Well... The Semi Auto RPD FRT data is published...
- Thread starter fenceline
- Start date
No one said you can't. If you want to help then I suggest you contact AE.
Waynetheman
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver.
Everyone was asked not to share. AE is supposed to make their own public statement soon.
Lame.
Yup. The whole I got a secret but I cant tell you it, is pretty lame. Why even bother posting.......
I'm curious too, as I would love one of these, although I never even knew about them before. However, I understand the concept of not tipping your hand. Have a bit of patience, I"m sure at some point everyone will know more.
Unlike the Walther G22's, the (Lever) T97A's, the BD38's, BD3008's, the Swiss Arms, the CZ-858's, and others which made it out into the hands of regular PAL holders, ... here only the person or corporation that submitted the firearm for testing/classification has any "legal" standing to do anything about this. Everyone else, including people that paid deposits (if there were any, I think it was "waitlist only", smart move on AE's part) is on the sidelines.
My understanding here is that, unlike the CanadaAMMO T97A's, the RPD's (other than the sample) never entered Canada. The legal matter would be an administrative law (court review of the decision of administrative/statutory decision-maker) question between the person that submitted the sample, and the administrative decision maker that made the decision: was my firearm classified correctly, reasonably, and was procedural fairness adhered to. The specific legal principles (currently) are in Dunsmuir v. New Brunswick, and go way beyond what I can summarize here. http://scc-csc.lexum.com/scc-csc/scc-csc/en/item/2408/index.do
Arms East hasn't made a dime on this (I can't see how, anyway). I would wager that it has been a financially crippling experience for them, as similar experiences have been for Wolverine, CanadaAMMO, Lever, and on, and on, and on (see a pattern here?).
Fighting your way up to the Supreme Court of Canada (for the ability to import a Soviet "machine gun" to sell to regular civi's), would cost... $100K... minimum, and what do you think old Bev McLachlin and company are, at the end of the day, going to say about Soviet "machine guns"? Gee, I wonder.
The real shame here is that... as I said in my earlier post, the Lab seems to have changed (i.e., gutted) the Hasselwander test, turning it into meaningless rhetoric... with the clear expectation of not being challenged (as the firearms were never here, it's just a sample, it doesn't make economic sense to fight it). I like the idea of beating them over the head with the BATFE documents. If there is one thing Canadian leftists, including judges, don't like... is to be shown... by Americans/American documents... that we are in fact a procedurally unfair joke of a country that doesn't live up to our own high and mighty principles.
Still... based on my experience with things like the "magazine bodies" case, at the end of the day I'm not sure it really matters what you say. Leftist Judges don't want this in the country any more than Leftist RCMP specialized support services employees want it. They simply make something up, ignore your argument... and the facts... and say "Too bad, so sad".
The real... and only... way to change things is with the Conservative Party of Canada. What we need right now is Min. Steven Blaney. Sadly... we don't live in that world anymore. We never knew how good we had it. Twice in the modern history of this country did the firearms regulation move in the opposite direction... the two rounds of legislative change that happened during the Conservative majority. And what did we do... we #####ed about how it wasn't enough.
I like the idea of fighting, but, with respect to Walt, the "secret squirrel" approach here... and the roughly $100K price-tag... I think the answer is already there for everyone to see. Walt isn't going to do anything. He can't. Based on previous cases I have been involved in, you can expect to raise about $5-10K "maximum" from CGN, industry, advocacy groups and their fundraisers....combined... so... yah. On the T97A case I did... despite the awesome efforts of Chris at CanadaAMMO, the NFA, their members, and many CGN members, I had to write off about 2/3rds of my fee just to get it into court... and that was on a s.74 reference to a Provincial Court Judge, which is basically free except for cost of counsel, expert witness, and disbursements. There are no awards of costs in Provincial Court. No filing fees (for this), no transcripts (at this stage), etc.
So basically... Bye bye, RPD baby. I'll always love you.
My understanding here is that, unlike the CanadaAMMO T97A's, the RPD's (other than the sample) never entered Canada. The legal matter would be an administrative law (court review of the decision of administrative/statutory decision-maker) question between the person that submitted the sample, and the administrative decision maker that made the decision: was my firearm classified correctly, reasonably, and was procedural fairness adhered to. The specific legal principles (currently) are in Dunsmuir v. New Brunswick, and go way beyond what I can summarize here. http://scc-csc.lexum.com/scc-csc/scc-csc/en/item/2408/index.do
Arms East hasn't made a dime on this (I can't see how, anyway). I would wager that it has been a financially crippling experience for them, as similar experiences have been for Wolverine, CanadaAMMO, Lever, and on, and on, and on (see a pattern here?).
Fighting your way up to the Supreme Court of Canada (for the ability to import a Soviet "machine gun" to sell to regular civi's), would cost... $100K... minimum, and what do you think old Bev McLachlin and company are, at the end of the day, going to say about Soviet "machine guns"? Gee, I wonder.
The real shame here is that... as I said in my earlier post, the Lab seems to have changed (i.e., gutted) the Hasselwander test, turning it into meaningless rhetoric... with the clear expectation of not being challenged (as the firearms were never here, it's just a sample, it doesn't make economic sense to fight it). I like the idea of beating them over the head with the BATFE documents. If there is one thing Canadian leftists, including judges, don't like... is to be shown... by Americans/American documents... that we are in fact a procedurally unfair joke of a country that doesn't live up to our own high and mighty principles.
Still... based on my experience with things like the "magazine bodies" case, at the end of the day I'm not sure it really matters what you say. Leftist Judges don't want this in the country any more than Leftist RCMP specialized support services employees want it. They simply make something up, ignore your argument... and the facts... and say "Too bad, so sad".
The real... and only... way to change things is with the Conservative Party of Canada. What we need right now is Min. Steven Blaney. Sadly... we don't live in that world anymore. We never knew how good we had it. Twice in the modern history of this country did the firearms regulation move in the opposite direction... the two rounds of legislative change that happened during the Conservative majority. And what did we do... we #####ed about how it wasn't enough.
I like the idea of fighting, but, with respect to Walt, the "secret squirrel" approach here... and the roughly $100K price-tag... I think the answer is already there for everyone to see. Walt isn't going to do anything. He can't. Based on previous cases I have been involved in, you can expect to raise about $5-10K "maximum" from CGN, industry, advocacy groups and their fundraisers....combined... so... yah. On the T97A case I did... despite the awesome efforts of Chris at CanadaAMMO, the NFA, their members, and many CGN members, I had to write off about 2/3rds of my fee just to get it into court... and that was on a s.74 reference to a Provincial Court Judge, which is basically free except for cost of counsel, expert witness, and disbursements. There are no awards of costs in Provincial Court. No filing fees (for this), no transcripts (at this stage), etc.
So basically... Bye bye, RPD baby. I'll always love you.
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#1bcshooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- North Of The DMZ (US border)
If at the end of the day they can't be imported .
He will have no problem selling them where they are currently located (the US)
He'll make a lot more than he originally sold them for in Canada almost 3 years ago.
People that bought & paid for them & never received what they paid for 3 years ago are supposed to get a refund.
He will have no problem selling them where they are currently located (the US)
He'll make a lot more than he originally sold them for in Canada almost 3 years ago.
People that bought & paid for them & never received what they paid for 3 years ago are supposed to get a refund.
Waynetheman
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver.
^ that.
I dunno about the whole secret squirrel thing I assume he doesn't wanna show all his cards but that's his choice.
I dunno about the whole secret squirrel thing I assume he doesn't wanna show all his cards but that's his choice.
Yes: those of that secured the initial pricing had to pay in full, up front.
- Location
- East of Home, West of the Rest
Yup. With the guarantee that if it didn't come in that money would be refunded. Safe gamble. Especially if these do come in and then supply dries up. DSA already refused to send guns preferring to sit on them then sell them to the US market when supply declined thus increasing value/price.
If the guns come in, they will be worth considerably more than what was paid for them 3 years ago. If they don't, money comes back ready to spend on other guns or other things.
Bingo. Talked to Walter at AE and feel much much better about the situation.
