The next custom an Oberndorf M98: What to chamber it in?
- Thread starter Ardent
- Start date
I have never owned a 35 or 416. But have friends who do and CONSTANTLY extoll their virtues. I am a 375 man myself but assumed you had a couple of them already. Do the honourable thing and get it done up in 375 H&H or like myself I use the 375 Ruger just to be different.
I know you mention "no 9.3z", but I always thought a nice little 20" 9.3x57 would be a cool rifle. You had some wood on the EE that would be perfect for such a project.
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/1754397-Exhibition-Walnut-Mau
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/1754397-Exhibition-Walnut-Mau
What ballistics did you get with the lil 375 rimless nitro? I was looking into making one for a bear gun for walking miles of logging roads. Not that its needed as i have over options but i like to be different
I also love the 458wm and wouldnt mind a 458-2"
- Location
- Southern Vancouver Island
That's me 1st choice exactly.
Of course, the OP gets his chosen chambering for this project so I'd go with .458 Win mag with 22" tube.
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Actually 99% of my light .375 experience is with the H&H culling, but at excactly .375 2 1/4 Nitro ballistics, I downloaded it with H4895, or SR4759 and filler. I shot literally truckloads of game (well, land cruisers full) in Zimbabwe with 235 and 270gr reduced .375 H&H loads, and they were so feebly ineffective at knocking game over with identical hits compared to the .30-06 I should have let the idea die there. The animals all died but usually after a run, where as the .30-06 and cheap 150s was tipping them over reliably within a jump or two of the hit. In thorn bushes with 1-2” spines that’s desirable. Anyhow finished my Satterlee, remained underwhelmed with heavy and moderate, and sold her. The buyer promptly rebarrelled it himself too. I’ll admit I can’t see a .458x2” being useful, the .458 Win is already criticized for its lack of speed, and is small enough. But it sure has some history already.
And still have the wood guys, indeed this was what she was slated for, restarting the project idea.
Thanks for the experience. My want of the 458-2" is basically a bolt action 4570 for 300-405gr bullets for a deer rifle in timber. I have a sxs 4570 but cant play around with loads in it due to regulation and i have a beautifully stocked 458wm that i love but id prefer not to use it as a bush basher. I know its likely to get dinged up when i take it to africa but somehow marring it over there doesnt bother me. I use it for black bear here and it works very well
Good luck with the project in what ever caliber you choose
Good luck with the project in what ever caliber you choose
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
This is all academic debate now and I find it interesting, so by no means take me as trying to tell you I’m right. This is my favourite part of discussing hunting rifles around the fire, the minutia.
I’m of the opposite thinking on thick bush cartridges. We’re in what almost certainly vies for the nastiest bush in Canada, the Pacific Northwest rainforest, and the thought of something taking a death run into devils club or slumping under deadfall on a 40 degree slope out of sight is anxiety inducing. I do understand the meat damage argument for those primarily concerned with net poundage in the freezer, but find that quality modern bullets pushed fast only really jello the parts I’m not interested in eating anyhow when placed correctly- ribs and organs. I see “meat damage” as proof of “terminal ballistic effectiveness”.
Tests have shown an 1,100fps 400+gr .458 bullet is disrupted as much by brush in flight as a 2,850fps .30-06 or even faster .270, that is to say there is no such thing as a brush buster, that’s a myth. I can understand the desire for a soft recoiling rifle, which the mild medium and big bores are, but so is a .243, .260, or 7x57 and you don’t sacrifice the speed or trajectory. In BC non-expanding bullets, such as the hard cast as preferred in heavy and slow big bores like a .458x2”, are of questionable legality as well. Many will spit their coffee at that statement and have been using them for years, and feel the regulation only applies to FMJs and intends to prevent the use of military ball for hunting and I agree that was the initial intent. I personally have my home and hunting business on the line have no interest in testing the meaning of non-expanding bullet in court.
End of the story for me is make it quick, not stupid quick just finding the animal at 2,500fps or higher impact speed when inside a couple hundred yards, and a lighter for caliber quality bullet. It’s remarkably effective at putting animals down, offers marginal recoil in all standard chamberings, and has a far more workable trajectory. The heavy and moderate stuff I feel is from a bygone era of poor quality expanding bullets that were unreliable, and powders and actions of yesteryear. This said I’m a nostalgic type and love the .404, .318, etc or at least the idea of them. While the .318 isn’t slow the .404 certainly is, but makes up for it in panache. Likely the safe for you with the truncated .458, it’s just “cool” and I get that.
This build has been short listed to include one I didn’t put on the list and applaud the thread input for that, down to .404 Jeff, .375 H&H, .458 Win, .318 WR, and 7x57.
I’m of the opposite thinking on thick bush cartridges. We’re in what almost certainly vies for the nastiest bush in Canada, the Pacific Northwest rainforest, and the thought of something taking a death run into devils club or slumping under deadfall on a 40 degree slope out of sight is anxiety inducing. I do understand the meat damage argument for those primarily concerned with net poundage in the freezer, but find that quality modern bullets pushed fast only really jello the parts I’m not interested in eating anyhow when placed correctly- ribs and organs. I see “meat damage” as proof of “terminal ballistic effectiveness”.
Tests have shown an 1,100fps 400+gr .458 bullet is disrupted as much by brush in flight as a 2,850fps .30-06 or even faster .270, that is to say there is no such thing as a brush buster, that’s a myth. I can understand the desire for a soft recoiling rifle, which the mild medium and big bores are, but so is a .243, .260, or 7x57 and you don’t sacrifice the speed or trajectory. In BC non-expanding bullets, such as the hard cast as preferred in heavy and slow big bores like a .458x2”, are of questionable legality as well. Many will spit their coffee at that statement and have been using them for years, and feel the regulation only applies to FMJs and intends to prevent the use of military ball for hunting and I agree that was the initial intent. I personally have my home and hunting business on the line have no interest in testing the meaning of non-expanding bullet in court.
End of the story for me is make it quick, not stupid quick just finding the animal at 2,500fps or higher impact speed when inside a couple hundred yards, and a lighter for caliber quality bullet. It’s remarkably effective at putting animals down, offers marginal recoil in all standard chamberings, and has a far more workable trajectory. The heavy and moderate stuff I feel is from a bygone era of poor quality expanding bullets that were unreliable, and powders and actions of yesteryear. This said I’m a nostalgic type and love the .404, .318, etc or at least the idea of them. While the .318 isn’t slow the .404 certainly is, but makes up for it in panache. Likely the safe for you with the truncated .458, it’s just “cool” and I get that.
This build has been short listed to include one I didn’t put on the list and applaud the thread input for that, down to .404 Jeff, .375 H&H, .458 Win, .318 WR, and 7x57.
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I’d certainly put that tall tapered beauty at +250 right now. Dangerous game legal, good grizzly bear stopper, good plains game cartridge, likes shorter barrels. And I already load it.
Dangerous game legal, good grizzly bear stopper, good plains game cartridge, likes shorter barrels. And I already load it.I can admit to having a 400gr woodliegh 458 slug veer off after leaving my muzzle at 2425fps. Hit a 1" thick alder while taking a shot at a broadside running bear and watched the sand kick up behind the bear.
I agree high velocity kills well and everyone on your list has a vast history of success but wide diameter bullets at modest velocity also work. Ive killed alot of white tails with muzzleloaders. 50 cal 270gr to 338gr at 1700fps ish lays deer down quick and is still capable of going thru both shoulders and exiting. It doesn't take much to kill a whitetail i know. Even the 3030 is said to be great with out the fancy ballistics to support it. For 15 to 50 yard shots a soft 300 to 405gr bullet above 1700 fps and around 2000fps for the lighter weights will work for my purposes as my 4570 works great for close shots. A shorter version of the win mag should duplicate it and in a bolt gun i can load any bullet profile i wish and brass is endless. Its also a nicer option to hand to newer hunters and shooters that may not take kindly to a 458 wm. Im not a fan of reduced loads really.
I know from experience my 2506 is really hard on deer at 30 yards even with a behind the shoulder shot. Its nice to have a site like this that allows ppl from all over to share experiences. Id love to hunt a west coast grizzly someday but im headed to africa first. The reason i bought my 458wm in the first place. The hard part is deciding to bring another rifle or a shotgun. I love bird hunting as well so im leaning on borrowing a shotgun once there and bringing a 2nd rifle. Two of my choices are also on your list so this has been a thread of interest. So far the bulk of my centerfire hunting has been in thick boreal forests so shots are close. I cant wait to hunt plains game and cape buffalo
I agree high velocity kills well and everyone on your list has a vast history of success but wide diameter bullets at modest velocity also work. Ive killed alot of white tails with muzzleloaders. 50 cal 270gr to 338gr at 1700fps ish lays deer down quick and is still capable of going thru both shoulders and exiting. It doesn't take much to kill a whitetail i know. Even the 3030 is said to be great with out the fancy ballistics to support it. For 15 to 50 yard shots a soft 300 to 405gr bullet above 1700 fps and around 2000fps for the lighter weights will work for my purposes as my 4570 works great for close shots. A shorter version of the win mag should duplicate it and in a bolt gun i can load any bullet profile i wish and brass is endless. Its also a nicer option to hand to newer hunters and shooters that may not take kindly to a 458 wm. Im not a fan of reduced loads really.
I know from experience my 2506 is really hard on deer at 30 yards even with a behind the shoulder shot. Its nice to have a site like this that allows ppl from all over to share experiences. Id love to hunt a west coast grizzly someday but im headed to africa first. The reason i bought my 458wm in the first place. The hard part is deciding to bring another rifle or a shotgun. I love bird hunting as well so im leaning on borrowing a shotgun once there and bringing a 2nd rifle. Two of my choices are also on your list so this has been a thread of interest. So far the bulk of my centerfire hunting has been in thick boreal forests so shots are close. I cant wait to hunt plains game and cape buffalo
The .404 doesn't have to be slow. There's no reason why it can't be loaded to run neck and neck with the .416 Rigby. I like the nostalgic aspect of the .318 as well, but when it comes down to brass tacks I doubt it will prove any more effective than a .30/06 loaded with 220's.
The .458 lacks ### appeal, but Phil Shoemaker spent his career standing behind one as his back-up rifle with no complaints. A five-round magazine and a 23" barrel would be a pretty effective PH rifle.
