Update on "Question about crown land and hunting and target shooting"

When I was about to first shoot the gun, my friend told me to watch out for the kick. I didn't think anything about it then I shot it and wow. I was scared for my life. After a few more times, I got used it but it still hurt. I took 4 shots in a row from the ground with 180 grain Winchester bullets and my arm was really sore. I drive a manual and it hurt to switch the gears.

Well I ordered the recoil pad so next weekend, I am going to go with the 22 only and see what damage I can do. I probably won't even touch the 30-06 for a few weeks and lots of practise with the 22.

Well atleast it's fun :) The pain is also almost gone today
 
hurry up and take your time after awhile you won't even notice the recoil.but i bet that you will flinch when you first shoot the 22
 
Shooting prone does tend to hurt the most, at least in my personal experience. I get my best groups when shooting from one knee with my elbow braced on my leg. Standing offhand shots are tougher, but a good sling-hold will help, and I find felt recoil to be the least when I shoot standing. Cheek-weld is very important, almost like you immobilize your entire upper torso and take the recoil with your lower back & hips. Just buy lots of different kinds of cheap junk ammo and shoot it lots, it'll help break in the barrel and you'll learn how the rifle likes different loads and such. Lots of good advice in this thread, some of which I could use myself!
 
All good advice.

For the 30-06 I would suggest that you take a small sturdy table (and chair) with you next time and some form of shooting bags/rests (you can buy the fancy store ones but I find rolled up bath and hand towels work well or cloth bags filled with sand or kitty litter). Use the table and bags to develop a firm rest, one under the forearm and one under the butt, practice your breathing and try to get the scope crosshairs as steady as possible before taking the shot.

While sighting in through the scope use your none trigger hand (you don't need it on the forarm if it is properly resting on something) to squeeze the bag/towel under the butt stock to move the crosshairs on to the bullseye and SQUEEZE the trigger. Once you start getting consistent groups (1-2 inches would be good to start) adjust the scope to move the grouping to the bullseye or 1-2 inches high of your point of aim at 100 yards, refer to your ballistics table. You have to build up to making accurate 200 yard shots so start short and work your way up to your desired range.

Once you know the gun is sighted in, the only reason for missing is you. If you can't get the gun to group consistently there may be a problem with your mounts, scope, bullets etc or your shooting technique. Try bench shooting the gun and let us know how you make out.

As for the recoil, when I am sighting in my rifles in the summer I usually drape a folded towel (yes, my wife often wonders where her towels have disappeared or why they smell like burnt gunpowder) over my shoulder to reduce the amount of recoil I feel. If you put your shirt or a 2nd shirt on over the towel it won't slide off your shoulder between shots. I figure I am going to be wearing my thick winter jacket when hunting and there is no point in sighting in with a T-shirt and getting the crap kicked out of me.
 
Shooting a gun that kicks back instills apprehension, bad habits and takes the fun out of shooting.

To get the rifle sighted in, shoot from a bench and put something between the rifle and your sholder to minimize recoil. For a 30-06 I use a sandbag myself - my shooting and enjoyment has improved immensely. :D Use ear plugs and ear muffs.

You have to be 100% certain that the bullets are going where they are precisely aimed. That way when a deer or moose appears in the bush, you know the only worry will be bullet placement. Not your shooting ability or the capability of the firearm.
 
Also, at like 200 yards, my scope well everything seems very small. Like I could see the target but it was really really small. it's a 3-9x40. Thats what most of you use so how do you manage this long shots?
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Here's a good trick.

The gun is always going to have some motion. So one good way to get a soild shot of is to CONTROL the motion by introducing a small amount yourself.

You can raise the gun slightly above target, and then let it fall slowly onto the target. Apply pressure as it falls onto the target and gently squeeze to fire as it falls over the target. Practice a few times even dry firing, you'll quickly see what i mean.

However - you have a flinch problem, as was mentioned.

First off - you don't need to borrow another gun. What you PROBABLY should do is go buy some 'reduced recoil' loads from remington. They are MUCH MUCH MUCH less recoil - about what you'd get out of a 30-30. Practice at 50 yards with that for a box or two over a couple of days.

Get better hearing protection too. Can't have enough of that if you're developing a flinch.

When you're ready to 'step up' to normal loads again - try some 150 grains. They kick less than a 180. Practice with that till your comfortable. THEN think about 165's and 180's.

Frankly - i'd stay away from the 180's if i were you. Look at a premium 165, they'll do a heck of a lot of damage.
 
Foxer said:
Here's a good trick.

The gun is always going to have some motion. So one good way to get a soild shot of is to CONTROL the motion by introducing a small amount yourself.

You can raise the gun slightly above target, and then let it fall slowly onto the target. Apply pressure as it falls onto the target and gently squeeze to fire as it falls over the target. Practice a few times even dry firing, you'll quickly see what i mean.

However - you have a flinch problem, as was mentioned.

First off - you don't need to borrow another gun. What you PROBABLY should do is go buy some 'reduced recoil' loads from remington. They are MUCH MUCH MUCH less recoil - about what you'd get out of a 30-30. Practice at 50 yards with that for a box or two over a couple of days.

Get better hearing protection too. Can't have enough of that if you're developing a flinch.

When you're ready to 'step up' to normal loads again - try some 150 grains. They kick less than a 180. Practice with that till your comfortable. THEN think about 165's and 180's.

Frankly - i'd stay away from the 180's if i were you. Look at a premium 165, they'll do a heck of a lot of damage.
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Yep, and the 165's are PLENTY for taking deer.
I'd also suggest having an expericed shooter standing beside you. When I first started shooting "the big boys" I had a flinch as well.

I had my dad or uncle stand next to me and watch what I was doing when I shot and then tell me. I got rid of my bad habit of quickly jerking the trigger doing that.
 
Oh - and another thing - practice dry firing. A LOT. You can even do it at home (away from the windows). Buy a couple of snap caps if you like, but it won't hurt to dry fire it either to start out.

This makes a BIG difference.

Jack the scope power up to as high as you can and still make out a 'target' in the room without it being fuzzy. Practice 'adding motion' like i mentioned, letting the crosshair fall onto the target. Sometimes i'll give a tiny little 'circle' first and then let it fall. And practice 'sqeeezing' the trigger.

If your jerking - you WILL notice the 'jerk' in your crosshairs when you pull the trigger. If you do it right - there should be NO indication in your sight picture that the trigger was pulled.

This will also help you learn exactly what pressure your gun 'breaks' at. You'll quickly improve your ability to 'squeeze' off a shot without jerking.

If you get off 20 'dry' shots a day in your home for a week, watching for pull and flinch, you'll find a remarkable improvement next time you use real ammo.

And you're training your body not to be afraid of the gun.

The more you do it - the more you'll be comfortable with the gun and the less likely you are to flinch. Still do the other stuff i mentioned - but practicing at home with an empty gun can be your first step to really improving your game. It's no different than a golfer practicing his swing in his back yard with a whiffle ball or just on 'air'. Concentrate on holding the gun THE SAME WAY EXACTLY every time (your head should rest on the stock the same way in the same place each and every time) and practice perfecting your trigger pull, and the 'rise and drop onto target'.

In no time at all you'll have your offhand groups much much better. And if you do this enough - you'll find that in the feild when your a little panicked it just 'comes naturally' to do the right things.

Cheaper on ammo too. :)
 
I have also heard of some guys doing a 'count' when they're praticing their off hand. Count out 1,2,3,4 .. 1 as you raise the crosshair slightly over the target, 2 as it begins to fall, adding a little pressure to the trigger gradually, 3 as it's just about on the target with ALMOST enough pressure to fire, and 4 as it hits the target and you put that last little squeeze in which trips the trigger. It's a fast count, not slow, but it helps you develop a rhythm - and it can help you focus a little in the feild. Remember - you're training your body to do the same thing the same way every time - that's the secret to marksmanship - and anything that helps develop that consistant 'rythmn' is a good thing.

Once you start to get it a bit - practice dry firing starting in your 'carry' positions (two handed carry - sling on shoulder - however you usually hold the gun before you see an animal) and practice bringing the gun up and then going into your 'fire' routine. Focus on perfect and consistant cheek-weld. Remeber - get good, then get fast.


Doing these thigns will pay huge dividends at the range very quickly - do it every day for 15 mins or more, and you'll find that you improve at the range with lighting speed (just watch that flinch - get rid of it).

Here's another little trick a tac shooter taught me btw - when you bring the gun up, keep your finger off the trigger and lay it alongside the gun, like you were pointing forward. As you bring the gun up, imagine you're 'pointing' your finger at the target. You'll find that when you bring your eye to the scope, you're already very close to being on target. Pratice a bit, works great. Again , the more you do it the more it just 'happens' in the feild without you thinking about it.
 
Another neat little trick to get rid of a flinch is to take some snap caps and a buddy shooting. Have your buddy load the rifle for you and not tell you if its live or dummy. Get a sight picture and squeeze off a round. This takes alot of practice but you learn to quit flinching when the gun goes click most of the time. Only trow 1 live 1 in every 8-10 rounds to start. As for the recoil hold that rifle as tight to your shoulder as you can and avoid prone shooting for a while there is very little give that way and your body is absorbing all that energy. (Damn Newton)
 
Hey guys, sorry that I have no replied but I have been busy with work.

Now I have a wealth on information adn tonight after work, I am going to try some of that dry firing technique out. I am going to try to get in some shooting time this weekend so I can practice wit the 22 some more. I got some reduced recoil shell yesterday but I haven't gotten in my limbsaver so I don't think I am going to shoot the 06 as of this weekend.

So thanks all for the trips as I will be sure to get a friend to help me out also.
 
Warm up first!!

Any athlete will tell you the value of warming up with simple excersises first. A baseball pitcher throws easy pitches in the bullpen for quite awhile before going full force..
You start a day of skiing on the easy runs, not the hard ones!
You start a session at the gym with easy excersises and stretching, not bench pressing 200 lbs!
So..
Myself at the range I would practice by doing AT LEAST 2 boxes (ie. 100 rounds) of .22, in various positions, prone, kneeling, standing (start with the most stable position first!) and then switching to the hi power stuff.
Start with the 30-06 and you're just gonna grow a flinch.
 
I am going to try to get in some shooting time this weekend so I can practice wit the 22 some more.
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Don't dry fire your 22 btw - it's ok with a centerfire in most cases (and sooner or later you should buy some snap caps - fake bullets with a spring on the 'primer' - but it will damage a Rimfire very quickly.
 
Foxer said:
Don't dry fire your 22 btw - it's ok with a centerfire in most cases (and sooner or later you should buy some snap caps - fake bullets with a spring on the 'primer' - but it will damage a Rimfire very quickly.
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This is definetely true, in fact I ruined my dad's old remington pump .22 this way, but I've always wondered why? I've never taken apart a rimfire bolt before to see the firing pin assembly/design, is there some inherent issue with rimfire firing pins that makes them more susceptible to damage?
 
is there some inherent issue with rimfire firing pins that makes them more susceptible to damage?
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Yes - when you fire either gun with a bullet IN - it strikes soft brass or primer.

When you fire a centerfire dry - it strikes nice soft air.

When you fire a rimfire - It strikes hard steel. Think about where the rim is on a rimfire - without the bullet there the next thing it's going to hit is the chamber. A tiny, thin little firing pin slamming against steel doesnt' take long to get buggered.

Centerfire (for the most part, with a few exceptions) is not a problem. But rimfires will always be damaged by dry firing it (oh probalby not if you do it once or twice, but soon).
 
I never knew that about dry firing. I thought it was all bad so I didn't do it at all.

I would have practiced tonight but I am still at work so tomorrow I am gonna spend some time playing around in my backyard with the gun.

Thanks
 
I am gonna spend some time playing around in my backyard with the gun.
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Heh - well don't upset the neighbours, but you should find it helps. Remember to get good - and then fast. You want exactly the same cheek weld every time, then do the rise and drop (very small motion, nothing exagerated at all, just enough to introduce motion that's under your control).

Pick up some snap caps if you find it working for you. That'll help prevent wear over extended dry firing.
 
Hey all,


Well I got back from another afternoon of shooting. Well I can say this weekend was alot better then last weekend. I was wearing a little jacket today. Last week I was only in a t-shirt. Well I must say, after 3 boxes of ammo with the 30-06, I am not hurting or anything. Recoil didn't feel as strong at all and well it was great. I don't think I have a flinch because I am not scared of the recoil now. My shots have gotten really really tight compareed to last week but they are not consisitant yet. My best was 3 shots in a row, standing up hit about 2 inches apart at most. Some shots still go high and left or right but today was really windy. I tried where I pull the trigger and every shot kinda scred me when it went off.

Well maybe next weekend, I will be going back to see if I can get even better. Right now I am only shooting about 50 yards away and I will move on to 100 yards soon enough.

I didn't install the Limbsaver yet and I don't know if I should now because I am not in any pain. My friend from last week was also saying there is no pain for him either.

I think all is good now
 
cereal83 said:
Hey all,


Well I got back from another afternoon of shooting. Well I can say this weekend was alot better then last weekend. I was wearing a little jacket today. Last week I was only in a t-shirt. Well I must say, after 3 boxes of ammo with the 30-06, I am not hurting or anything. Recoil didn't feel as strong at all and well it was great. I don't think I have a flinch because I am not scared of the recoil now. My shots have gotten really really tight compareed to last week but they are not consisitant yet. My best was 3 shots in a row, standing up hit about 2 inches apart at most. Some shots still go high and left or right but today was really windy. I tried where I pull the trigger and every shot kinda scred me when it went off.

Well maybe next weekend, I will be going back to see if I can get even better. Right now I am only shooting about 50 yards away and I will move on to 100 yards soon enough.

I didn't install the Limbsaver yet and I don't know if I should now because I am not in any pain. My friend from last week was also saying there is no pain for him either.

I think all is good now
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Your body gets used to recoil.

When you are hunting and you shoot at a deer/moose/whatever, you don't even feel the recoil and barely notice the bang. Especially your first deer. Your heard pounds so hard you think there's a marching band comming, you line up and next thing you know the deer is dead and you are going "wtf?".

When I first whent out shooting clays I fired off about 300rnds with my 12 gauge, my shoulder was purple and my arm hurt the next day. I whent out 1 week later and fired off 2 flats (500rnds) and I was fine, no purple, no pain.
 
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