UPDATED: Problems on refurbished Sig P226. New progress...

--Terry--

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Here below is the new progress on the story:

April 3 -
Picked up the refurbished P226 from the gun store. Both sights were adjusted to centre by the store. The gun looked and felt wonderful. It looked almost brand new, except a few scratch marks on the barrel which I knew was normal and minimal.

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April 7 -
Took the gun to the range. Shots were all slightly to the left side, and then became wider and wider until all shots flew. I looked down at the gun, and saw that the rear sight had moved to the left edge of the slide, and was just "hanging in" there. I moved it back to centre with my finger, and realized it was completely LOOSE.

My wife gave it another try, and the rear sight dropped from the slide and it took us some time to find it on the floor.

Later, when I cleaned the gun, I found that the front sight was loose, too.

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April 9 -
I hesitated when I was about to take the gun back to the gun store for warranty fix. I believed they would just Locktite the sights, which would come loose again sooner or later. I was looking for a better fix (firm but could be adjusted if necessary), which should be done by a gunsmith.

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April 10 -
I took the gun to Joe Dlask. He had some 2-year-old P226 night sights that were slightly bigger than the original sights, and he would install them onto my gun at the charge of $65, parts and labor all included. These night sights do not glow in the dark any more, but I believed that $65 was a good deal, and so I took it.

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April 11 -
New sights were installed and sighted in. They are tight, but will be adjustable if necessary. They are taller than the original sights, too. I think this is the best solution to the loose sight problem on the P226.

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My original post on March 31 -

Hi,

I went to my local gun store to buy a refurbished Sig P226. I checked 4 pieces they had in stock, and found the followings:

Gun #1: Severely worn barrel and slide, lost of scratchs on the frame.

Gun #2: Good finish on barrel, slide and frame. Good trigger pull (same as the new guns). But both the front & rear sights were off to the right. The rear sight were on the right edge of the slide.

Gun #3: Good finish on barrel, slide and frame. TERRIBLE trigger pull. The sights were on the centre positions.

Gun #4: Good finish on barrel, slide and frame. Not-so-good trigger pull. The front sight was off to the right.

I was puzzled by all these small problems in the refurbished Sigs. And I have the following doubts/questions:

1. Sights:
I was told by the store clerk that all refurbished Sigs were sighted in for about 25 meters befored being shipped. But why were the sights so off-centre on 2 of the 4 guns I looked at? If they were indeed sighted in, does that mean the barrel inside is way off?? If they were not sighted in, do they have any quality control on the refurbished guns at all?

2. Difference betweeen refurb & new:
All the refurbs I checked had the flat-top slides, breech face insert and internal extractor (the new guns on display had round top slides, external extractors and no breech face inserts). The store told me that the refurbished guns were the European version of P226, which were made in Germany instead of slide bing made in U.S. and being assembled in U.S.. All refurbs were shipped from Germany instead of from the U.S..

But my question is: Does that mean the refurbs are the older generation of P226? Are there any differences between the old & new generations? Should I avoid the older generation guns?

I paid for the #2 gun, which has good finish, good trigger, but with both sights off to the right. But now after I come home, I can't stop thinking about it. Why are there so many uncomfortable problem on the refurbs?

And should I pay $390 more for a brand new P226 instead?

Please let me know your experiences with Sig refurbs, and/or your suggestions. Thanks.

Terry
 
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As you have noticed, there is lot's of variations between the refurbs in terms of the sights, wear, trigger pull, etc.
As factory refurbs, they have been inspected, 'tweaked', and finally certified to be 'serviceable' by their amourer...
These guns are perfect for the buyer who can't afford new, or the savvy individual that is willing to have a (hopefully!) reliable pistol and spend the difference on ammo...
As per ponts, it sounds as if you'd be better off coughing up the extra and get a brand, spanking new one...concerns answered, problem solved!
 
Well, not all of my questions were answered......

I will feel more comfortable buying refurbished if I am told that those pistols were actually NOT sighted in.

But if they had been, then it means the barrel lock-up is not right.
 
I have a refurb in 40. Been shooting it for the last year and a half for IDPA. I vaguely remember having one failure to feed with it. I have shot factory Winchester and I am now shooting Combat Masters (Canadian BDX) factory reloaded ammo outta Calgary. I have about 2,000 rounds through the gun.

When I bought mine, there were several guns at P&D that I wondered about the condition of them. Picked the one that seemed to be in the best shape. NO regrets here.

If you are purchasing from a reputable dealer, if you are unsatisfied with the gun, return it for another one.
 
finish wear is normal on the muzzle end of barrel and the breech on SIG's, as well as on the frame rails. It's no big deal, you would notice it in 100 rounds on a new pistol.
 
I got a CPO 226 and its a great gun. I posted a thread with some pictures.
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=146694

My rear sight is off the left just a tad, but we shall see how it shoots. Eventually I am going to replace it with some 3 dot night sights, or who knows maybe I'll keep the stock dot the i setup. In that thread you can see some pictures of the barrel and guide rod wear, nothing major and nothing that won't happen overtime with a new gun. My gun came with a 1 year warranty.

and ya, it sounds like you want to buy new. I was going to get a new P226R from Wolverine for 1056 + taxes and shipping, but this one I got locally for 930 taxes in so it was still a good deal IMO and I have more money for ammo and mags.

When you say Refurb, are you talking about the CPO's with the blue strap around them?
 
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Refurbs refer to CPO's.

The CPO's you're seeing are the older generation folded carbon steel slides, with the internal extractor and breech block insert. If you check out sigforum.com, you'll see that most people prefer the folded slides, made in Germany.

The newest generation, what you're seeing on the new guns, is the machined stainless slides, external extractor, no breech block insert. All new guns come this way, but there have been some issues with the first few runs, where a couple of guns had slide rails breaking, but I'm pretty sure that was limited to the 229's.

There is nothing wrong with CPO guns. If you want to hear some people backing them up, check out sigforum.com, where probably 75% of the people on there own one or four.

If you'd feel more comfortable with a new gun, then buy new, you won't be dissappointed.

But, remember that some of those CPO's aren't as used as you think they are. As someone said above, the wear you're seeing on the barrel and frame rails becomes evident around the 75th round down the tube. I just bought a P229R, and after three nights of fondling it and racking the slide, wear is already visible on the barrel and frame. This will go to a certain point and stop.

Either way, you won't be dissappointed by Sig. Smgcon and I currently have three, a 220 in 9mm, a 220 in .45, and a 229 in .40, but have had a 228 and two 226's. There's nothing wrong with these guns.
 
Thanks for your feedbacks.

But does any one know why the sights on these refurbs are off centre? Are they just the result of careless re-assembling, or does that mean these guns will have to be shot with the off-centre sights?

I paid for the refurb P226 at Reliable Gun @ Vancouver, but they have already told me that they won't replace the gun if there is nothing seriously wrong. They won't give me another pick if it is just the sights. Thus all my questions.

It feels like a big gamble, but buying Sig pistols should not be like this, or so I thought.....
 
Maybe I did not make myself clear.

It is not about adjusting the sights. I can do that myself. What I don't know is whether the sights were installed off-centre intentionally by Sig during sighting in (bad), or was it just some minor carelessness (good).

Once the transfer is complete, I will be stuck with this one if the barrel lock-up is off.
 
Dont the refurb sigs come with a Warranty?

I looked at one last year and the sales guy mentioned something to that extent, mind you it was here in Ontario.


Your gun store should be able to help you out on the sights, If they chose not too they should not be selling the gun to you.
 
How much off center are they?
Are they both the exact same amount off center?
I'd think you could move them both towards the center and then adjust the rear for windage if needed with your ammo.....
 
You're taking MORE of a chance, as with anything refurb. That said, a SIG should run really well, even a refurb. Regarding sights, I don't know how anyone can possibly answer that question. I had my first sig and the sights always looked off to me. It shot very well. I had an experienced friend shoot it, and he put all rounds into a fist sized hole and said not to worry about the sights as it shot well anyway. The gun might shoot just fine man! Terry, is this your first pistol? If not, what other pistols do you own? How do they shoot?

I talk to people all the time about their next purchases, and some people really try and find that pistol that is absolutely perfect in every detail that they can visually see. These are older, production, refurbished pistols, the sights may be a non issue. If you're worrying about the gun now, and you haven't yet purchased it, don't. You'll be thinking about it constantly, and you won't enjoy it nearly as much. So if you're worried, don't buy it.

Ponts is right, if you're looking for that perfect pistol, go with a brand new gun. You'll be happier in the long run.
 
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Bitterman said:
Terry, is this your first pistol? If not, what other pistols do you own? How do they shoot?

This will be my 9th pistol, and my 2nd Sig.

And this is the first time I see both sights so off centre right out of the box from the manufacturer. Even Norincos have centered sights.

The front sight was slightly to the right. The rear sight was much more off to the right, too. It was almost on the edge of the slide. I don't know what will happen if I move them both to the centre.
 
Did you check to see what the gun was stamped with under the slide on the bottom towards the end? Your looking for two letters A through K.

Mine is stamped KA thus it was MFG 1990.
My rear sight is off slightly, but my front is dead center.
 
Terry,

Sig is pretty cool with their warranty program. Just hand on to that little blue tag that's wrapped around your pistil. If they are any problems give them a call and give them that serial number off the tag, they will make things right for you if there are any major issues.

I purchased a Referb 226 that was in MINT condition, no marks, amazing barrel. The sights were centered on the slide, how ever all the people who have shot it have all been grouping left of center 2 - 4" at 10yars. I was under the presumption that these were sighted at the factory, but I guess not. 5 'experienced' shooters all grouping to the same spot left of center has gotta mean something. the only difference between all of them was how tight their groups were.

I hope that helps a little, if not refer again to the sigforum and chat with the boys on there.
 
Thanks again for your comments.

Sigh.......

I guess I will take a chance and go ahead with the purchase. There is a $400 difference between refurb and new, and it is a considerable difference. The one I picked looked almost new. If the gun shoots straight, I get away with a less expensive purchase.

Why do I sound like talking about buying a used Norinco?
 
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