone, or motorcycle, etc) that I did not spend time customizing and optimizing. For that reason I have a Savage centerfire, a Ruger 10/22 rimfire and a Rem 870 shotgun.

However, for straight out of the box and leave it that way, Howa 1500 all the way.
 
Vanguards? Japanese precision machining...what else is there to say....
For those wanting to learn more about them Google vanguard history part I , II , and III. Quite an interesting birth and history.
 
My son checked out both the Weatherby Vanguard 2 and the Ruger American Compact Stainless...he liked the Weatherby but chose the Ruger American for it's lighter weight and smoother magazine insertion. He preferred the cycling of the Vanguard 2, which was smoother than the Ruger, but when I told him I could smooth that out with a couple of hours of my time and some fine grit sandpaper, he was firm about preferring the Ruger American. I did get the American's action cycling very smoothly, and lightening and lubing the trigger made it a decent rifle...especially since it shoots just under one inch groups at 100 yards with 140 grain Accubonds. The Weatherby is a bit more money, and is a better rifle in most respects, but it just goes to show that you really have to handle them in person to see what you prefer.
 
Buy the Howa.

I just got the 7mm Rem Mag in the Hogue overmoulded stock.

This thing is incredible.

I have never sighted in a rifle so fast.

Yep it is heavy but thats ok.

The kick is not much more then my axis 243 that I just sold.

Getting another Howa.

As far as remington I shoot the VTR in 223 and love it but the stock is ####.

Get a Howa!
 
I was able to just get in on the $399 deal for a blaze 223.I was so impressed with its accuracy that I bought one in a different pattern $499 for a 270.One of my shooting buddy's liked it as well and bought 2 one in 308 and 223.I can't believe how much bang for the buck these are.My trigger breaks at 2.75lbs out of the box .The bolt has the same features as an x bolt meaning you can open the bolt with the safety on.Crazy I paid $1199 2 years ago for a carbon fluted x bolt in 270.I could buy 2 vanguards and have change left over for less than my x bolt which doesn't come with a sub moa guarantee.These vanguards are even cheaper than a CZ455 22lr.I sold my sons savage axis in 243 win,felt like a flimsy piece compared to a vanguard.
 
galamb said:
I own four Vanguard II's in their different (levels) - 1 which used to be their bottom line configuration (synthetic stock) which I picked up for just on 600 bucks, a Sporter version (walnut stock) that ran about 800, a deluxe 70th Anniversary model (high grade walnut/gloss finish) that listed at $1450 and a Laminated stock in the high 900 buck range.

Aside from the synthetic version it's tough to call them an entry or budget priced rifle.

For 2016 they do have a lower cost "select" which is a basic black (plastic) stock that will (msrp) at $599 US, but with our buck in the tank these will probably make it to the shelf with a pricetag somewhere in the 700-750 dollar range - the griptonite synthetic version will run about 100 bucks more.

So while a couple hundred bucks less than a plastic stocked 700 SPS or T3 it's tough to group them in with an Axis, American, Patriot or 783 which you can often pick up at/near the 300 bucks mark for a bare rifle - add 100 bucks and you get entry level "mounted" glass as well.

You really have to "personally define" BUDGET rifle. In today's market an 800 to 1000 dollar rifle, without glass, is really just an "everyday" rifle - not anything special by any description (and just because someone can't afford to drop a grand on a rifle doesn't make it "deluxe").

I own the Wby's because I love the stock, fits me perfect - love the two stage trigger (many hate them) and I don't mind at all that all four of my rifles tip the scales at somewhat over 9 lb's with glass on them - they certainly are not for the "lightweight lovers" that think a bare rifle over 5 3/4 lbs is a non-starter.

But if you can find some of the (now discontinued) stock still on the shelves (the flame camo etc) at prices below 600 bucks you will be hard pressed to get a better built/better finished rifle "for the money" that you don't have to swap stocks, bed barrels/actions, swap triggers etc to get a guaranteed, out of the box, sub-moa rifle shooting Federal Blue box ammo.

When 2016 prices get fully in effect the Vanguard II will stand almost alone in the 700-800 dollar range as a quality rifle.
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Thank you galamb, this is a great overview.

Since I hadn't done adequate research on this rifle didn't realize it averaged $3-400 more than the other budget rifles. So it's really only a great "budget" deal when they put the gross stock versions on sale !
 
One "negative" thing I will say about the vanguards is that the stock doesn't fit me..... now, of course, that is just me.... But I would suggest that you shoulder before you buy.... The one I had was an excellent shooter off of the bench, but in a hunting situation, the pull up and engage just didn't work well.... This was fixed with a Boyd's for me.... I have since moved it along like many others but it was a great shooter overall......
 
I haven't shot the S2 yet, but I've shot a hundred rounds through a T3 and was incredibly impressed. Thats some serious value for under a grand.
 
Love the original vanguards. Haven't shot an S2 but I'm sure its as good or better. I have a Howa 1500 Lightening SS/Hogue in .300winmag and it's been my go-to rifle for years. You can't go wrong with any of them.
 
Superbrad said:
One "negative" thing I will say about the vanguards is that the stock doesn't fit me..... now, of course, that is just me.... But I would suggest that you shoulder before you buy.... The one I had was an excellent shooter off of the bench, but in a hunting situation, the pull up and engage just didn't work well.... This was fixed with a Boyd's for me.... I have since moved it along like many others but it was a great shooter overall......
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Never concerned whether a rifle fits me or not but I know what you mean. If I like the rifle over all (accuracy, controls, balance, a finish that won't rust just looking at it, etc.) I either change the rifle to fit or adapt and make it work. Guess that comes from carrying military rifles an awful lot. About my only problem with stocks is if the LOP is too long ... which I can cut down. I go into it assuming I have to raise the comb. Rest I can deal with. ..... Even the flames !!
 
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I haven't shot one of the new Vanguards, but if it's better than the old ones like people say, it's a hell of a rifle. The prices have come up quite a bit though from the previous version. I bought my 30-06 for $450 from wholesale sports, a month before they were cleared out at $350 to make room for the S2's. I showed wholesale sports though, I bought another one. This ones a 243 with a walnut stock with rosewood tip. They were on for $470 at the time, an absolute bargain. I think the regular price t the time was around $650. I keep seeing these sales on the S2's and it's tempting, but so far I've managed to hold myself back. Maybe next time they have some 223's with a #3 countour or heavier barrel I'll pick up an S2.
Kristian
 
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