Stopping Rifle for the Great Bears

Ted, i can see it on your second post. it was good to talk about that event this morning... and i was one of the lucky that heard the story from the rifle holder himself ...

i always forgot to tell about the hornady bullet as some are in love with despite the repeated failures ...
 
How about this one, then? A bit smaller, but still easy to see the story.

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Ted
 
Slamfire said:
One shot DRT kills are the norm on heavy game with my high speed .40+ calibers properly loaded. Not a recommendation but I favor my high speed .40+ calibers for hunting in Bear territory. Even more so after the recent go-round with my .375 on Bull Moose. :p
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You mean your experience with a ".30/30 Long" on moose...
 
9.3mauser said:
Why not just take a spare rifle if you're going to take all that? Op said he had a Husky, I'm assuming M98; why would you need a spare bolt? The only things you might need spares for are the extractor, firing pin, and ejector spring. You could take a spare follower spring if it makes you feel better, but nothing is going to go wrong with the follower.
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You are almost certainly correct, but why bother with bolt parts when a complete bolt could be taken. I'm all for making things as easy as possible.
 
Slamfire said:
A credible source with vast field experience, Master Alaskan Guide Andy Runyan wrote an article in the 12th edition of Handloader's Digest in which he describes the incredible stopping power of high speed .40+ calibers on Big Bear -

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Big Bear stuffed-up with a .300WM then stomped with a high speed .40+

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The 9.3-.375's are popular. Decent heavy game hunting rounds than lesser calibers in my estimation but as stoppers marginal at best? Lighter and faster 9.3-.375 bullets should impart more shock than heavier and slower 9.3-.375 bullets? But still lacking in cross-sectional area to impart devastating shock to be 1 shot Big Bear stoppers? Lacking in straight-through heavy bone smashing penetration capability?

No mention in the article about 9.3-.375's other than his guides gave up their .375's for high speed .40+ calibers and never looked back.

One shot DRT kills are the norm on heavy game with my high speed .40+ calibers properly loaded. Not a recommendation but I favor my high speed .40+ calibers for hunting in Bear territory. Even more so after the recent go-round with my .375 on Bull Moose. :p

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I can post a bunch of quotes from another Master Alaskan Guide, Phil Shoemaker, whos new favorite cartridge to back up his brown bear clients is the .375 Ruger. Phil also routinely uses his .30-06 to back up his clients.
 
bcsteve said:
I can post a bunch of quotes from another Master Alaskan Guide, Phil Shoemaker, whos new favorite cartridge to back up his brown bear clients is the .375 Ruger. Phil also routinely uses his .30-06 to back up his clients.
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Yes, and Shoemaker is one of the best in the business today, and has been for many years.

The most important thing in this endeavour is that the shooter must be able to handle the rifle well enough to shoot it quickly and accurately offhand, and most important of all, be able to recover from the recoil and shoot again.... accurately! This is not nearly as easy as most think, and requires lots of practice, not from a bench, but standing.

I had a 458 Winchester for a while, but ditched it because I never could master that rifle. The 375 H&H and 358 Norma were pussycats in comparison. I used them for years, and killed plenty of game using both, but the 9.3X62 just swings and points like an extension of my arm, and recoils like a maiden's caress. Well, not quite, but you get the idea.

Ted
 
bcsteve said:
I can post a bunch of quotes from another Master Alaskan Guide, Phil Shoemaker, whos new favorite cartridge to back up his brown bear clients is the .375 Ruger. Phil also routinely uses his .30-06 to back up his clients.
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He also used the .458 so much and so long that he is associated with it too. He actually uses .458 Win for
his board-name.

If classic examples of light , medium and heavy cartridges are all so good, then maybe everything else in between are pretty good too. Maybe it just doesn't matter all that much.
 
Personally I'd go with my 458 wm bolt action or my sxs 45/70. I shoot these rifles often and I'm very confident in them
That said the experiences I've had with the boring old 30/06 would lead me to believe I'd be just as confident in a rifle so chambered if it fit well

I'd probably go with a shorter barrel 458 wm as mine is 26.5" long. Swings great but it's a hunting gun first and a backup gun second. When I am forced to go in the thick after a wounded bear I prefer my sxs 45/70. It doesn't have the fancy numbers. It doesn't shoot flat. It just kills well and I've yet to use it against a bear that needed the the other barrel. The rim offers great extraction. The action allows longer barrels while keeping over all length down. 2 barrels 2 triggers. Best of all its built on basically the same frame as my sxs 12 ga which I have over 60000 rnds thru.
Just get comfortable with what ever you take.
I've only dealt with black bears but I'd feel the same against bigger types
 
Wouldn't surprise me if some of these companies force you to use their well worn supplied 870 Express 12 ga.'s with cheap Winchester soft cast slugs with the rims all chewed up from loading/unloading for "insurance liability reasons".
 
Maybe bring a few boxes of brennekes in case they make you use their shotgun. Foster slugs do not inspire confidence.
 
madashell said:
Wouldn't surprise me if some of these companies force you to use their well worn supplied 870 Express 12 ga.'s with cheap Winchester soft cast slugs with the rims all chewed up from loading/unloading for "insurance liability reasons".
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You may be right, however those "cheap Winchester soft cast slugs" might work pretty well at short range. A good friend of mine up here, a long time trapper, killed a huge grizzly with a single round of #6 shot using his 20 ga. The bear was about five feet away when he pulled the trigger, and the hole in the skull was just big enough to put two fingers in.

Some serious cool to wait that long, even though everything happens so fast.

Ted
 
Why not? said:
You may be right, however those "cheap Winchester soft cast slugs" might work pretty well at short range. A good friend of mine up here, a long time trapper, killed a huge grizzly with a single round of #6 shot using his 20 ga. The bear was about five feet away when he pulled the trigger, and the hole in the skull was just big enough to put two fingers in.

Some serious cool to wait that long, even though everything happens so fast.

Ted
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I remember reading some old advice for Grizzly defence (these predate the internet) and it was a load of #3 shot over 5 drams of powder. And of course being very close.
 
An article from March 2005, One of the Last Alaskan Sourdoughs, The Legend of Sheep River (Ed Stevenson). He's all over the map with calibers tried for hunting (not necessarily stopping wounded) Big Bear over the years. Some of the more salient points in the article -

1. .300 Wby lacks caliber and bullet weight for Big Bear.
2. .375 H&H mag. Model 70 with barrel cut back to 20" was a common guide rifle, but experienced a near-fatal failure using one.
3. .338 WM provided mixed results, lighter bullets don't penetrate well.
4. .35's work with properly constructed heavy bullets.
5. .411 Hawk lever rifle (350gr@2300 fps) is a favorite.
6. .450 Alaskan lever rifle (405gr@2100 fps) is another favorite.
7. .45-70 Model 1886 lever rifle is also a favorite (405gr@2000 fps), used it to stop a Big Bear wounded with a .375.

His preference for .40+ is apparent. ;)

https://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/article.cfm?tocid=1532&magid=104
 
Slimbo said:
Maybe bring a few boxes of brennekes in case they make you use their shotgun. Foster slugs do not inspire confidence.
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The post I made above was actually because of a guy I met who did this for a living. I mentioned Brenneke slugs as well and said they were not allowed to bring own ammo for "insurance liability reasons".

One of those "if you value your job" more than your life kinda things ..
 
Thanks for all the advice guys! I've got a 12 gauge in the cabinet just in case that I carried for Grizzly protection this past summer, but it looks like the 9.3 is the way to go by all accounts, probably with Woodleigh PP 320 grainers. is there a commonly available reloading manual around with that sort of information?
 
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