UPS playing games now with gun/ammo shipments

Biologist said:
Private companies cannot under federal and provincial law "do whatever they like". I don't know where people get this idea. Its not true in any free western democracy, and certainly not true in Canada. There are mountains of legislation and regulations and policies that regulate human affairs.

I had a career as a gov't public servant regulating the activities of private companies with numerous Legislation, Regulations, Policies, and Guidelines. Less of this regulatory stuff is preferable of course, but in a dog-eat-dog world, chaos would erupt without reasonable regulation of human activities, especially around natural resource access and consumption, and public safety, and sustainability. I love freedom and my rights, and I want more rights and freedoms, but with millions of people in a finite space and finite resources, its all a balance of interests, fairness, tradeoffs and compromise.

Private companies that provide a service (e.g. courier) cannot discriminate against law abiding people by choosing not to provide service. The "grounds" of discrimination are detailed, legally complex and evolving, so case law is setting new precedents all the time. There are provincial human rights codes laws, and federal Charter of Rights and Freedoms laws. I am not qualified in any legal knowledge in this matter so I have to throw it out to the lawyers and legal experts in discrimination law and policy to interpret and provide leadership. Lawyers and legal beagles - we need you to provide leadership.

"Creed" is one of the prohibited grounds of discrimination, well tested in case law at provincial and federal levels. (Creed BTW is not "Religion" which is a separate "grounds", although it can be related). Refusing service based on a customer's Creed is against the law, unless it can be proven that it conflicts with another law or strong policy. Company ideology is not a defense. It is Creed as a grounds for discrimination that I think a case could be won in court for discrimination against gun owners and gun shops who want to legally ship legal merchandise that has been shipping in Canada since Confederation and before. The history of a practice does carry weight in decisions about heritage, culture and Creed. The shipper cannot deny service just because they are anti-gun or have some ideology against it.

I think a legal case could be made that hunters and sports shooters value shooting as part of their lifestyle and as part of their very being down to the core, i.e. its part of our Creed. It is much deeper than "just a sport". Hunting rights using firearms has already been well tested in court for Indigenous hunters as an essential part of life, i.e. Creed. Its just as important for me and most folks on CGN. My ancestors all hunted, and target shooting is part of building hunting competency. Target shooting has been an organized sport since before Canada was born, and throughout Canada's entire history.

There are also human rights case law that I know next to nothing about, but there is a relationship in firearms and ammo ownership that is directly linked to the #1 human right which is the right of all persons to self defense. I think a case could be made that the State cannot deny the rights of Canadians to own the tools and ammunition of our ancestors to defend ourselves today. That would be crazy. The State cannot reduce our self-defense abilities by making us use knives or swords or spears or bows to defend ourselves. Therefore courier companies cannot deny firearms and ammo shipping service by practicing discrimination.

As to this hazardous goods argument, I don't buy it. Like I said in an above post, hazardous goods are being transported every second of every day across this great country, and every vehicle gas tank is a flammable/toxic/explosive on wheels, rail or in flight. Vehicles also kill and injure people, etc. The hazardous goods argument is bogus.
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Very good post.
 
Vewdu said:
If you think any one group is innocent of killing civilians, I would strongly suggest you do some digging on our/our neighbors Military's antics in the last 40 years. Drone strike alone account for a lot more damage to civs on both sides.
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Are you trolling as a caricature of the typical intolerant "tolerant" leftist or you are actually a sociopath who thinks killing innocent people is ok for your political whims?

Rhetorical question since I dont care to see your response. It's never justified bud.

Disgusting display.
 
J.Hancock said:
We as a community ought to be privatizing a lot of these industries. Our own curriers, our own SM platforms, our own government etc..
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We, non-leftist people, are going to be discriminated against more and more by the woke crowd, so becoming self-reliant is going to be the only way to survive without giving up our values. And I'm not talking about firearms only, we are going to be Cancelled in general.
 
PinkyPlinker said:
Are you seriously advocating support of the deliberate downing of a civilian passenger plane is ok because “US drone strikes”??

Get f@cked.
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Not at all, I'm saying it's pointless in saying "THEY DID BAD THINGS TO INNOCENT PEOPLE" when there is just as much or more blood on our own hands.

Like this
Or This
This one too, this is my favorite, I've lost a few friends physically and mentally because of it

These are just some minor footnotes, there is a much much bigger list of international No-no's that we've participated in, alongside our southern pals.

If you've perceived any form of advocacy for their actions in my post, you need to sit down and practice your reading comprehension. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, there is just as much or more blood on our hands, there is no right to point and call someone a terrorist group when were just as bad.
 
Vewdu said:
Not at all, I'm saying it's pointless in saying "THEY DID BAD THINGS TO INNOCENT PEOPLE" when there is just as much or more blood on our own hands.

Like this
Or This
This one too, this is my favorite, I've lost a few friends physically and mentally because of it

These are just some minor footnotes, there is a much much bigger list of international No-no's that we've participated in, alongside our southern pals.

If you've perceived any form of advocacy for their actions in my post, you need to sit down and practice your reading comprehension. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, there is just as much or more blood on our hands, there is no right to point and call someone a terrorist group when were just as bad.
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Whataboutism, whataboutism, whataboutism... always a good retort, lol. Still can't properly defend Singh's support of Khalistani militants. Babbar Khalsa is recognized as a terrorist group around the globe, our country included.
 
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Vewdu said:
Not at all, I'm saying it's pointless in saying "THEY DID BAD THINGS TO INNOCENT PEOPLE" when there is just as much or more blood on our own hands.

Like this
Or This
This one too, this is my favorite, I've lost a few friends physically and mentally because of it

These are just some minor footnotes, there is a much much bigger list of international No-no's that we've participated in, alongside our southern pals.

If you've perceived any form of advocacy for their actions in my post, you need to sit down and practice your reading comprehension. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, there is just as much or more blood on our hands, there is no right to point and call someone a terrorist group when were just as bad.
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Despicable.

Get f@cked. Preferably with something large and sharp.
 
Vewdu said:
Not at all, I'm saying it's pointless in saying "THEY DID BAD THINGS TO INNOCENT PEOPLE" when there is just as much or more blood on our own hands.

Like this
Or This
This one too, this is my favorite, I've lost a few friends physically and mentally because of it

These are just some minor footnotes, there is a much much bigger list of international No-no's that we've participated in, alongside our southern pals.

If you've perceived any form of advocacy for their actions in my post, you need to sit down and practice your reading comprehension. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones, there is just as much or more blood on our hands, there is no right to point and call someone a terrorist group when were just as bad.
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Our hands? You are implying that WE are solely responsible.

1962 I wasn't born,
1989 I was 4
1993 I was 9

Surely I am responsible. ..i..
 
Vewdu said:
If you think any one group is innocent of killing civilians, I would strongly suggest you do some digging on our/our neighbors Military's antics in the last 40 years. Drone strike alone account for a lot more damage to civs on both sides.
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And how is that an excuse to support a terrorist organization? That's stupid.
 
Forgive my ignorance, but how do gun stores receive THEIR ammo? I would assume through the same couriers? So nevermind online sales and shipping to customers, will we even be able to go to into a gun store to buy ammo?
 
Sakonut said:
Forgive my ignorance, but how do gun stores receive THEIR ammo? I would assume through the same couriers? So nevermind online sales and shipping to customers, will we even be able to go to into a gun store to buy ammo?
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They may come from indi shipping/trucking companies. Those same companies may not deliver small packets to individual homes, only big pallets of commercial goods.
 
Bought some shotgun ammo from cabelas just to see. Ordered hevi shot last Friday, arrived UPS 6 days later. I don't live in the boonies but it's a rural address.
 
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