I have been doing alot of research into the .45 colt cartridge and asking a few friends about reloading. The majority of answers I get is "It depends on the pistol that you buy" In general the .45 can be an absolute PITA to reload depending on the barrel/manufacturer, some mic out at as little as .451 like some ruger blackhawks and as much as .457 like some old colts saa. Most reloading dies are in the middle at .454 but what happens if your barrel is .451 well now it gets interesting. My basic question is I want to get into the sport fairly cheaply and was wondering if anyone has reloaded for the Pietta colt copy that Marstar is selling right now? I love the look and feel of one that I handled at a gun shop recently and it was cheap compared to all the other saa clones, like 200.00 cheaper it was new and the others were used. For the 200.00 I save I can buy a double barrel shotgun. I have revolvers in .357 and .44 mag just to add confusion to the pot so reloading for them is easy. Any suggestions would be much appreciated?
Want to get started in CAS info needed.
- Thread starter hunter64
- Start date
I wouldn't be too worried about the accuracy of your .45 COLT cartridge as the distances are usually less than 25 FEET for pistol targets, your rifle shots will be 25 yards or so but the pistol stuff is quite close. You just have to have it not shoot left or right and figure out how much front sight to make it hit the target fast. Figuring out left and right can sometimes be helped by bullet weight and/or speed( how long the bullet is in the barrel during the barrels recoil).
Forget the big bore and go with 38/357!
I am by no means an expert in CAS but I have been shooting with our local league for 2 seasons and won both years. I started with a 92 rifle in 38 and a pair of 38/357 Uberti SAA's. My collection has now grown to include both numerous rifles and Uberti SAA's in bigger bores, 44.40 and 45. The bottom line is that 38's tend to be more accurate and with both rifles and pistols they are much faster with less recoil and recovery time between shots - that is why all of the top shooters in the US use light 38's and even 32's.
Granted, all CAS loads are light, but throwing a 200+ grain piece of lead downrange is more difficult than a 150 grain 38. I love shooting big bore, but my times in practice are on average 20% longer with big bore pistols and 30-40% longer with the rifles. In competition my accuracy goes right out the window with the 45's and 44.40 pistols. Ultimately there is no target too large or too close to miss!!!
Big bores are much more sensitive to changes in powder load and bullet size and shape. A 4-6" grouping in practice may seem okay for CAS but on the clock with the adrenaline running that grouping grows dramatically. A single action revolver is not meant for fast shooting, but it is meant to roll in your hand to facilitate cocking it with the thumb on the trigger hand. Even with light loads, 44.40's and 45's require some repositioning of the gun in the hand especially after 2 or 3 shots as the gun keeps moving up in the hand and the muzzle starts pointing skyward. With light 38's that is never a factor.
Another big difference is how the guns come from the factory. Without adjutments to the sights, out of the box, Uberti's all shoot low with CAS loads. The idea is that you file the front sight to raise it up to match your load. My big bores have all been 6-8" low, while the 38's are usually only an inch or so. What this means is that you can use the 38's as-is and still be accurate enough for CAS, but the 44.40's and 45's need to be permanently adjusted for your chosen load. Keep in mind that in competition most of us tend to shoot a little high so you don't mind the gun shooting a little low in practice.
One last plus for 38's is that they are cheap and easy to get, and if you need to buy or borrow, the guns are not as fussy with different loads. Buying or loading your own, 38's are about half the cost of 45's, and that can pay for a lot of shooting!
Ultimately the choice is yours, but for a first or only setup I would reccommend the 38/357 guns and keep the big bores just for fun later on.
Welcome to CAS and have fun!!!!!!!!
JB Gardiner
Thunder Bay
"Bad Irish"
I am by no means an expert in CAS but I have been shooting with our local league for 2 seasons and won both years. I started with a 92 rifle in 38 and a pair of 38/357 Uberti SAA's. My collection has now grown to include both numerous rifles and Uberti SAA's in bigger bores, 44.40 and 45. The bottom line is that 38's tend to be more accurate and with both rifles and pistols they are much faster with less recoil and recovery time between shots - that is why all of the top shooters in the US use light 38's and even 32's.
Granted, all CAS loads are light, but throwing a 200+ grain piece of lead downrange is more difficult than a 150 grain 38. I love shooting big bore, but my times in practice are on average 20% longer with big bore pistols and 30-40% longer with the rifles. In competition my accuracy goes right out the window with the 45's and 44.40 pistols. Ultimately there is no target too large or too close to miss!!!
Big bores are much more sensitive to changes in powder load and bullet size and shape. A 4-6" grouping in practice may seem okay for CAS but on the clock with the adrenaline running that grouping grows dramatically. A single action revolver is not meant for fast shooting, but it is meant to roll in your hand to facilitate cocking it with the thumb on the trigger hand. Even with light loads, 44.40's and 45's require some repositioning of the gun in the hand especially after 2 or 3 shots as the gun keeps moving up in the hand and the muzzle starts pointing skyward. With light 38's that is never a factor.
Another big difference is how the guns come from the factory. Without adjutments to the sights, out of the box, Uberti's all shoot low with CAS loads. The idea is that you file the front sight to raise it up to match your load. My big bores have all been 6-8" low, while the 38's are usually only an inch or so. What this means is that you can use the 38's as-is and still be accurate enough for CAS, but the 44.40's and 45's need to be permanently adjusted for your chosen load. Keep in mind that in competition most of us tend to shoot a little high so you don't mind the gun shooting a little low in practice.
One last plus for 38's is that they are cheap and easy to get, and if you need to buy or borrow, the guns are not as fussy with different loads. Buying or loading your own, 38's are about half the cost of 45's, and that can pay for a lot of shooting!
Ultimately the choice is yours, but for a first or only setup I would reccommend the 38/357 guns and keep the big bores just for fun later on.
Welcome to CAS and have fun!!!!!!!!
JB Gardiner
Thunder Bay
"Bad Irish"
Marstar at the moment only has nickeled 7 1/2 in. barreled PIETTA's. I'm waiting for the 4 3/4 in. in blue or S.S. to come in, when they do they will go fast. The PIETTA's got a good review from someone here who bought one . TRY A SEARCH HERE OF "PIETTA'S" there is a good discussion.
Thanks for the info guys:Flip1 you are right on the money. I did some more research this morning (day off finally) and you are correct, everyone recommends to stick to .38/.357. It makes more sense for a newbie like myself for the reasons that you stated, plus I have 3000 rounds of .38 and about 1000 .357 worth of cases and I cast my own bullets. Easy to load and cheap 3-5 grains of unique goes a long way and I have an endless supply of cast bullets to feed them. Any prefrences on barrel length? I am kind of leaning towards a 5 1/2" or so model, I like the look and the balance.
As for barrel length, I prefer an 18" or a 20" round barrel on a rifle. It still allows for a full 10 rounds, but does not have the out-front weight of a 24.5" or larger. I particularily like my Marlin 1894 trapper in 38/357 with a 16" barrel, but you can barely put 10 rounds of 38 in it and only if the lead is the right length. Marlin trappers are hard to find, and stay away from Win 94's as they were never meant to handle pistol calibres - they work in practice but not under pressure.
With pistols, I have both 5.5 and 4 3/4. Stay away from anything longer as your hands will tire faster and they are slower out of the holster, although they do help keep roll in your hand to a minimum with the extra weight out front. I prefer the 4 3/4, but it is a personal thing, and the weight diference with the extra 3/4 of an inch is negligible. Once again though, the pros all seem to use 4 3/4 so they must know something.
While you didn't ask, I will pass on some thoughts as to makes and models. Some people swear by the Rugers, others the Uberti's. Some use the Beretta's but not too many. The Pietta's have been getting good reviews, and are supposed to be as good as a Uberti but less money. My suggestion is to stick with the Uberti's. They are good and strong out of the box and strong enough for the weekend warrior. Furthermore, any good gunsmith can smooth them up and lighten the springs for around $100. I haven't heard about anyone doing much to the Pietta's as they are very new, and the Beretta's well few people seem to use them. As for the Rugers they are extremely strong, but look in the magazines ... everyone seems to be modifying them to act more like Colts and Colt clones. Why not just buy a Colt clone like the Uberti?
With rifles, I love the 1892's both my originals and copies. However, they have a few idiocycricies that are not the best for new shooters, plus they are a pain for the average gunsmith to work on. The Uberti 66's and 73's are good but very expensive and require gunsmithing to be smooth, but you can get race parts for them if that is your target. The best guns out of the box, that can be tuned for $100-150 are the Marlin 1894's. They are reliable enough for you and I, relatively smooth for stock guns, and relatively inexpensive. Keep in mind that while a new gun might cost a little more, you will know what you have and should have a good life span. Any gun that has already been used for CAS may be worn to the point of costing big dollars to rebuild (kind of like buying a new car vs one that has high mileage but no odometer to tell you the exact mileage). Guns that have been used for target shooting are one thing, competition guns are another.
Just my 2 cents worth.
JB
With pistols, I have both 5.5 and 4 3/4. Stay away from anything longer as your hands will tire faster and they are slower out of the holster, although they do help keep roll in your hand to a minimum with the extra weight out front. I prefer the 4 3/4, but it is a personal thing, and the weight diference with the extra 3/4 of an inch is negligible. Once again though, the pros all seem to use 4 3/4 so they must know something.
While you didn't ask, I will pass on some thoughts as to makes and models. Some people swear by the Rugers, others the Uberti's. Some use the Beretta's but not too many. The Pietta's have been getting good reviews, and are supposed to be as good as a Uberti but less money. My suggestion is to stick with the Uberti's. They are good and strong out of the box and strong enough for the weekend warrior. Furthermore, any good gunsmith can smooth them up and lighten the springs for around $100. I haven't heard about anyone doing much to the Pietta's as they are very new, and the Beretta's well few people seem to use them. As for the Rugers they are extremely strong, but look in the magazines ... everyone seems to be modifying them to act more like Colts and Colt clones. Why not just buy a Colt clone like the Uberti?
With rifles, I love the 1892's both my originals and copies. However, they have a few idiocycricies that are not the best for new shooters, plus they are a pain for the average gunsmith to work on. The Uberti 66's and 73's are good but very expensive and require gunsmithing to be smooth, but you can get race parts for them if that is your target. The best guns out of the box, that can be tuned for $100-150 are the Marlin 1894's. They are reliable enough for you and I, relatively smooth for stock guns, and relatively inexpensive. Keep in mind that while a new gun might cost a little more, you will know what you have and should have a good life span. Any gun that has already been used for CAS may be worn to the point of costing big dollars to rebuild (kind of like buying a new car vs one that has high mileage but no odometer to tell you the exact mileage). Guns that have been used for target shooting are one thing, competition guns are another.
Just my 2 cents worth.
JB
Hunter64: Get yourself a couple of good second hand Ruger Vaqueros, an 1897 pump, (even if it has a less than desirable barrel, because you'll want it cut down anyway) and a rifle in the same caliber as your revolvers.
If you shoot .38/.357's you'll save money and be faster, but if you shoot .44 or .45's you'll have a bigger smile on your face and can add the appelation WARTHOG to your alias.
Welcome to the game and have fun.
If you shoot .38/.357's you'll save money and be faster, but if you shoot .44 or .45's you'll have a bigger smile on your face and can add the appelation WARTHOG to your alias.
Welcome to the game and have fun.
Keep the info coming it is great. As far as shotguns go everyone is leaning towards the 97 pump, any particular choke or just straight bore? I assume that you can only load 4 rounds in the 97, is that correct? I am going to have a blast when I get everything together. The indoor range has a night set apart for cowboy action so I think I will drop by next week and check it out.
Cut down, the barrel will be cylinder bore.
As to loading more than one, many of us find we can shoot faster just loading singles in the chamber.
The only time I load something in the magazine is when we are using steel targets that launch a pop can after the first target is hit.
Don't bother waiting until you get everything, CAS folks are a great bunch and are more than happy to loan you what you need to get through a stage or three.
You may find that one type or model suits you better than another.
Try www.sassnet.com for downloadable rules etc.
As to loading more than one, many of us find we can shoot faster just loading singles in the chamber.
The only time I load something in the magazine is when we are using steel targets that launch a pop can after the first target is hit.
Don't bother waiting until you get everything, CAS folks are a great bunch and are more than happy to loan you what you need to get through a stage or three.
You may find that one type or model suits you better than another.
Try www.sassnet.com for downloadable rules etc.
Shotgun ....
Although I have two 97's (an original and a Norinco clone) I have never been able to get comfortable shooting them in CAS. Perhaps it is because I lack the necessary co-ordination (
) or maybe it is just because I prefer the more historically-appropriate hammered double that I do use (a Rossi Coach Gun.)
Your idea of attending a local shoot to observe is the way to go. Matter of fact, don't just hang back and watch: introduce yourself amd express your interest in getting involved, and I'll wager you'll be showered with offers to try out different guns. Take advantage of those offers - it will go a long way to helping you decide what models and caliber/gauge you prefer or feel most comfortable with. (I confess to being a "Warthog" - nothing less than .45 cal. and 12 ga. are "right" for me!)
Where are you located?
Although I have two 97's (an original and a Norinco clone) I have never been able to get comfortable shooting them in CAS. Perhaps it is because I lack the necessary co-ordination (
) or maybe it is just because I prefer the more historically-appropriate hammered double that I do use (a Rossi Coach Gun.) Your idea of attending a local shoot to observe is the way to go. Matter of fact, don't just hang back and watch: introduce yourself amd express your interest in getting involved, and I'll wager you'll be showered with offers to try out different guns. Take advantage of those offers - it will go a long way to helping you decide what models and caliber/gauge you prefer or feel most comfortable with. (I confess to being a "Warthog" - nothing less than .45 cal. and 12 ga. are "right" for me!)
Where are you located?
I have been shooting SASS @ the Mission BC club for about 4 years now and use 45 Colt. SASS shooters are the most friendly/helpful group of shooters that you will ever encounter.
I was just in Hunter's in Surrey BC on Friday and the fellow behind the counter showed me 2 NIB consecutive serial #ed s/s Ruger Birdshead 38/357 cal 4 5/8" barreled guns that he aquired. They also came with brand new holsters. Beautiful guns....... I would have grabbed them if they where in 45 Colt.
I am shooting 5.5" s/s con serial #ed Ruger Bisley Vaquero's now and these would have been great to match them.
He said they we're from a fellow that had purchased them to shoot SASS and had to quit before he could start.
I would also suggest looking at the Ruger New Vaquero's in 38/357 and 45 Colt. I have held them and they feel very good especialy the 4 5/8" barrel length. It just seems to balance perfectly with that length.
I was just in Hunter's in Surrey BC on Friday and the fellow behind the counter showed me 2 NIB consecutive serial #ed s/s Ruger Birdshead 38/357 cal 4 5/8" barreled guns that he aquired. They also came with brand new holsters. Beautiful guns....... I would have grabbed them if they where in 45 Colt.
I am shooting 5.5" s/s con serial #ed Ruger Bisley Vaquero's now and these would have been great to match them.
He said they we're from a fellow that had purchased them to shoot SASS and had to quit before he could start.
I would also suggest looking at the Ruger New Vaquero's in 38/357 and 45 Colt. I have held them and they feel very good especialy the 4 5/8" barrel length. It just seems to balance perfectly with that length.
Grant, pick up the book "The Top Shooter's Guide To Cowboy Action Shooting" by Hunter Sctt Anderson. He gives about 6 different methods on loading the 2rds of 12 gauge that are allowed in CAS. Better yet, give me a phone call and we'll go out and find a range that allows shotguns to be fired.
I've just had my 2 Win M97 barrels cut down and an internal full choke installed. In CAS both handgun and shotgun targets are really close and I wanted the maximum pellets on target to put it down fast.
As for rifles go with a Marlin, I shot over 8,000 rds through mine before I had a broken firing pin. I also own a .44 Magnum Winchester M92 but it was manufactured in 1906, back when Winchester actually built rifles with pride and quality in mind. Current Winchester lever actions can best be descibed as J-U-N-K !. Buyer beware.
I've had good experience with my .44 Mag Ruger Vaqueros. One of my Vaqueros had over 20,000 rds through it before it broke a transfer bar. It took 15 minutes to fix and cost $4.40 for a new part. I prefer the 4 5/8" inch barrels as your loads are generally downloaded and i find it easier to find the front site faster.
As for caliber, well a 240 grain out of a .44 offers 90 more grains of lead on a target than a 150 grain bullet out of a .38. This helps when your shooting steel reactive targets. Plus for matches that have paper targets, the older you get, the easier it is to see the bigger holes in the target. Hope this helps.
I've just had my 2 Win M97 barrels cut down and an internal full choke installed. In CAS both handgun and shotgun targets are really close and I wanted the maximum pellets on target to put it down fast.
As for rifles go with a Marlin, I shot over 8,000 rds through mine before I had a broken firing pin. I also own a .44 Magnum Winchester M92 but it was manufactured in 1906, back when Winchester actually built rifles with pride and quality in mind. Current Winchester lever actions can best be descibed as J-U-N-K !. Buyer beware.
I've had good experience with my .44 Mag Ruger Vaqueros. One of my Vaqueros had over 20,000 rds through it before it broke a transfer bar. It took 15 minutes to fix and cost $4.40 for a new part. I prefer the 4 5/8" inch barrels as your loads are generally downloaded and i find it easier to find the front site faster.
As for caliber, well a 240 grain out of a .44 offers 90 more grains of lead on a target than a 150 grain bullet out of a .38. This helps when your shooting steel reactive targets. Plus for matches that have paper targets, the older you get, the easier it is to see the bigger holes in the target. Hope this helps.
I'm the same as GrantR, I have a 97 and I don't seem to have the coordination to be as fast as with a double. Firstly, shotguns are staged empty and open, secondly you are only allowed a maximum of 2 shells in the gun anyway so there is no advantage of the tube holding more than one.
Most of the top shooters with 97's actually load them one at a time and shoot them as a single shot. They keep the gun at the shoulder and either hold it with the left hand and feed one with the right, or hold it with the right and load over the top with the left. Get an instructional video and you will see what I mean - it takes a lot of practice to be smooth and fast.
With a double, hammerless is the way to go if you want to be fast. By SASS rules, hammer guns can be staged cocked, so there is no disadvantage for the first 2 shots. Likewise, they drop open without effort but you need to practice to #### both barrels with the swipe of your thumb. The hammer springs will need to be lightened. With a hammerless, the cocking springs need to be lightened and a coach gun will not fall open as easy as a long barrel. I prefer 24-25" so that it is manueverable, but has some out front weight to assist with opening and cocking the gun. I personally disagree with a full choke as it is possible to miss if you are not right on target. Most of the targets are close enough that cylinder bore is not a problem. Have the chambers of the double honed and polished to ensure that the spent hulls fall out. A quick dump backwards and you are ready to reload. Don't do this on a gun that you want to use for hunting with magnum loads or the magnums will swell and get stuck - this is for light load guns only. Furthermore, I have found that AA hulls work the best as they are smooth and slick. Stuck hulls cost a great deal of time on the clock.
Stay away from 20 ga guns as they do not have the pellet count to always do the job. My 12 year old daughter started out with a 20, and found that it often took more shots to do the job than with a 12. She now shoots a 12 with a pachmyer decelerator pad and takes out a target every shot, plus the 12 pushes rather than punches her. Stick to 1 oz or 1 1/8 oz light loads and you won't have any problems.
Whatever guns you buy, get some snap caps and a timer and practice loading, shooting, and reloading, etc... This works with handguns, rifles, and especially shotguns that require some coordination. Practice, be safe, and have fun. Remember, first you get good, then you get fast.
JB Gardiner
"Bad Irish"
Most of the top shooters with 97's actually load them one at a time and shoot them as a single shot. They keep the gun at the shoulder and either hold it with the left hand and feed one with the right, or hold it with the right and load over the top with the left. Get an instructional video and you will see what I mean - it takes a lot of practice to be smooth and fast.
With a double, hammerless is the way to go if you want to be fast. By SASS rules, hammer guns can be staged cocked, so there is no disadvantage for the first 2 shots. Likewise, they drop open without effort but you need to practice to #### both barrels with the swipe of your thumb. The hammer springs will need to be lightened. With a hammerless, the cocking springs need to be lightened and a coach gun will not fall open as easy as a long barrel. I prefer 24-25" so that it is manueverable, but has some out front weight to assist with opening and cocking the gun. I personally disagree with a full choke as it is possible to miss if you are not right on target. Most of the targets are close enough that cylinder bore is not a problem. Have the chambers of the double honed and polished to ensure that the spent hulls fall out. A quick dump backwards and you are ready to reload. Don't do this on a gun that you want to use for hunting with magnum loads or the magnums will swell and get stuck - this is for light load guns only. Furthermore, I have found that AA hulls work the best as they are smooth and slick. Stuck hulls cost a great deal of time on the clock.
Stay away from 20 ga guns as they do not have the pellet count to always do the job. My 12 year old daughter started out with a 20, and found that it often took more shots to do the job than with a 12. She now shoots a 12 with a pachmyer decelerator pad and takes out a target every shot, plus the 12 pushes rather than punches her. Stick to 1 oz or 1 1/8 oz light loads and you won't have any problems.
Whatever guns you buy, get some snap caps and a timer and practice loading, shooting, and reloading, etc... This works with handguns, rifles, and especially shotguns that require some coordination. Practice, be safe, and have fun. Remember, first you get good, then you get fast.
JB Gardiner
"Bad Irish"
Cold Lake Kid!
I got my 2 Winchester M 97's back from AC Douglas Gunsmithing in Saskatoon (306-652-7828) about an hour or so ago. He did a very nice job. Both shotguns were cut to 18 5/8", crowned, had a bead front and a choke installed for $75 each. The cost of the Colonial Arms Inc .795 x 44 Double Lead Thread 12 Gauge Full choke was an additional $45.00 each. The choke is NOT visible from either side of the shotgun, but is from the muzzle. The choke can screw out if required and another screwed it. A warning from the gunsmith, steel shot is not to be shot through these chokes, or they will become permanent. Hope this helps.
I got my 2 Winchester M 97's back from AC Douglas Gunsmithing in Saskatoon (306-652-7828) about an hour or so ago. He did a very nice job. Both shotguns were cut to 18 5/8", crowned, had a bead front and a choke installed for $75 each. The cost of the Colonial Arms Inc .795 x 44 Double Lead Thread 12 Gauge Full choke was an additional $45.00 each. The choke is NOT visible from either side of the shotgun, but is from the muzzle. The choke can screw out if required and another screwed it. A warning from the gunsmith, steel shot is not to be shot through these chokes, or they will become permanent. Hope this helps.
Cariboo Lefty
CGN Regular
- Location
- Kamloops BC
I think when it comes to actual shooting time, for experienced shooters, there is not much difference between a double and a 97. My buddy Bink and I have timed it, a double has a slight advantage for the first 2-4 shots after that a 97 seems to have a small advantage. However for beginners, the 97 can be loaded one round at a time with either hand more efficiently than two rounds in a double, less fumble factor. Where the 97 gains a real advantage is if the shotguns are staged upright, a double which must be broken open is much harder to safely pick up or replace vertically than a 97. This advantage can be negated by stage design, simply stage long guns horizontally on a flat surface. Shoot what you are comfortable with and practice, fumbling one round makes a lot more of a difference than what type of shotgun you choose.
The 97 also has an advantage in confined shooting boxes. If you compete in some of the larger matches like Ft Kusk, you will find props that are very confining at times. Last annual match in August, I was using a 30" barrelled 97 in the "engine compartment" of a small "train", talk about confined. As previously discussed there are numerous methods of loading that you can practice in order to get better. Brownells in the states sells high quality 12 gauge dummy rounds.
HOWDY; The full choke is far too much choke for most cowboy targets . Improved cylinder works well ,enough lead on target. If you use lite loads and 7/8 ounce lead maybe a Modafied. FULL choke is good for trap side matchs .
The SHORT distance to target on shotgun knockdowns means you gotta aim like a rifle as there is most likley only a 3 inch spread by the time it travels 13 yards with a full choke.
The SHORT distance to target on shotgun knockdowns means you gotta aim like a rifle as there is most likley only a 3 inch spread by the time it travels 13 yards with a full choke.
Ruger Super Blackhawks (like the larger grip) with 5" barrels, shooting 44 Specials loaded with 165 grain Cannon cast bullets (cannons.lj@sympatico.ca) over Clays an' Grits in two strong side holsters, tried shooting crossdraw, two strong side is simpler and quicker as you can holster one and pull the other at the same time. I would shoot .44 Ruger Bisley Vaqueros if I could find a pair.
Rifle Marlin 1894 Cowboy in .44 Mag/.44 Special shooting same bullet as above. I like the 24" octagon barrel as it "holds" better for me. I like the .44 and .45 cartridges as I find them easier to handle/load at the loading table and on the clock than .38's but thats just butter fingers me.
Shotgun Browning BSS with single selective trigger. Tried multiple 97's and never got the hang of shoot one load one.
Rifle Marlin 1894 Cowboy in .44 Mag/.44 Special shooting same bullet as above. I like the 24" octagon barrel as it "holds" better for me. I like the .44 and .45 cartridges as I find them easier to handle/load at the loading table and on the clock than .38's but thats just butter fingers me.
Shotgun Browning BSS with single selective trigger. Tried multiple 97's and never got the hang of shoot one load one.
