Tavor vs. Swiss Arms
- Thread starter Disaster Monkey
- Start date
IchBinEinSniper
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Brockvegas
Don't worry...it was in jest...I have owned a bunch (and still own) as I love them...but I have been flamed on here many times for liking it better than many other "high end" black rifles.
It was a separate sentence
I did like that rifle, not as refined as the other two but it was reliable, light, and shot well.
I owned one from the first shipment in the country, shot left handed, and disagree with you.
You need to account for varied eye relief and check weld positions.
Not only is it uncomfortable and unhealthy, if you have an out of battery detonation, it is stupid.
Glad you value your wife's well being ...
The HK uses a similar gas system but the AR180 was not the parent, not even a distant cousin. The 180 was around first but that doesn't mean much. There are plenty of rifles around that use similar operating systems that other than that have nothing to do with each other.
The AR180 was another great design by Stoner and he had visions of it replacing the AR15 but the US military had already committed to the AR15/16 platform and wouldn't swap to a new rifle that was only slightly cheaper to produce.
It isn't unloved, I miss mine and made a deal with my friend that I sold it to that he wasn't allowed to bastardize it trying to make it an AR and that when he was ready to sell it I have first dibs.
It WAS a 1:7. It's gone now so I don't care any more.
There is nothing wrong with the polymer lower. Failures were experienced by idiots that abused their rifles by unlocking the rear and letting the upper swing open under the weight of the barrel. When it hit the lower all the force was transferred to the hinge-pin and would snap it off. The lower would not fail under normal use as there is no force on the hinge when the rifle is closed unless you dive into a ditch using your rifle to break your fall.
I can shoot 1/2 MOA 5 shot groups at 200yds with my DTA 338 Lapua and my Savage 308, Plus my HK is shooting less than 2 MOA with 6 out of 7 types of ammo I've tried in it.
What do you think?
I think I just got a rifle that didn't like American Eagle 55gr FMJ.
What language are you speaking?
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
Yea, I agree it can be done, but the rifle is so much more stable and enjoyable to shoot if held in the Isreali hold that the gun was designed for. I tried that and took brass so hard in the chin that it was landing back into the ejection port and jamming. My chin was a mess of semi-circular holes from the rim of the brass after a hundred rounds.
If you hold the rifle more like an American holds an AR, the brass isn't a problem, but the rifle is less efective and more unstable.
Sounds to me like you have those other rifles figured out (with the exception of maybe the HK), which leaves me wondering how you shot your Sig & other semi autos. Mounting a semi for accuracy isn't like most bolt guns (unless maybe you have completely eliminated the slack in the take-down pins & thereby the upper and lower halves).
My experience with dirty bird is a fairly consistent 2-3 moa @ 100m, but it does wander about a bit. It is good general FMJ - nothing more.
Additionally, I believe the rifles with 7 twist barrels were brought in as a special purchase order for an entity outside of Switzerland that never materialized.
I believe they were intended as a general duty rifle, and as such don't think those had any type of accuracy guarantee from the factory.
This is hearsay though, the folks at CSC probably know the straight dope on that.
The HK is getting close.
Mounting a semi? I put it on the bags with one bag just in front of the magwell and one under the buttstock.
It was a flat top target madel with 1:7 twist.
It doesn't matter any more, the rifle is gone.
If you can handle a little extra weight the HK has a better barrel and is a better platform for accuracy.
I swapped out the glass and put my Burris 4-12 laser rangefinder scope on it. Should be much better for load development and accurate shooting.
I hope to get out a couple days this week and will report back with how it does.
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Actually there were a number of rifles that failed during normal shooting not related to overextension. I have seen photos of the front hinge split inline with the bore on a number of rifles. I had a chat sometime ago with a gent at Armalite who confirmed that early rifles could, and a few hinges did fail in that manner. They figured the forward inertia of the bolt assembly during loading coupled with constant forward pressure from the return springs were the likely culprit. StormWerks makes an aluminum replacement hinge that corrects this issue. Interesting to note, it appears the Armalite created the moulds for the the 180B lower right off of the original 180 without engineering any reinforcements or consideration for the particular properties of the polymer they used. Latter lowers were beefed up in the hinge area.
Yeah, a lot of guys get into the buttstock and get a good comfortable grip on the pistol grip with one hand and hold onto the rear bag with the other. It is a recipe for disaster with a semi - especially if your upper is fairly loose fitting (as most Sigs are) hammer fall is enough to mess with the POI
I've had an SL-8. They are an inferior platform to the Sig even in accuracy.
Hmmm, I had one of the last 180B's that came into Canada. I can't see how they would fail under normal use.
Probably the same type of failures as my HK USP, I told them I only shot factory loads hoping for warranty.
I wouldn't tell them I popped the rear latch and let it swing open if mine broke either.
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Hmmm, so there is some magic way to hold the Swiss if you want to be able to hit anything and they are usually a loose fit between the upper and lower which you say is bad for accuracy yet it's a superior platform to the HK?
You're funny
It is a superior battle rifle, I'll give you that.
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Hmmm, I had one of the last 180B's that came into Canada. I can't see how they would fail under normal use.
Probably the same type of failures as my HK USP, I told them I only shot factory loads hoping for warranty.
I wouldn't tell them I popped the rear latch and let it swing open if mine broke either.
My rifle is fine as well, I do have a latter, factory modified lower though.
Hmmm, so there is some magic way to hold the Swiss if you want to be able to hit anything and they are usually a loose fit between the upper and lower which you say is bad for accuracy yet it's a superior platform to the HK?
You're funny
It is a superior battle rifle, I'll give you that.
G36 performance is still unmatched in most areas, the only thing holding it back was the chassis it uses...
