Transporting an antique revolver in the tundra

pres717

pres717

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I found some good info on other threads, but I'd like to make sure I'm clear on this. Anyone who feels they know please add your 2 cents.

If I was to obtain an antique revolver, can I carry it (unloaded) in a holster while driving on my ATV or in a boat in remote wilderness areas? I know it is legal to discharge where I can shoot my non-restricted guns, so when I get off/out of the vehicle then I can load, walk around, cook over my fire, fish from the shore, have a cup of tea while loaded in my holster? From what I can tell there is no other requirement when in transport other than being unloaded. So unloaded in a holster should be okay? Ammo in my pocket while driving, and loaded otherwise?

I am considering getting one to use as an alternate to my long gun for predators when out in the tundra. Just hate the idea of having to load and unload every time I get on and off the quad. I think it would be safer to keep it loaded for the entire outing rather than load and unload it a dozen times for the day with my small children following me around. But hey, the RCMP thinks it is safer so I'll be a good peon.
 
You are in Nunavik. If you are serious about a firearm for emergency situations involving dangerous predators, like a polar bear, you will want a real gun, not an antique popgun.
Don't know about Nunavik regulations involving loaded firearms and motorized vehicles. Also don't know about the policies of your police service. In general, is Quebec a good jurisdiction in which to be carrying a loaded, holstered pistol, antique or not?
 
tiriaq said:
You are in Nunavik. If you are serious about a firearm for emergency situations involving dangerous predators, like a polar bear, you will want a real gun, not an antique popgun.
Don't know about Nunavik regulations involving loaded firearms and motorized vehicles. Also don't know about the policies of your police service. In general, is Quebec a good jurisdiction in which to be carrying a loaded, holstered pistol, antique or not?
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Yes tiriaq, I am in Nunavik. I always carry a shotgun or rifle on my ATV with me, but I often wander away from my vehicle (and gun) while I am out. There is no substitute for a long gun for polar bears, but I am thinking more for the summer to have a handgun for wolves (I should say as as a back up to the "real gun", alternate was a bad word choice). :) I am quite impressed by a couple of antique centre fire revolvers I have seen recently. I had no idea this quality existed in an antique status, hardly a pop gun (kudos to the seller).

Where I live there is absolutely no one policing outside the town, and guns are very accepted here. Weather this is legal or just over looked people walk and drive around with guns in the open, we still do celebratory gunfire from our doorsteps for New Years, PAL is not asked for when purchasing guns or ammo at the local Coop and a 12 year old can buy ammo alone at the store.

In reality the majority drives around with their guns loaded, some hunt from the road while on their ATV, occasionally guns are discharged within the town limits, high capacity magazines are not uncommon. No issues there. I really see no reason why the government restricts their use here. I am just trying to understand the law perchance someone will show up one day who will make a fuss.
 
You guys should push for the right to carry for self protection up there! If most people are pro gun it should pass easy enough.....

I don't think antiques are considered firearms under are silly laws so none of them apply.
 
I have a bit of an idea what things are like in the North, having lived in NWT/NU for over thirty years.
I am amazed that the Co-op is selling guns without seeing a PAL, and without doing a transfer. This will bite them in the azz sooner or later. Businesses have to be able to account for their inventory.
If you are carrying a holstered pistol, even out on the land, it will be noted, and people will talk about it. The word will get around.
There are limits on the power that can be wrung out an antique revolver. If you think that one would be adequate for protecting your family in a dangerous situation, go for it.
 
Can-down said:
You guys should push for the right to carry for self protection up there! If most people are pro gun it should pass easy enough.....

I don't think antiques are considered firearms under are silly laws so none of them apply.
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Antiques are firearms under the law, although regulations for acquisition, possession, transport and use are more relaxed.
The OP is in Quebec. Do you really think that the Quebec Gov't/Quebec CFO is going to start issuing ATTs? Who is going to pass this?
 
Criminal Code of Canada sections regarding firearms and the use or abuse of firearms apply to all of Canada. The CCC definition of a firearm is "any barreled weapon which discharges a projectile capable of causing bodily harm or death to a person"....or something very close to that. This makes all firearms, including antiques, accountable to the sections of the Criminal Code. I find it hard to believe that it would be OK to have antique revolvers loaded on your hip. Am I wrong? I hope so. They (antiques) are not firearms for the purposes of the Firearms Act but are under the CCC. Dave....PS - I had a "Permit to Carry" all the while I was a police officer but when I retired it was taken from me. I am also a licensed trapper as well but can't get a carry permit for my trapline either.
 
2c comin at ya

the debatable part,as always,is what constitutes use and transport.

14. (1) An individual may store, display or transport an antique firearm only if it is unloaded.
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5. CC s. 95: Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" (which is also a "restricted firearm" or a "prohibited firearm"), or one with readily accessible ammunition is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.
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when you are traveling on your atv,are you transporting,or is it in use?

if in use you can keep it loaded on your hip...if in transport it has to be locked in an opaque box...hardly handy for your purposes and a pita every time you stop an get off.Faster and easier to sling a carbine.



Under the current legislation, "any antique firearm" is not a "firearm" for the following purposes:

1. Firearms Act: None of the provisions of the Firearms Act, including those requiring registration, licences, ATTs and/or ATCs, apply to any "antique firearm."

2. CC s. 91 and 92: Possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal.

3. CC s. 93: Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location is legal.


4. CC s. 94: Being in a motor vehicle with any "antique firearm" is legal.


5. CC s. 95: Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" (which is also a "restricted firearm" or a "prohibited firearm"), or one with readily accessible ammunition is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.

6. CC s. 99: Transferring or offering to transfer any "antique firearm" is legal.

7. CC s. 100: Dealing in any type of any "antique firearm" is legal.

8. CC s. 101: Transferring any "antique firearm" is legal if the transfer apparently violates the Firearms Act.

9. CC s. 103 and 104: Importing or exporting any "antique firearm" is legal.

10. CC s. 105: Not reporting the loss or finding of any "antique firearm" is legal.

11. CC s. 106 and 107: Not reporting the destruction of any "antique firearm" is legal, and knowingly making a false report of that type to a firearms official or the police is legal.

12. CC s. 117.03: A peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is not authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, and/or ATC.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------



ANTIQUE FIREARMS-storage,transport,display




14. (1) An individual may store, display or transport an antique firearm only if it is unloaded.


(2) An individual may transport an antique firearm in an unattended vehicle only if


(a) when the vehicle is equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is in that trunk or compartment and the trunk or compartment is securely locked; and



(b) when the vehicle is not equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is not visible from outside the vehicle and the vehicle, or the part that contains the antique firearm, is securely locked.



(3) An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
 
My Take on this is, its in transport on any moterized Atv or boat with outboard car truck ect ect. but once you step off the ATV you can load it and the gun is now in use.
As long as you can target shoot in the tundra then you should be OK.
But driveing around on or in anything with a motor id say its at the very least gota be unloaded.
maby im wrong but thats the way i see it.
can you shoot a non restricted rifle while rideing around on a ATV i dont think so so the same rules apply to the antique. id keep it in a locked case / compartment unloaded untill you get where your going.
That can be a locked non see thru compartment on the ATV or old tool box.
takes a second to unlock and load and shes ready to go, pop it in your holster and away you go.
 
Dantforth said:
Criminal Code of Canada sections regarding firearms and the use or abuse of firearms apply to all of Canada. The CCC definition of a firearm is "any barreled weapon which discharges a projectile capable of causing bodily harm or death to a person"....or something very close to that. This makes all firearms, including antiques, accountable to the sections of the Criminal Code. I find it hard to believe that it would be OK to have antique revolvers loaded on your hip. Am I wrong? I hope so. They (antiques) are not firearms for the purposes of the Firearms Act but are under the CCC.
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You missed reading section 84(definitions) of the criminal code, it's on page 109:

Certain weapons deemed not to be firearms.

(3) For the purposes of sections 91 to 95, 99
to 101, 103 to 107 and 117.03 of this Act and
the provisions of the Firearms Act, the following
weapons are deemed not to be firearms:
(a) any antique firearm

Brotherrockeye has kindly made more detailed references to these sections of relevant criminal code.

Now that said, if you act in a criminal manner such as threaten, conceal, rob a 7-11 with said antique the gun now becomes a firearm uder the criminal code definitions and you get to enjoy the hospitality of the Crown.

Back to the OP's question, most jurisdictions consider an ATV as a vehicle, as such you should follow transport regs for antique handgun, unloaded and in a opaque locked sturdy container. To say the loaded holstered antique handgun "is in use" on the ATV and not in transport would get you the same unpleasant reception as someone trying to argue a loaded shotgun on your truck's dash is ok because you are road hunting and "it's in use":cool:

Otherwise once you get off the ATV,fill your boots carrying it loaded in the bush as long as your sensitive to any jurisdictional specific hunting regs or municiple bylaws.

Incidentally, I have echo everyone else's sentiment about using and antique handgun for preditor protection... it's a bad choice, it's better than nothing, but not by much.
 
So far my most compact friend has been my 8.5" barreled grizzly 12 gage. Takes up little space and is non-restricted. I carried a pistol years ago when I worked for an armored car company for many years and I shoot IPSC too. Part of me thinks it is just stupid why we can't use one up here. I checked on the RCMP site and it says for a wilderness carry permit that I have to be engaged in a professional occupation (or something to that wording). Picnics and fishing are apparently bad reasons. I watched an episode of some cop show in Alaska on tv recently and the cop walked up to a guy fishing. Guy had a loaded S&W 500 revolver sitting beside him on the rocks. No problem... in fact the cop even thought he made a good choice for personal protection. I was a bit envious. The older I get, the more my idea of common sense seems to be getting further and further from the collective Liberal opinion. I see how some old people can be grumpy. I read up a bit on the Libertarian political party... to bad they got no chance cause they got some great ideas.
 
A far better use for the antiques than predator protection, is simply the enjoyment of using them relatively unfettered, in an appropriate location - like the tundra, or even the 'back 40'. You never know when a marauding squirrel is going to charge, or a deviant stump looks at you funny. All very legitimate reason to discharge an antique.
 
Bowie said:
A far better use for the antiques than predator protection, is simply the enjoyment of using them relatively unfettered, in an appropriate location - like the tundra, or even the 'back 40'. You never know when a marauding squirrel is going to charge, or a deviant stump looks at you funny. All very legitimate reason to discharge an antique.
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:) You made me smile Bowie. I agree!
 
people would be better off putting their efforts into re-establishing/demanding the return of hand gun hunting all across Canada instead of trying to circumvent the existing silliness by using antiques. IMHO
 
Pete04 said:
people would be better off putting their efforts into re-establishing/demanding the return of hand gun hunting all across Canada instead of trying to circumvent the existing silliness by using antiques. IMHO
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Agreed. But there isn't a bear in the world that won't take notice of this.....

remington5070001.jpg
 
tactical870 said:
Agreed. But there isn't a bear in the world that won't take notice of this.....

remington5070001.jpg
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Nice one!

Wait till they see my 1870 gasser 6 shot 11.75 mm pistol :D
I think my Huge gasser would put the ho down on anything pretty much.
Im sure a few Polar bears been shot and killed with werndle carbines and 1870gasser pistols useing the same Hi power round in the russian or siberian artic.
Them Ruskies and other norhern european nations like them BIG handguns.

I just got my frist 1870 Gasser today and holly crap its fricken huge.
 
Heres a picture before shes cleaned up a real monster of a handgun.
even tho its open top its supper strong gona have me some fun with this gun LOL

Thats a 45 schofield below the 11.75 round.
the 11.75 is just about a 45 70 just a whisker smaller in dia at the back last part of the case.

P1010061_10.jpg
 
Pretty much you'll have to load/unload when on any vehicle, same as all standard firearms. Antiques are only exempted from registration and Restricted laws.

Plus with exception of those hand cannons, I wouldn't rely on them for defense. Even if they're made to handle big loads, the fact is that they are at bare minimum 113 years old, and the repercussions for misjudging the strength of an antique when loaded hot are pretty extreme.

For less than 1/2 of your average antique 45cal pistol you can have a mares leg lever gun or a fraction of that, a short barreled shotgun.

I'm all for taking antiques out and shooting them, but the risk of getting complacent and not taking a proper firearm with you in your environment could be unpleasant.
 
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