MangledMoose
Member
- Location
- Edmonton Alberta Canada
Fast forward to 1:05 and because this guy may just know what hes talking about
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocR5LZds33U
Who decided that 30 rounds is optimum?
- Thread starter Nelson84
- Start date
Fast forward to 1:05 and because this guy may just know what hes talking about
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocR5LZds33U
With such an ineffective round I'd be more comfortable with a 100rd mag. But that's another story.
To me 30rd would be the MINIMUM.
Ar180shooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Ottawa, ON
The MP40 used a 32 round magazine.
Ar180shooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Ottawa, ON
Yep, I've never seen issues arise from people using quality magazines as rests for their rifle.
22LR has killed a lot of people too, probably WAY more than 5.7x28. You have no point.
There are some very experienced service-rifle competitors that would disagree with you on this one.
You commented on the ineffectiveness of 5.7x28. I made the point that it was indeed effective enough for a crazy man to kill 13 people on an army base, out of a handgun instead of the longer barrelled P90, nonetheless. You can choose to ignore the point, but that doesn't mean the point isn't made.
Back on topic... 30 rounds magazines was the happy medium for weight, ergonomics and function for most offensive weapons. The magazine for the P90 does hold 50 rounds. The rounds are lighter and smaller than 5.56 which allow for more to be carried. Since the round is a personal defence round as opposed to an offensive round like the 5.56, it doesn't need the extra powder/case length/velocity to achieve its mission.
You are correct, of course! Thank you for pointing out that error.
In one US State, they can do 30rnds of 223 in a 30cal magazine clip in 1/2 a second.
That senator is a total moron.
Ar180shooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Ottawa, ON
No problem. Your point still stands though, as 30 round magazines do predate the AK platform.
lol shoulda read the thread first before posting
Paladin308
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- The Man Cave
.22lr has been around longer.
5.7x28mm is a respectable cartridge. It is not comparable to larger cartridges like 5.56 NATO, but that's not what it's designed for. 5.7x28mm is a PDW cartridge, not a primary combat rifle cartridge. It is made to compete with cartridges like the 9x19mm Parabellum or .45 ACP, and in that comparison it shines. It's light, produces little recoil, and provides much better effectiveness against an armored opponent. And yes it does outperform .22lr by a significant margin.
This right here. 5.7x28 was never intended to be a competitor for 5.56 and larger cartridges.
Compared to 9mm and 45ACP, in terms of recoil and power against armor and magazine capacity, the cartridge is awesome.
In terms of the standard magazine fed rifle that takes mags from the bottom, 30 rounds or less is optimum for magazine changes while prone, however for firearms that are top fed or side fed, these are lesser issues.
Compared to 9mm and 45ACP, in terms of recoil and power against armor and magazine capacity, the cartridge is awesome.
In terms of the standard magazine fed rifle that takes mags from the bottom, 30 rounds or less is optimum for magazine changes while prone, however for firearms that are top fed or side fed, these are lesser issues.
As per many posts above, it all has to do with practical limitations, and remember that the original AR/M16 magazine was 20 rounds, as well.
That said, the M16 mag was probably (admittedly guessing) 20 rounds because that was a commonly accepted number for a magazine 50 years ago, based on the M14/FN. 20 rounds was a lot for normal rate fire, especially if you carried 5+mags. However, obviously a 5.56 was smaller than a 7.62, so it likely did not take that long for someone to realize that you could carry more rounds in a 5.56 mag before you're at the weight that a 7.62 mag had been.
Since that time, the number for AR platforms went up to a number that is generally 30 for common-sense reasons. It gives the shooter more rounds while still not being impractical. A soldier can still lift and handle a full 30 round mag without issue, and it still fits well in their kit. Further, anything longer than a 30-round mag, and it is starting to get ridiculously long hanging out of the bottom of the rifle, and it may not be possible for a short person to fire from the prone because their forearms aren't long enough.
As to why it is not a more precisely perfect number, like why not 28 or 32? The reason is likely due to logistical and simple math reasons. Ammo comes to troops in small cardboard boxes of 30 rounds-per-box, in 3x 10-round clips, which is a nice round number that is easy to load with a mag charger. I suppose it could just as easily be in 3x9 or 3x11 round boxes, but under contact it's a lot easier to do the math of how many rounds you have left, or how many you need, when you're figuring out 5x30, 10x30, or "I need 2x30".
That said, the M16 mag was probably (admittedly guessing) 20 rounds because that was a commonly accepted number for a magazine 50 years ago, based on the M14/FN. 20 rounds was a lot for normal rate fire, especially if you carried 5+mags. However, obviously a 5.56 was smaller than a 7.62, so it likely did not take that long for someone to realize that you could carry more rounds in a 5.56 mag before you're at the weight that a 7.62 mag had been.
Since that time, the number for AR platforms went up to a number that is generally 30 for common-sense reasons. It gives the shooter more rounds while still not being impractical. A soldier can still lift and handle a full 30 round mag without issue, and it still fits well in their kit. Further, anything longer than a 30-round mag, and it is starting to get ridiculously long hanging out of the bottom of the rifle, and it may not be possible for a short person to fire from the prone because their forearms aren't long enough.
As to why it is not a more precisely perfect number, like why not 28 or 32? The reason is likely due to logistical and simple math reasons. Ammo comes to troops in small cardboard boxes of 30 rounds-per-box, in 3x 10-round clips, which is a nice round number that is easy to load with a mag charger. I suppose it could just as easily be in 3x9 or 3x11 round boxes, but under contact it's a lot easier to do the math of how many rounds you have left, or how many you need, when you're figuring out 5x30, 10x30, or "I need 2x30".
