Top of the line optics...
- Thread starter 1899
- Start date
Spent a little time looking through it at SHOT last year. Amazing optic but at $6k or so (IIRC) I'm out. Hopefully the NF Beast will finally be released this spring, I think this will be the best alternative to the S&B to come out thus far. Only thing I'm not thrilled about is the fine adj. lever.
ultimate_monkey
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- victoria BC
^^^ to bad it's expected to be well over 5k when they are even available
I have the hensoldt 6-24x56. I love the glass, the reticle (mil), most everything about it. I am having issues with tracking and POI changes. I have not been able to 100% pinpoint the issue yet, but am really hoping at this point it will not have to be a warranty job. really looks like its leaning towards that.
I use a Sightron SIII 6-24x50 on my 308 and a Nightforce NXS 5.5-22x56 on my DTA SRS 338 Lapua and am happy with both of them. If I had an unlimited budget I would have either a S&B or a March. Magnification range is up to you.
My CF sniper buddy was out shooting with me and he never dialed my scopes up past 10 and we were shooting about 700yds and he said even when shooting past 1000yds he never dials up past 10 power. It can be done without high magnification, it's just personal preference.
My CF sniper buddy was out shooting with me and he never dialed my scopes up past 10 and we were shooting about 700yds and he said even when shooting past 1000yds he never dials up past 10 power. It can be done without high magnification, it's just personal preference.
Although S&B is the optics that all others are compared to, they are apparently starting to slip in the QC department. I was originally going to purchase a S&B scope, but after reading about all their recent issues, I decided to go with 2 other high end European optics brands instead. Why spend that much money if you're not sure if you're going to get a lemon or not? Even Frank Galli (AKA Lowlight on the 'hide) has been persuading people to look at brands other than S&B, that certainly says something...
Here are some of the optic brands I would look at if I was in your shoes (and I was, twice this year!): NF (particularly the new BEAST that is coming out, it supposedly has great glass from those that have handled it), Khales, Steiner, US Optics, Premier (though they've had their own trouble in the past). Hensoldt has great glass and eyebox, but their reticle choices leaving something to be desired. If they have a reticle you want, I would through them on your list as well.
Happy scope hunting!
Here are some of the optic brands I would look at if I was in your shoes (and I was, twice this year!): NF (particularly the new BEAST that is coming out, it supposedly has great glass from those that have handled it), Khales, Steiner, US Optics, Premier (though they've had their own trouble in the past). Hensoldt has great glass and eyebox, but their reticle choices leaving something to be desired. If they have a reticle you want, I would through them on your list as well.
Happy scope hunting!
You're clearly very un-educated on High end LR/Tactical optics. Steiners 5x mag range "military" series are the equal to the S&B's Premiers, Etc. Superb optics in every respect. Their 4x line was heavily influenced by Burris as they collaborated on the design ( Stener was out of the scope market for many years). These are not in the same league as the 5x mag range scopes: 3-15x50 & 5-25x56.
I have S&B PMIIs , Premiers , and having used both , I now only use the benders , I HATE the MTC ( heavy clicks every full mil , ie 1.0 , 2.0 etc ) makes hard to get say 1.1 mils , due to the heavy click , so for ME the Premiers & some Zeiss/henys are out , as they have MTC , the latest Zeiss monster 3.5-26x56 FFP scope , has MTC feature .
Also , I donot like the locking turrets S&B use , I think some of the reccent porblems with PMIIs are with the new locking turrets .
So I chose NOT to buy any S&B with locking turrets , or any scope that uses a MTC type function , on the Premiers , I also donot like the camlocks used for zeroing etc .
What every scope you get , please get the knobs and reticle same/same , also , look very carefully at what direction , you wish to standardise ON , most USA scopes use a CCW E up rotation , where Europe uses CW mainly .
If you envision using both USA made scopes and European made scopes , go for CCW as it means that no matter if you use a NF or Bender you can go CCW .
NF scopes are all CCW only .
In 308 , 3-12x50 or the 4-16x50 PMII are good , just be advised the 3-12 is available in ST or DT , and the 4-16 only as a ST ( single turn ) .
Most European scopes are available as CCW or CW turn direction .
I find the S&B , Zeiss & Kahles all as top contenders , BUT , no MTC for me , so no Zeiss for me until they offer it with out this terrible feature , in theory MTC sounds like a really good thing , BUT in actual practice , it sucks big time .
Later Chris
Also , I donot like the locking turrets S&B use , I think some of the reccent porblems with PMIIs are with the new locking turrets .
So I chose NOT to buy any S&B with locking turrets , or any scope that uses a MTC type function , on the Premiers , I also donot like the camlocks used for zeroing etc .
What every scope you get , please get the knobs and reticle same/same , also , look very carefully at what direction , you wish to standardise ON , most USA scopes use a CCW E up rotation , where Europe uses CW mainly .
If you envision using both USA made scopes and European made scopes , go for CCW as it means that no matter if you use a NF or Bender you can go CCW .
NF scopes are all CCW only .
In 308 , 3-12x50 or the 4-16x50 PMII are good , just be advised the 3-12 is available in ST or DT , and the 4-16 only as a ST ( single turn ) .
Most European scopes are available as CCW or CW turn direction .
I find the S&B , Zeiss & Kahles all as top contenders , BUT , no MTC for me , so no Zeiss for me until they offer it with out this terrible feature , in theory MTC sounds like a really good thing , BUT in actual practice , it sucks big time .
Later Chris
So I guess that a new scope - 1 year old has come out - that is built by a company that hasn't really built their own scopes and usually sells cheap binoculars is now equal to some of the most proven and successful scopes sold by the top manufacturers. I guess I am really uneducated. But thanks for the useful comment.
great thread. Here are my thoughts,
Years back I had a Loopy 16x Mk IV. Nice scope, then I looked through a S&B 5-25 PMII, took out a loan and bought one (seriously). Mounted it, loved it, until I noticed the black marks inside the glass. After repeated attempts I determined it was not going to fall off (as I'd been told it should). I made arrangements to return it to the dealer I purchased it from, who I'm sure thought I was having buyers remorse over the unit. Until he looked through it. Since he didn't have another I was told to keep it until he could sort out a replacement. I got a call from S&B and was told a new one was on the way. Since I had a match coming up they told me to use it and abuse it, and sent me an email with the same info, telling me it would be cut up when returned. So it got used, and abused. tossed across a gravel parking lot (after the match) remounted and still held zero. dropped on the ground, used as a bat with small rocks, remounted, still held zero (mount was not removed). New glass showed up, beat up scope went away. New glass had same issue, was only about 5 or 6 off the other scope by serial number. Call S&B talk to I think, Sabine, told same thing, big sorry from them, this scope also treated poorly by me before 3rd scope arrived, it is perfect. S&B also sent me a nice care package with lens cleaner kit and some patches, pins and a letter telling me the girl who painted the reticles on 18 scopes had flicked reticle paint on the lenses and hadn't removed it properly. I assume she was either fired or re-trained. After witnessing the abuse that those two scopes took and could still function fine, one with a slightly bent turret, I doubt I'll ever own a different brand, ever.
Years back I had a Loopy 16x Mk IV. Nice scope, then I looked through a S&B 5-25 PMII, took out a loan and bought one (seriously). Mounted it, loved it, until I noticed the black marks inside the glass. After repeated attempts I determined it was not going to fall off (as I'd been told it should). I made arrangements to return it to the dealer I purchased it from, who I'm sure thought I was having buyers remorse over the unit. Until he looked through it. Since he didn't have another I was told to keep it until he could sort out a replacement. I got a call from S&B and was told a new one was on the way. Since I had a match coming up they told me to use it and abuse it, and sent me an email with the same info, telling me it would be cut up when returned. So it got used, and abused. tossed across a gravel parking lot (after the match) remounted and still held zero. dropped on the ground, used as a bat with small rocks, remounted, still held zero (mount was not removed). New glass showed up, beat up scope went away. New glass had same issue, was only about 5 or 6 off the other scope by serial number. Call S&B talk to I think, Sabine, told same thing, big sorry from them, this scope also treated poorly by me before 3rd scope arrived, it is perfect. S&B also sent me a nice care package with lens cleaner kit and some patches, pins and a letter telling me the girl who painted the reticles on 18 scopes had flicked reticle paint on the lenses and hadn't removed it properly. I assume she was either fired or re-trained. After witnessing the abuse that those two scopes took and could still function fine, one with a slightly bent turret, I doubt I'll ever own a different brand, ever.
No problem, now you know.
unstableryan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Beautiful Okanagan Valley
I just googled that 8-80x March... My god do I ever want one. Would go great on my stainless heavy barrel, thumb hole stocked .17hmr 
With a decent 16x it's a super fun gun watching your bullets hit things. That March scope would be better than a youtube video.
With a decent 16x it's a super fun gun watching your bullets hit things. That March scope would be better than a youtube video.
That is a beautifully true statement. Cut lips and cold soup come from this all too often.
