truck / hike gun

Its mean, ugly and powerful and a go to for truck gun purposes. With the stock collapsed like in the picture its a real space saver. 30-30 will handle most all circumstances, and if need be, extend the stock and take that deer you just saw 75 yrds out.


 
chamber empty

Can-down said:
Mag tube loaded,empty chamber and action cocked and locked.

If you need to load and make ready, it's either the action release and a quick pump or pull the trigger and pump. No safety needed.
Click to expand...



Empty chamber carry is prudent and appropiate wilderness carry fer sure. Empty chamber carry has actually beena long time military and various spec ops entities mode of carry too............... Proper practice/training/mindset and execution required of course.

That said I gotta call ya on yer suggested execution of readying a chamber empty gun by pulling the trigger before chamberin.....:eek:

Mechanically works fine...but it violates the golden rule of not touchin the bangswitch till its time to go bang.....a rule NEVER to be violated.

Hit the bolt release.....thats what it's for.

Don't touch the trigger till you want it to go bang......EVER.

Don't usually preach....and not raggin' ya but can't let this one slide.
 
what he's saying is that if you fumble the bolt release under stress, or forget what state the gun is in due to a bear about to wreck your day; then you pull the trigger, pump, pull the trigger, pump pull the trigger until the bear drops or you drop. The situation involving pulling the trigger means you already DO intend for the gun to fire.

I also agree that this is the best method for carrying a pump shotgun.
 
Also, dry fire practice is an excellent thing to do. It involves touching a trigger, perhaps even at home. Not to mention storing with hammers uncocked, or the many pistols that must be dry fired before being disassembled. I think your preaching might not be working on me. There is an element of critical thinking to be done about 'inviolable rules'
 
I don't like other people's rules. Or statism. Or onions. Round in the chamber, safety on when I'm alone or with my dogs on foot. Chamber always empty before getting into/on vehicle. As I've stated before I have no interest in testing my fine motor and cognitive skills in a high stress situation. The less steps required and the simpler those steps are the less chance of making a mistake. This has worked for me for years and I won't change it. You are free to do whatever you like so long as its legal and you're not hurting anyone.
 
Y'all are of course free to do whatever ya please in this great land of ours....knock yerself out.
I pretty much flat out stated I wasn't preachin'....and am not.

I stand by the practice of NOT touching the trigger till you intend the firearm to go off.
This is the basic premise of any firearms dogma...and common sense...violating it willfully is foolish....for many reasons.

It is ironic that there has been mention of deploying the gun while under duress.....precisely why one should NOT veer from the sterling rule of not touching the trigger till its time to go bang.....
Did I chamber a round or not?...How many firearms do I own/use?..in how many enviroments?.....do I chamber a round in some and not others?....Do I do it differently at the range vs the bush vs the gun room?...

Making a mistake with this means poss blowing yer nuts off or worse yet..blowing someone elses off..or worse yet killing someone else.

I would suggest there isn't a single professional and or competent firearms/use of force operator/trainer/expert that would consider pulling the trigger as a routine bolt release process while carrying/deploying a firearm sane. If they did I would then question their professionalism/competence.

I am NOT saying it won't work...cuz it will. I'm saying it is a bad practice. Particularily to inexperienced operators not well versed in deploying a weapon under severe stress. That said violating the "rule" is never a good idea...experienced or not.
The basic 3 or 4 rules of firearms use aren't "rules" like some inane administrative policy manual.....they are the tenants of fireamrs practice that make the difference between life/death/grievous harm...and they are THAT simple.
Equating them to simple "rules" of someone's is foolhardy and arrogant...and they are hardly mine BTW....they have been in effect since the dawn of weaponry...and practiced/handed down since.....by the wise anyway.

And they are simple and universal....no bible sized manual of safety required..the simple golden 3 always suffice.
And since this rant has been coerced out of me...here they are.

ALL guns are loaded
NEVER point the muzzle at anything you arent willing to destroy
NEVER touch the trigger till you intend the gun to go off

(4) is often referred to as optional...ALWAYS have one


I fully expected this to draw heat/flame.....bring it.
Nomex, helmet, etc donned....
 
J.P. said:
Also, dry fire practice is an excellent thing to do. It involves touching a trigger, perhaps even at home. Not to mention storing with hammers uncocked, or the many pistols that must be dry fired before being disassembled. I think your preaching might not be working on me. There is an element of critical thinking to be done about 'inviolable rules'
Click to expand...



Dry firing could be construed as a circumstance where the "rule" isn't violated.....in dry firing you are actually intending the hammer to fall...albeit not expecting a discharge..... and I would assume have redundantly verified the weapons conditin/backstop etc. Hardly a a supportive argument for using the trigger as a bolt release carting around a loaded gun me thinks??
Dry firing certainly has it's place....
 
J.P. said:
Also, dry fire practice is an excellent thing to do. It involves touching a trigger, perhaps even at home. Not to mention storing with hammers uncocked, or the many pistols that must be dry fired before being disassembled. I think your preaching might not be working on me. There is an element of critical thinking to be done about 'inviolable rules'
Click to expand...



Dry firing could be construed as a circumstance where the "rule" isn't violated.....in dry firing you are actually intending the hammer to fall...albeit not expecting a discharge..... and I would assume have redundantly verified the weapons conditin/backstop etc. Hardly a a supportive argument for using the trigger as a bolt release carting around a loaded gun me thinks??
Dry firing certainly has it's place....
 
Would like to qualify why I tread into this thread..which I did after consideration and with a reserved well thought intent.
I have no intention of holierthanthou preaching and only hope the info rings true.

I care deeply about the subject. I care deeply about my fellow man, and I care deeply about the consequences.

At 50+yrs and with significant experience working with/around firearms professionally/personally. Soldier, hunter, shooter, competitor and a professional paramedic for 26yrs I have personally bore witness to many "accidental" discharges and injury/death. Family, friends, relatives, co workers, patients.
In EVERY case where someone gets "accidentally" shot one of the 3 basic rules got neglected...almost all "accidental" weapons discharges are avoidable with the 3 rules.
I've seen soldiers, cops, security officers, guards, hunters, target shooters, criminals "accidentally" shoot themselves and others on many occasions. It ALWAYS involved one or more of the 3 rules being neglected.


I'll close by observing how awesome it is to live and be free in this great country where how to exercise our freedom and in what manner...... is a topic of public discussion.....Thanks to all those before us who laid it down for the rest of us......Freedom wasn't and isn't Free.
 
Round in the chamber and safety on is the only option for me.
Might as well not even carry if you don't have one in the chamber.
 
Knowing just how fast an angry carebear runs and the fact that most charges happen at short distance when you accidentally spook a happy carebear... I couldn't agree more. Safe handling is paramount in my books and that's what prevents accidents. Speaking of carebears, I saw the cutest lil black bear cub on my way home from the range last night. I wish I'd got my phone out sooner to get some pics of the little guy. He was about the size of my border collie and hadn't filled out at all yet. He waited until I had slowly rolled up about 15 yds from him before he took off. Momma was surely nearby so I didn't stick around. Anyways, stay safe out there guys.

kagia said:
Round in the chamber and safety on is the only option for me.
Might as well not even carry if you don't have one in the chamber.
Click to expand...
 
All RCMP members I know who are smart enough to carry a shot gun in their overhead rack clear the firearm, then pull the trigger on an empty chamber in a safe direction. The firearm is then loaded but not racked to chamber a round. The idea is that when things go sideways, you don't want to be fumbling for that little slide release or yanking on the pump wondering why it won't cycle.

I bet you don't own anything striker fired like a glock or a CZ 858 if you're so paranoid about touching a trigger on a verified clear firearm. As far as I know those firearms both require you to pull the trigger to release tension before you can field strip them.

I've got a cheap wingmaster 870 I got on one of these ex-brinks deals. That little sucker goes with me everywhere, but for more casual hiking it's a bit cumbersome with a full stock and 18.5" barrel. I've been looking at those armed folders myself, but a follow up shot with only an extractor and gosh knows where I'll have the other shells stored has made me hesitate.
 
highbeam said:
All RCMP members I know who are smart enough to carry a shot gun in their overhead rack clear the firearm, then pull the trigger on an empty chamber in a safe direction. The firearm is then loaded but not racked to chamber a round. The idea is that when things go sideways, you don't want to be fumbling for that little slide release or yanking on the pump wondering why it won't cycle.

I bet you don't own anything striker fired like a glock or a CZ 858 if you're so paranoid about touching a trigger on a verified clear firearm. As far as I know those firearms both require you to pull the trigger to release tension before you can field strip them.

I've got a cheap wingmaster 870 I got on one of these ex-brinks deals. That little sucker goes with me everywhere, but for more casual hiking it's a bit cumbersome with a full stock and 18.5" barrel. I've been looking at those armed folders myself, but a follow up shot with only an extractor and gosh knows where I'll have the other shells stored has made me hesitate.
Click to expand...

Hmmm

RCMP do it so it must be right eh?.....wow.

If when "things go sideways" one is fumbing for the slide release and or tuggin' on the pump "wonderin" why it won't release......they aren't proficient with their weapon and arent up for the threat that needs dealin' with.
Know your weapon, practice, develop skill and familiarity....no tuggin', fumblin', wonderin'....just present it and go to work.

Lastly it has yet to be brought up why the slide release is there in the 1st place and why it should be used what it's for.
It locks the bolt closed so the pump handle/bolt can't/don't open till they're supposed to.
If you pack yer gun around with the trigger pulled on a empty chamber the pump/bolt can and will get pushed open.....#### can now enter the chamber/barrel as well as it can easily be manipulated far enough back to allow a rd to move from the mag to the carrier...or fall out...or get cockeyed in the carrier/action.
Chunks of gun case, sleeping bag, pack contents, dirt, ....whatever
Now you'll def be doin' the tuggin', fumblin', wonderin' thing..... and if you haven't practiced malfunction/clearance/FTF drills....will be screwed if yer deployin' the gun on a threat.

Lets not forget the original scenario posted either....Re: all the examples thrown back about dry frin', weapon strippin', proving safe etc.
We were talking about carrying/handling a loaded weapon in the field in a state of readiness for deployment to threats.......and that is what is being referred to.
Dry firin', proving, taking down a weapon and pulling the trigger..... IS intentionally pulling the trigger with the expectation of the hammer falling and done observing the concept of not pointing the muzzle at something you arent willing to destroy.

Deployin' your gun from your sleeping bag, off of your back while fishing with others, from your cruiser etc AIN'T THAT.
 
I just had some really great cake. It's made with quinoa, which would make you think it might not be great and yet it is fantastic. You cook up the quinoa like oatmeal then put it in a blender with eggs, sugar, etc etc and blenderize it into cake batter goo then bake it. There is no flour, and yet it is better than any normal cake. I mean, it's not just 'as good as' normal cake, it really is better.
 
terez said:
Empty chamber carry is prudent and appropiate wilderness carry fer sure. Empty chamber carry has actually beena long time military and various spec ops entities mode of carry too............... Proper practice/training/mindset and execution required of course.

That said I gotta call ya on yer suggested execution of readying a chamber empty gun by pulling the trigger before chamberin.....:eek:

Mechanically works fine...but it violates the golden rule of not touchin the bangswitch till its time to go bang.....a rule NEVER to be violated.

Hit the bolt release.....thats what it's for.

Don't touch the trigger till you want it to go bang......EVER.

Don't usually preach....and not raggin' ya but can't let this one slide.
Click to expand...

It's a valid point and why I suggest the trigger after the action release.
If you don't have time ( something is on you and you are wrestling) it might be easier and faster to just pull the trigger , pump and pull again.
Preferably with the gun on target or heading that way.
 
terez said:
Hmmm

RCMP do it so it must be right eh?.....wow.

If when "things go sideways" one is fumbing for the slide release and or tuggin' on the pump "wonderin" why it won't release......they aren't proficient with their weapon and arent up for the threat that needs dealin' with.
Know your weapon, practice, develop skill and familiarity....no tuggin', fumblin', wonderin'....just present it and go to work.

Lastly it has yet to be brought up why the slide release is there in the 1st place and why it should be used what it's for.
It locks the bolt closed so the pump handle/bolt can't/don't open till they're supposed to.
If you pack yer gun around with the trigger pulled on a empty chamber the pump/bolt can and will get pushed open.....#### can now enter the chamber/barrel as well as it can easily be manipulated far enough back to allow a rd to move from the mag to the carrier...or fall out...or get cockeyed in the carrier/action.
Chunks of gun case, sleeping bag, pack contents, dirt, ....whatever
Now you'll def be doin' the tuggin', fumblin', wonderin' thing..... and if you haven't practiced malfunction/clearance/FTF drills....will be screwed if yer deployin' the gun on a threat.

Lets not forget the original scenario posted either....Re: all the examples thrown back about dry frin', weapon strippin', proving safe etc.
We were talking about carrying/handling a loaded weapon in the field in a state of readiness for deployment to threats.......and that is what is being referred to.
Dry firin', proving, taking down a weapon and pulling the trigger..... IS intentionally pulling the trigger with the expectation of the hammer falling and done observing the concept of not pointing the muzzle at something you arent willing to destroy.

Deployin' your gun from your sleeping bag, off of your back while fishing with others, from your cruiser etc AIN'T THAT.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
The gun racked in a vehicle might be fine with the hammer down and action released but in the bush it seems like everything is trying to tug and pull.
 
J.P. said:
I just had some really great cake. It's made with quinoa, which would make you think it might not be great and yet it is fantastic. You cook up the quinoa like oatmeal then put it in a blender with eggs, sugar, etc etc and blenderize it into cake batter goo then bake it. There is no flour, and yet it is better than any normal cake. I mean, it's not just 'as good as' normal cake, it really is better.
Click to expand...

Amazing isn't it.
I like quinoa but I hear the developed countries new found taste for quinoa is having negative effects on local supply in it's native country.
 
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