What moose cartridge?

In thread like this one, if you pay attention and read between the lines you can really see the difference between the experienced hunters and posers.
 
Thousands of Moose have been successfully taken with a 30-30 by First Nations hunters. Any modern 30 cal will take down a Moose. Learn how hunt. If you can't find the Moose it does not matter what rifle you are using.
 
bcsteve said:
In thread like this one, if you pay attention and read between the lines you can really see the difference between the experienced hunters and posers.
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There are some folks who seem to need to justify their choice of cartridge by whatever means necessary. That much is true. It does make for good banter (if not already done a million times), but the great outdoors hardly makes for an ideal laboratory environment for measuring the small differences that exist between the available cartridges, let alone any dependable conclusions.
 
Harris26 said:
Thousands of Moose have been successfully taken with a 30-30 by First Nations hunters. Any modern 30 cal will take down a Moose. Learn how hunt. If you can't find the Moose it does not matter what rifle you are using.
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Yep, and if you hit 'im in the hoof with a 50 BMG, he ain't goin' down. Now, a heavier, bigger chunk of lead may kill quicker, but again, moose don't take a lot of killing, and you have more chance of being hit by a meteorite than of having to stop a charging moose. Bears can be ornery, deer take off like a shot, elk, I have no idea, wild boar can be nasty, but moose, they're pussycats. Kinda like pugs of the ungulate world - ugly as sin, not overly bright, not overly ambitious, but a lotta fun. (That last bit was a joke)
 
Slamfire said:
Can be aggressive when called in -

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Never said it can't happen, just that it is extremely unlikely. People are killed by lightning, meteorites,etc., every year. Doesn't mean it's a realistic risk. My son and I were charged by a snowshoe hare one year. Heck, I had a buddy get hit by lightning 5,700 feet underground. The odds of that happening?
 
Not that unlikely during the rut when called in, here's another example. Called in it will often turn itself broadside to look as big as possible to intimidate its perceived competitor. Broadside shoulder shot opportunity at 00:23 but the hunter decided to place the shot elsewhere at his own peril -

 
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CV32 said:
The mistake you're making here is the assertion that the difference between 308Win and 300WM is equivalent to the difference between losing 700 lbs of meat and 20 lbs of meat, when clearly that isn't true. The cartridge alone will never close that gap.
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That is not a mistake... it is on a sliding scale with regard to damage, blood trail and loss... a heart and lung shot with just about anything will result in death, but the proponents posting above shooting for bone mass better have a stout bullet carrying lots of energy... losses can happen in that scenario... I wouldn't want to be using that shot placement with a .308 launching 150 SST's. I have seen some catastrophic bullet failures on black bears where odd angles, bone and thin jacketed bullets were involved.
 
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guido said:
There is no doubt the 300 has more power. That doesn't necessarily equate to better.
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When it comes to discussing cartridges used on game, what is the benchmark for "better?"

The .300 WM is better than the .308 Win... period.

That does not mean, you need to use a .300 WM... a .308.is fine for moose as are many other cartridges... you just have to be cognizant of their limitations (and yours with them), and stay within it's capabilities and as always, place the bullet well.
 
BigUglyMan said:
Yes. Given the same bullet and distance the 300WM will penetrate deeper, hit harder and do more damage. We're not talking about stabbing them with knitting needles, these are expanding projectiles that require velocity to expand. Look at the ads that Swift puts out showing the results at impact velocities. Look at their condition at 308 impact velocities (at the target distance, not muzzle) then add 200 fps to it and look at that result. More speed=more expansion+more penetration=more damage=dead sooner.
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More expansion often means less penetration, because of the increased frontal area. For example, out of 8 bullets shot at 50 and 400yds from a 300wm only one had more penetration at 50yds then it did at 400 (and the only one that penetrated more at 50 had a smaller expanded diameter!)

http://www.rifleshootermag.com/ammo/ballistics-test-best-300-win-mag-loads-market/

Considering the 400yd impacts are in the 2300-2400fps range, which is comparable to 308 speeds at normal hunting ranges, i feel like an argument can definitely be made that a 308 will out penetrate a 300wm with the same bullet.

(I'm not arguing a 308 will kill better, with lower energy and less expansion, just pointing out that more velocity doesn't equate to more penetration with fast moving, expanding bullets)
 
hoytcanon said:
That is not a mistake... it is on a sliding scale with regard to damage, blood trail and loss... a heart and lung shot with just about anything will result in death, but the proponents posting above shooting for bone mass better have a stout bullet carrying lots of energy... losses can happen in that scenario... I wouldn't want to be using that shot placement with a .308 launching 150 SST's. I have seen some catastrophic bullet failures on black bears where odd angles, bone and thin jacketed bullets were involved.
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If I were to use a 30-30 and it were a spot and stalk scenario I wouldn't take a shoulder shot for that reason. Instead I would take a brisket shot then get ready to go look for it hoping it doesn't go too far into the thickets. If it were called in I wouldn't want to be using a 30-30 because getting stomped could ruin my day. :p
 
hoytcanon said:
That is not a mistake... it is on a sliding scale with regard to damage, blood trail and loss... a heart and lung shot with just about anything will result in death, but the proponents posting above shooting for bone mass better have a stout bullet carrying lots of energy... losses can happen in that scenario... I wouldn't want to be using that shot placement with a .308 launching 150 SST's. I have seen some catastrophic bullet failures on black bears where odd angles, bone and thin jacketed bullets were involved.
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We'll have to agree to disagree on that point. Because there can be loss or failure with any cartridge.
 
CV32 said:
We'll have to agree to disagree on that point. Because there can be loss or failure with any cartridge.
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Intentionally shooting into heavy bone, especially at odd angles can do funky things to bullets... significantly increasing the likelihood of deformation, deflection and fragmentation... a stoutly built bullet would be a wise choice on that shot choice... whereas on a shot between the ribs on a broadside animal, even a thinly jacketed cup & core will suffice.
 
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