I clearly agree with you regarding the outfitters a prized trophy like the big horn ram should not go to any rich American, but to a resident of Alberta. However the reality is that there is big money with APOS, especially with sheep allocations (Charlie Stricker sold two allocations for $150,000.00 and that was 12 years ago at least) and they will not go away anytime to soon. If I was the Premier of Alberta, so long APOS.Yeah I know it's topic drift, but last year that I sat down and added them up I came up with over 20 deer that were available in Alberta. Lots of them does, but that was between the general tags, special area tags (Strathcona County, etc.) and the like. Lots of travel, lots of having to be flexible in your choice of arms.
On the sheep front, I'm not so happy to have the outfitters concerns being the driving force on management strategy. Not a sheep hunter myself, but am a fan of fairly open opportunity, which, to me, means that if the population can handle "x" number of harvests, then those options should be available to the guys that are willing to put in the work to get to them.
The reality of sheep hunting to me, is that the guys that are serious about it are the guys that are out in the boonies doing it, there is not a whole lot of "lets hop in the truck and cruise around until we see a good one" involved.
One possible method could be to use a system similar to how BC handles the Cougar population, in that, during the season, each morning there is a recorded message that tells you if the season is still open or if the quotas for that zone have been met. Though it sounds like a crapshoot as far as dropping your money on an outfitted trip (yeah, it is) it is narrowed down to small enough areas with sheep that like as not you are going to be aware at least, of who else is on the same mountain as you. Communications in and out are definitely not the issue they were twenty years ago.
Dare I say this, but if the tags are gonna be on a draw basis, then the outfitter should be applying for draws along with everyone else, if he's the one selling the ride. It kinda makes me cranky when there are assigned tags for outfitters to sell for what they can, when residents cannot reasonably access the opportunities.
Cheers
Trev
Trophy Hunting
- Thread starter sheephunter
- Start date
I kind of miss the days before draw on some species - you actually had to really put time in to find a trophy animal. Now guys can just wait for a tag, do a lot less groundwork and still shoot what is considered a trophy. It has brought the vanity out in some.
The thing about hunting I like is actually hunting, not ensuring there is a B & C head in every drainage. That being said, if someone can prove to me that smaller Rams are putting sheep at risk I will be glad to listen and give.
Until then, lets leave well enough alone.
Absolutely and if we had better winter range we likely would.
According to Geist, extremely large rams don't even breed. Which is why their horns grow so much. They conserve all their energy during the rut rather then spend it on breeding.
What does this even mean?
Actually a draw creates far more want to be sheep hunters. It ain't rocket science here. We have around 2,500 licenced sheep hunters in Alberta right now and nearly 12,000 applicants for the few draws we currently have. Who do you think those other 9,500 people are?
I guess the best thing to do is ask for volunteers to help with a burn, 2,500 is a great start. Commence on the north end of Waterton National Park and then northbound. Just get the nod from Redford and your on your way............I know, not that easy. Good luck anyway! I still say draw.
My guess is the exact opposite - you will have many who never hunted sheep pawning for the chance to kill a Ram. And then you would have the system Sheephunter talks about with hiring outfitters to hold your hand on a once in a lifetime tag.
I have a lot of friends that seem to be finding decent Rams right now with no changes. I guess they are wannabes...
Volunteers definitely aren't the issue. The winter range is well mapped as are the escape routes from it. The only thing left to do is get government approval....therein lies the problem. Interesting that you support restricting hunting opportunity in the province versus real wildlife management. Sadly it's your kids and grandkids that will pay the price. I'm a fat old guy now with my sheep hunting years nearly behind me so whatever happens in the next few years will really have no effect on me but I'd like to think that I can give something to future generations in return for the enjoyment I've had. That's what keeps me in the fight!
I'm a fat old guy as well. LOL!!! That's why I stick to hunting whitetails on flat land. BTW, what is the total sheep population in Alberta? How many die annually? (ie: hunting, natural death, motor vehicles, predators, poachers) There are different ways to manage wildlife and the draw system has proven itself worthy, however to each their own how it may work out.
not kidding at all.
I really respect the work and dedication that goes into a hunt - regardless of size, species and ###. But trying to limit hunter opportunity just so I would have a better chance at killing a "trophy" is pretty unfair.
I really respect the work and dedication that goes into a hunt - regardless of size, species and ###. But trying to limit hunter opportunity just so I would have a better chance at killing a "trophy" is pretty unfair.
So let me get this straight, you don't know this info, yet have no problem offering up a draw province wide, based on an article posted on CBC, quoting a study that was proven wrong with bias and cherry picked data?
What is it you think this draw will accomplish? What do you mean by "work out"?
The worst part is the powers that be try to sling this BS by saying that it will put 190+ rams on the mountain, when in fact it won't. But people that have trouble thinking for themselves eat that shiit up.
Biologists are bright people, there's no denying that. But people are doing themselves a disservice if they don't at least try to understand how things work themselves.
I know it is BS - you know it's BS, but surprising how many are willing to accept "needed changes" without digging into it.
I can't wait for the push for a whitetail buck draw so we all have a legitimate chance at a 200" deer....
Yup, we all know that the oldest whitetails are always the biggest!
I'm just going from actual results from the draw system of other species. True I don't know much about sheep but willing to see the government give it a go with the draw. Just give it 10 to 15 years and observe the results. If it doesn't result in a positive conclusion then bring it back to where it was before. A person cannot deny the draw system, it has worked for elk, mule deer and antelope, lets give it a go for rams.
