x54R Mexican match 30/06??

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boltonscouter

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So I've seen/found lots of threads on making non corrosive plinking loads for 308 or 303 with 7.62x39 & x54R but nothing on 30/06??

I want to take PRC surplus corrosive 7.62x54R and dump the powder into a 30/06 case with a CCI 200 LR primer and then seat the PRC 150 grn FMJBT bullet into that case. I figure it should be a nice light plinker load and safe. Since the 30/06 case is larger than the x54R case I don't think pressure should be an issue. Not sure what accuracy will be? Yes I know it's a .310 bullet in a .308 barrel but consensus of opinion seems to be that's not a huge issue. Especially since I'm shooting this in an older Brazilian Mauser that's probably a little loose anyways LOL! Sure I could load some Hornady .308 150 grn FMJBT but then I'd have to save the pulled bullets for the Mosin or the Enfields LOL. Basically for the cost of x54R surplus and a primer I can shoot 30/06! just occasionally, for $hit & giggles in the old girl.

Anyone else done this? Any experience? I loaded up 20 30/06 as above but thought I'd see what other peoples experience was before pulling the trigger.
Anyone ever tried doing as above with x39? might be too light a powder charge? Too light a bullet?
 
I really wouldn't want to put 7.62x54R powder loads in a 308 or 303. It's quite a bit too much powder and would be considerably dangerous. 7.62x39 powder and bullets would work in either though.

The 30-06 has both a larger case capacity and a higher max pressure than the 7.62x54R. The larger case capacity would lower the pressure which is already below the safe max to start with (with the same bullet weight). The larger diameter bullet will increase pressure a little but with the double reduction of capacity and higher working pressure, I don't see it being a problem. The load would be fairly close to a regular 30-06 load, a little lighter but probably barely noticeable; not what I would consider a "light plinker load" exactly. My guess would be to expect it to be dirty and possibly not overly accurate.

I would suspect that using 7.62x39 powder and bullets in a 30-06 would work fine, as the powder used in 7.62x39 is usually relatively fast, but the low velocity and light bullet would probably make for poor groups. It works in 303B because of the smaller case capacity and thus higher pressure that would be generated.
 
7.62x54r uses .311 bullets. Same as 303 British. NOT the same as .308 cal in 308/30-06.

I use x54r to make 303 but i would never try to make 308 with it.
 
I agree .... I misspoke ....... usually x39 used for 303 & 308 plinkers (that or x54R but reduced 10% I believe is what I saw)? Maybe these won't be as light a plinkers as I thought but what I really wanted was some safe cheap ammo to shoot in an old girl occasionally. I figured that being a larger case I wouldn't need to reduce the standard PRC x54R powder charge.
 
Do not attempt this. For one, you have no idea what the burn rate of the powder is. Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, 7.62mm Russian and 7.62mm/30-06 NATO (30 caliber) ARE NOT the same diameter. 7.62mm Russian bullets are .311-12 diameter whereas 30 Caliber is .308 diameter. You would be forcing an oversized bullet down the barrel with potentially catastrophic results. At the very least, you are going to trash your rifling.
 
Suther said:
7.62x54r uses .311 bullets. Same as 303 British. NOT the same as .308 cal in 308/30-06.

I use x54r to make 303 but i would never try to make 308 with it.
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I measured them at .310 and it seems to me I've seen threads with people saying it's not the end of the world shooting .310 in a .308 barrel (not ideal however, especially for a match rifle). As stated, making 30/06, not 308 and it's going in an old Brazilian Mauser originally chambered in 30/06 that has most likely seen lot's of rounds. Maybe I should slug it's bore?
Hey ..... worst comes to worst I'll use Hornady 150 grn 308 FMJBT and save the bullet x54R for my Enfields.
 
r_taylor said:
Do not attempt this. For one, you have no idea what the burn rate of the powder is. Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, 7.62mm Russian and 7.62mm/30-06 NATO (30 caliber) ARE NOT the same diameter. 7.62mm Russian bullets are .311-12 diameter whereas 30 Caliber is .308 diameter. You would be forcing an oversized bullet down the barrel with potentially catastrophic results. At the very least, you are going to trash your rifling.
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I hear what you're saying & we'll see what the consensus of opinion is ......... I may need to reconsider using the pulled bullets. Might save them for the Enfield. The unknown burn rate doesn't worry me quite as much since it's a slightly larger case with the same weight projectile.
 
Sounds fine to me. I would slug the bore of your rifle and if it's 0.308 ish size I would consider getting a Lee 308 sizing die and run the bullets through that first. But even then I don't see pressure being an issue. Having said that I don't reload for the 3006, only 7.62x54r and smaller surplus rounds.

It shouldn't matter what the burn rate is as its the same bullet weight in a bigger case.
 
surplus x54r will have a jacket that is made of a steel alloy so running a .310"-.311" bullet in a .308" bore is going to cause wear and pressures to spike id just go buy a mosin and shoot the x54r ammo in that
 
Spawn-Inc said:
Sounds fine to me. I would slug the bore of your rifle and if it's 0.308 ish size I would consider getting a Lee 308 sizing die and run the bullets through that first. But even then I don't see pressure being an issue. Having said that I don't reload for the 3006, only 7.62x54r and smaller surplus rounds.

It shouldn't matter what the burn rate is as its the same bullet weight in a bigger case.
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I would not attempt to push the steel alloy jacketed bullets through a seizer die
 
Appreciate the input guys! I have a Mosin & an SVT40 so yes I can shoot the x54R no problem as is. What I don't have is cheap 30/06 LOL. If I had cast 30 cal, I'd shoot it. I already load cast in 45/70. The reason for using the torn down x54R is purely the fact I have plenty on hand. x39 would be even better as I have tons but I don't think it will be quite suitable for the 30/06 ..... as before ... maybe too light a charge & too light a bullet.
I load plenty for 308 & 303 already but I only have one rifle in 30/06 that I don't plan to shoot that often & when I do it's going to be just for fun, nothing serious (hunting or competitive target). This is just for punching paper at 100.
 
antiqueguy said:
I would not attempt to push the steel alloy jacketed bullets through a seizer die
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It's been done successfully many times for many years by many people.
Bullet jackets are mild steel. Dies are hardened tool steel. The different in hardness is pretty significant.

There will be some wear over time, yes, but if lubed it would take thousands of rounds to make a difference. You can just mic the bullets after sizing to see if the sizer is opening up at all.
Steel jackets do cause more barrel wear than copper jackets. Here is an interesting article on that. It's for 223, not 30-06, but the difference is what's important even if the numbers would be different.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
It looks like steel jacketed ammo wears out barrels roughly twice as fast as copper jacketed ammo. We're talking 5000-6000 rounds versus 12,000ish rounds though; not something someone will normally put through a single rifle in a lifetime.
 
r_taylor said:
Do not attempt this. Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, 7.62mm Russian and 7.62mm/30-06 NATO (30 caliber) ARE NOT the same diameter. 7.62mm Russian bullets are .311-12 diameter whereas 30 Caliber is .308 diameter. You would be forcing an oversized bullet down the barrel with potentially catastrophic results. At the very least, you are going to trash your rifling.
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SERIOUSLY? You really think that .003" of soft lead and copper is going to make any difference at all? Many people have shot tens of thousands of .311 bullets through a .308 bore over the last few decades without any problem at all. I personally had a custom 7.62x39 made with a .308 bore and never once noticed any difference. The bullet simply swages down a few extra thou with no issues.

How exactly do you think that rifling gets "trashed" by the passage of the bullet? You ever wonder why the part of the rifling that does wear out is right in front of the case mouth, where the bullet velocity is at its lowest? But barrels never wear near the muzzle where the bullet velocity is the highest?
 
http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/threads/7-62x54r-reloading-questions.48690/page-2 Top post


http://www.reloadersnest.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=16143 Part way down the page.
In Volume II page 76 Ackley describes the pressure tests that were by himself done to dispel the myth of slightly oversized bullets. A standard pressure barrel chambered for 30-06 was tested with a given factory 150gr load and pressure tested (57,300 psi). The chamber and throat was then opened up to 8mm (.015" oversized) and the standard .308 groove was kept. Bullets were then pulled on the factory ammo and replaced with same weight 8mm bullets. Pressure results were erratic, but averaged 16,000 psi LESS than the standard 30-06 ammo. Furthermore, the velocity dropped over 100fps. The velocity was then driven up to over 200fps above the standard 30-06 load with peak pressures remaining less than the the standard 30-06 factory ammo by 4000psi. He wanted to experiment further and push a .358 caliber bullet through the bore, but ran out of time before the printing. I would have liked to have known the results of that one too.
 
I see no reason not to use 7.62x54 ammo to make 30-06 rounds. If you have a Chrony, you could make sure the velocity is not too high (high pressure).

The extra diameter of the bullet is of no consequence in the barrel, BUT you have to make sure the neck is not tight.

This is easy to do. Mike the neck diameter of a fired case. That gives you an idea of your chamber neck diameter. Then mike the diameter of the neck, with the .310 bullet loaded in it. If it is smaller than the fired case neck, you are good to go.
 
That is a good point.
A tight chamber in the neck are would cause the case to want to hold the bullet tight, and not release.
 
Suputin said:
SERIOUSLY? You really think that .003" of soft lead and copper is going to make any difference at all? Many people have shot tens of thousands of .311 bullets through a .308 bore over the last few decades without any problem at all. I personally had a custom 7.62x39 made with a .308 bore and never once noticed any difference. The bullet simply swages down a few extra thou with no issues.

How exactly do you think that rifling gets "trashed" by the passage of the bullet? You ever wonder why the part of the rifling that does wear out is right in front of the case mouth, where the bullet velocity is at its lowest? But barrels never wear near the muzzle where the bullet velocity is the highest?
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Well considering your statement regarding lead and copper, I hardly think I will waste my time engaging you on this matter. Suffice it to say, almost all 7.62mm Russian ammo is steel or tombac jacketed.... Not copper. If you don't think that steel/tombac jackets already wear a barrel faster (there are a number of test that prove it... Google is your friend), add to the accelerated wear by introducing oversized bullets. But hey, it's his gun and he is welcome to potentially damage it.
 
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r_taylor said:
Well considering your statement regarding lead and copper, I hardly think I will waste my time engaging you on this matter. Suffice it to say, almost all 7.62mm Russian ammo is steel or tombac jacketed.... Not copper. If you don't think that steel/tombac jackets already wear a barrel faster (there are a number of test that prove it... Google is your friend), add to the accelerated wear by introducing oversized bullets. But hey, it's his gun and he is welcome potentially damage it.
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very true, but we don't know the diameter of the barrel so it may be over under or perfect. slug the bore OP!
 
Ganderite said:
I see no reason not to use 7.62x54 ammo to make 30-06 rounds. If you have a Chrony, you could make sure the velocity is not too high (high pressure).

The extra diameter of the bullet is of no consequence in the barrel, BUT you have to make sure the neck is not tight.

This is easy to do. Mike the neck diameter of a fired case. That gives you an idea of your chamber neck diameter. Then mike the diameter of the neck, with the .310 bullet loaded in it. If it is smaller than the fired case neck, you are good to go.
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That's what I was hoping to hear! Much appreciated, my instincts seem to be correct.
 
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