That sideways thread.
- Thread starter suprathepeg
- Start date
I also owned the 858,...and liked it,..the trigger was decent,...it was reliable,..and cheap as hell. At the time I could not get a decent scope mount or comp,...and did not like the how the mags rock in and out to change...
I should have kept it,..it was cheap to feed,..and would have made a decent ####s and giggles gun.
I think we're falling victim to a couple of things on the XCR price issue. First, we have our own 'special' version with features that don't offend the USDOS - special "muzzle break", 18.6 inch barrel, non-folding stock. I'm surprised (and pleased) that Robarm bothers, it would be much easier for them to produce 16" folders all day, that's the gun they want in the US - let's face it, it's the one we'd want too if it wasn't restricted. Then we have import costs- brokerage, permits, shipping (paper BS and fuel surcharges). Also throw in that, for no logical reason (I know, there are reasons, but they aren't logical given the relative strength of our economy) our dollar just tanked 1/5 it's value in 7 days, and we're off to the races. Personally I'd love an 11 inch XCR with a folder - and I don't care that it would be restricted, but it's not going to happen. Neither is mass market pricing on a niche market product. Sorry.
That's how I force you to listen to me 
But in all seriousness... the price is pretty much how it is going to be. One of the drawbacks of making almost everything on the rifle yourself and everything else being taken care of by a fellow U.S. vendor can be quite expensive. Our profit margin isn't all the amazing. I wish there was more I could do for you guys.
But in all seriousness... the price is pretty much how it is going to be. One of the drawbacks of making almost everything on the rifle yourself and everything else being taken care of by a fellow U.S. vendor can be quite expensive. Our profit margin isn't all the amazing. I wish there was more I could do for you guys.
Mr Wolverine
CGN Regular
- Location
- Manitoba. Canada
I think it is time I added my comments, even at risk of getting into a pointless mud slinging match.
The price of the XCR in Canada is set by us (Wolverine Supplies) as we are the exclusive Canadian importer for Robinson Armament products. The retail price is based on our landed cost, we then add on a margin which allows us to offer a very modest 17.5% discount to the trade and hopefully still make a profit at the end of the day.
Yes that’s right a PROFIT, we make money on everything we sell, if we did not, we would not survive. A discount to dealers of only 17.5% is an insult, expenses typical run from 15 to 20 %, for dealers. When I say dealer I mean those stores that have genuine premises, employees, rent, heating, advertising and liability insurance etc etc. A 17.5% discount is really only a courtesy and simply allows retail customers to purchase from their local stores. We all need to support local gun stores so that we keep our whole industry alive.
It is suggested that other importers are needed in order that the price is lowered! Strange logic here, the sums just do not make sense. Right now I would take 300 XCR rifles from Robinson Arms but we can’t because we are limited by the US State Dept limiting export licenses to a max of 45 at a time. No matter if the quantity was 45 or 300 our price would be the same.
Supply and demand can have a bearing on price, we have approx 190 XCR rifles sold and 45 coming, we could raise our price dramatically and they would still all sell, but we don’t. We could stop all sales to dealers and make an extra 17.5% on those rifles and they would still all sell, but we do not. When our dollar strengthened we lowered our price, we did not have to, we could have sold them all anyway.
The XCR we sell in Canada is not exactly the same as the model sold in the US and has extras included in our price, this makes direct comparisons difficult.
The importation costs are not cheap, it amazes me why some Canadian gun owners expect to purchase US products in Canada at US retail prices. We are expected to absorb all the costs of importation, why? It is back too that dirty word PROFIT, well I am not ashamed to admit that I work for a PROFIT. We have expenses which include fixed costs, these are the same every month whether we sell 45 or 190 XCR rifles. We do not gouge people, we sell good products at fair prices that we stand behind.
The dollar has dropped 25% I could raise my price on the next XCR rifles by 25% and still sell them all, but I will not. When we paid for these rifles, several weeks ago (another expense) we calculated our cost based on the exchange rate and announced the price then, that we will honour.
I take offence to the following, written anonymously, why ? not enough balls to sign your name below your wild statements?
We have a RobArm rep on the forums, so why don't we let the company know that it would be better for their sales if they would engage other retailers that would bring the price inline with actual value of the rifle? This is a $1400-$1500 rifle at best so lets see a realistic price. Why not talk with Marstar or Canam, they seem to be in touch with the market.
Price and value, now we get into economics and scale of production, design and development costs, machinery skilled labour, quality control, liability and warranty. Quite honestly I am amazed that rifles like the XCR are as cheap as they are!
The price of the XCR in Canada is set by us (Wolverine Supplies) as we are the exclusive Canadian importer for Robinson Armament products. The retail price is based on our landed cost, we then add on a margin which allows us to offer a very modest 17.5% discount to the trade and hopefully still make a profit at the end of the day.
Yes that’s right a PROFIT, we make money on everything we sell, if we did not, we would not survive. A discount to dealers of only 17.5% is an insult, expenses typical run from 15 to 20 %, for dealers. When I say dealer I mean those stores that have genuine premises, employees, rent, heating, advertising and liability insurance etc etc. A 17.5% discount is really only a courtesy and simply allows retail customers to purchase from their local stores. We all need to support local gun stores so that we keep our whole industry alive.
It is suggested that other importers are needed in order that the price is lowered! Strange logic here, the sums just do not make sense. Right now I would take 300 XCR rifles from Robinson Arms but we can’t because we are limited by the US State Dept limiting export licenses to a max of 45 at a time. No matter if the quantity was 45 or 300 our price would be the same.
Supply and demand can have a bearing on price, we have approx 190 XCR rifles sold and 45 coming, we could raise our price dramatically and they would still all sell, but we don’t. We could stop all sales to dealers and make an extra 17.5% on those rifles and they would still all sell, but we do not. When our dollar strengthened we lowered our price, we did not have to, we could have sold them all anyway.
The XCR we sell in Canada is not exactly the same as the model sold in the US and has extras included in our price, this makes direct comparisons difficult.
The importation costs are not cheap, it amazes me why some Canadian gun owners expect to purchase US products in Canada at US retail prices. We are expected to absorb all the costs of importation, why? It is back too that dirty word PROFIT, well I am not ashamed to admit that I work for a PROFIT. We have expenses which include fixed costs, these are the same every month whether we sell 45 or 190 XCR rifles. We do not gouge people, we sell good products at fair prices that we stand behind.
The dollar has dropped 25% I could raise my price on the next XCR rifles by 25% and still sell them all, but I will not. When we paid for these rifles, several weeks ago (another expense) we calculated our cost based on the exchange rate and announced the price then, that we will honour.
I take offence to the following, written anonymously, why ? not enough balls to sign your name below your wild statements?
We have a RobArm rep on the forums, so why don't we let the company know that it would be better for their sales if they would engage other retailers that would bring the price inline with actual value of the rifle? This is a $1400-$1500 rifle at best so lets see a realistic price. Why not talk with Marstar or Canam, they seem to be in touch with the market.
Price and value, now we get into economics and scale of production, design and development costs, machinery skilled labour, quality control, liability and warranty. Quite honestly I am amazed that rifles like the XCR are as cheap as they are!
Can I get a refund then
Refund,.. I missed out on 3 XCR's before I got mine used in the Exchange forum. They ALL sold out within the first day....
I tried offering $100 less than what most sellers wanted,..but they had already sold them.
If you have one,..I would say you could sell it for almost the current retail price.
JOhn,...as you know,...some people want a whole lot of something for nothing. I do my best to support Canadian businesses,..and I realize there is a whole lot of hours that go into getting the nice toys you get into the country. thanks and I appreciate your work.
I think you should buy the mini-30 target,.....and enjoy using the 5rd mags.
If you go thru life not getting what makes you happy,...you will never be happy. Spend the Xrta $ and get an XCR. You obviously want one,....as your thread seems to be calling out for an XCR, but not wanting to pay the price the market in Canada lists it at...........
I could have got an AR 180b,..and then I would have got the rail system,..the mounts.....stocks,.etc....
It would have cost about the same as the XCR, but why bother. I just bought it and then have fun. No dicking around for parts.
That is a waste of time.
Davy Crockett
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley
Refund,.. I missed out on 3 XCR's before I got mine used in the Exchange forum. They ALL sold out within the first day....
I tried offering $100 less than what most sellers wanted,..but they had already sold them.
If you have one,..I would say you could sell it for almost the current retail price.
I was just being a smart a$$.
I'm happy with mine.
I agree with you. The XCR, at the current price, doesn't interest me at all. If they offered it in 7.62 or 6.5 Grendel and the price came down by 500$, I might be interested. But right now, I think my 2+K is better spent on something else.
Your logic is correct, if more importers were able to supply us the XCR then prices would go down. However, there's one more thing to consider.... Is it in the mfr's best interests to find another importer? More guns sold into Canada != more profit. It's not possible that the mfr will be able to dump 1,500 of these guns off on importers to sell into the Canadian market at US equivalent prices and sell them all to make a decent profit. There is not that much demand for it. So it is also in the mfr's AND importer's best interests to keep supply slightly lower than demand, in order to maximize their profit.
It's just business. If people want these things at the current price, by all means help yourself.
Starscream
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Alberta
XCR vs golf club?
I find it Ironic that for all the talk about right being right and left being out to lunch, some ppl here think it is their right to have guns at cheap prices. Then when they don't get it, they either start a thread #####in' about the prices in the EE or they trash the product and say it is not worth it. For a forum of so called "right wingers", free enterprise seems to take a backseat to desire for regulated markets making guns and ammo cheap.
Quit 'yer #####en and pay what it costs. If you don't like it, take up a cheaper hobby.
Quit 'yer #####en and pay what it costs. If you don't like it, take up a cheaper hobby.
