Used Type 97 or wait for WK180-C

buy the T97 now, either save your money for the WK180c or sell the T97 once the WK180C becomes available, considering Wolverine have pre-sold 2700 WK180C it will at least a year before you will see it if your order it now.
 
I have a t97 gen2 and it shoots great, no problem at all and the ambi mag release helps a lot! Maybe try t97 and see how you like it first, its not everyone's cup of tea
 
Nbhunt3r said:
Have you considered a mini 14?
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Semi auto 223? Yes
Black rifle? No

Spend another $600 on one to make it look like a black rifle and you could have bought a used XCR-L or Tavor for only a couple hundred more. Which are both better rifles and both accept pistol mags.

Ya ya, I know, your rifle is awesome and your mini-14 can shoot 1 moa with good ammo. No it can't.
Maybe the target version, maybe, and even if it did once I doubt it does it consistently.

I had an older mini and couldn't sell it fast enough, just like on the A-team, it made lots of noise and looked pretty cool but it shot like crap and if you could find the brass (which was up to 30 feet away) it was dented badly and no good for reloading. The first thing the mini 14 needs is an adjustable gas block, then a stock. Unfortunately after you spend the money on a mini-14 it starts to become expensive and still doesn't shoot any better.

I wouldn't spend more than $500 on a mini-14. Not sure I'd buy a T97 either though.
T97 is a throw away gun. By that I mean that if you break something you either find a machinist to make you the parts you need or you buy another rifle and use the broken one for parts. Norinco carry no warranty unless the retailer decides to provide one and there is no parts support from the manufacturer.
The only Norinco products I would buy are copies of US rifles.
I did buy a Type-81 (Polytech) but I bought it knowing that it would be hard bordering on impossible to get parts if needed.

Don't buy a new m-14 in x39 either, been lots of reports of bad bolts on the new ones.

If you can't wait for the WC-180 (complete unknown quality) I would buy a used Tavor or XCR-L, they can both be found for under $2000 on the EE and they are both better rifles than either of the entry level rifles you're looking at. I know they are more money but it's not that much more and the quality is going to be much better.

I haven't seen the WC180 but I have seen some of the SKS chassis that Kodiak makes and they are functional but there is a reason they cost less than other brands and it isn't because they decided to rape us a little less. I'm hoping the new stuff will be finished better.

If the biggest thing holding you back from spending a little more for a higher quality firearm is budget I would wait for the WC180 or the FX-9, both are being handled by Wolverine which in my opinion means you can't lose. Wolverine provides outstanding and industry leading support. You can buy from them knowing that if you have any issues they will be dealt with quickly.
The FX-9 looks like a winner and being 9mm means it's even cheaper to shoot than the WC180.

OP, since you mention in your first post that you're only interested in target shooting I'm going to push you towards an HK SL8, I've owned three of them over the years and they all shot 1 moa out of the box with heavy match ammo and my handloads. You can find them for under $2000 on the EE and quality is HK so no worries there.
 
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t97 gen2! a bit more expensive but much better design. Why wasting your time waitting for something with unknown ETA when you can go out and pew pew and practice~
 
1st gen T97 is fine. I wouldn't get anything Gen1 that didn't have the FTU on it though. The carry handle is an abomination.
 
DVX said:
1st gen T97 is fine. I wouldn't get anything Gen1 that didn't have the FTU on it though. The carry handle is an abomination.
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The carry handle keeps it light, simple and quick to disassemble. The look of it grows on you.

jRf7KRe.jpg
 
cr5 said:
Semi auto 223? Yes
Black rifle? No

Spend another $600 on one to make it look like a black rifle and you could have bought a used XCR-L or Tavor for only a couple hundred more. Which are both better rifles and both accept pistol mags.

Ya ya, I know, your rifle is awesome and your mini-14 can shoot 1 moa with good ammo. No it can't.
Maybe the target version, maybe, and even if it did once I doubt it does it consistently.

I had an older mini and couldn't sell it fast enough, just like on the A-team, it made lots of noise and looked pretty cool but it shot like crap and if you could find the brass (which was up to 30 feet away) it was dented badly and no good for reloading. The first thing the mini 14 needs is an adjustable gas block, then a stock. Unfortunately after you spend the money on a mini-14 it starts to become expensive and still doesn't shoot any better.

I wouldn't spend more than $500 on a mini-14. Not sure I'd buy a T97 either though.
T97 is a throw away gun. By that I mean that if you break something you either find a machinist to make you the parts you need or you buy another rifle and use the broken one for parts. Norinco carry no warranty unless the retailer decides to provide one and there is no parts support from the manufacturer.
The only Norinco products I would buy are copies of US rifles.
I did buy a Type-81 (Polytech) but I bought it knowing that it would be hard bordering on impossible to get parts if needed.

Don't buy a new m-14 in x39 either, been lots of reports of bad bolts on the new ones.

If you can't wait for the WC-180 (complete unknown quality) I would buy a used Tavor or XCR-L, they can both be found for under $2000 on the EE and they are both better rifles than either of the entry level rifles you're looking at. I know they are more money but it's not that much more and the quality is going to be much better.

I haven't seen the WC180 but I have seen some of the SKS chassis that Kodiak makes and they are functional but there is a reason they cost less than other brands and it isn't because they decided to rape us a little less. I'm hoping the new stuff will be finished better.

If the biggest thing holding you back from spending a little more for a higher quality firearm is budget I would wait for the WC180 or the FX-9, both are being handled by Wolverine which in my opinion means you can't lose. Wolverine provides outstanding and industry leading support. You can buy from them knowing that if you have any issues they will be dealt with quickly.
The FX-9 looks like a winner and being 9mm means it's even cheaper to shoot than the WC180.

OP, since you mention in your first post that you're only interested in target shooting I'm going to push you towards an HK SL8, I've owned three of them over the years and they all shot 1 moa out of the box with heavy match ammo and my handloads. You can find them for under $2000 on the EE and quality is HK so no worries there.
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I own a xcr in 556 and owned a mini 14 583 series accuracy was pretty similar in both rifles. I've shot the both a t97 and tavor and am not a fan of bullpups. I'd rather buy a newer used mini 14 shoot it until the wk180 comes out sell the mini it would be an easier transition imo. But I would a agree if you do have a bit extra I would buy a xcr. I would look at the keymod/light barrel.
 
First black rifle, money is always an object.
Spending more might not be the answer.
It is a big jump from .22lr.

Get it, enjoy it and use it.
Sure other things will come along, it is a good place to start.
 
Jarvy said:
Impossible to compare the T97 to a rifle that's not even available yet. They're light, small, simple and reliable. The safety and magazine release are awkward but serviceable. With the right ammo they're quite accurate, with the wrong ammo, they're decidedly not.

Compare that with the WK180, which is...??? We have no idea. It might be better or it might be about the same. I love my T97, it gets equal time with my Tavor. Others couldn't get rid of theirs fast enough.

The only real deciding factor is do you want a rifle now or are you willing to wait?

Also ask about the first two digits in the serial number I guess. The Gen 1s start at 13 and go to 15 for the corresponding year. Each year they were made a bit better.
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whats the right ammo?
 
Addsome said:
Hey guys, I recently found a used Type 97 with 2 mags and a optic mount going for around $700. I was thinking of buying it but at the same time I have been eyeing the WK180-C. Unfortunately I only recently got my PAL so I don't even have a pre order in yet for the WK180-C. This would be my first non .22 rifle. Should I go for the Type 97 or wait for the WK180-C (anyone know stores that have an earlier ship date than October)? Currently I am only interested in target shooting.
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This is not going to help - but buy both !!! And once you have the T97, whilst waiting for the 180-C, you can buy the Canadian made upper and lower for it !! Great pieces of kit for sure. Just my 2 cents (or $2000) worth.
 
Rick911 said:
Because they take a military design and make is a bubba piece of SH**.

I thought it was pretty self-explanatory.
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-Factory full length rail
-Non reciprocating charging handle
-Improved Feed Ramps
-Enlarged fire selector
-Ambi mag release

I don't think bubba means what you think it means
 
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