Xcr vs swiss arms..need help
- Thread starter bobbyhill
- Start date
I find it strangely coincidental that the detractors of the XCR generally seem to be shooters WHO CLAIM TO HAVE more experience with a variety of black rifles, unlike the ardent proponents HAVE SEEN nothing wrong with the XCR who ARE NOT new to black rifles and HAVE NO need to justify their purchases.
The haters are just idiots. Yes, you are.
The haters are just idiots. Yes, you are.
angryeyebrows
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Oscar Mike
Awww! Don't get your panties in a bunch just because people don't agree with your opinion. I'm not a "hater" nor am I an idiot, but I do think it's dumb to compare these two rifles to each other.
Yes!
- Location
- Port Perry/Toronto
Last time I was at the range...
Rifle: Swiss Arms Back Special Target (flat top)
Scope: Zeiss 4.5-14x50
Support: Sandbags
Distance: 100 meters
Shots: 5
wind: 15-20km/h gusts
bullets: bulk hornady 55 gr.
brass: once fired remington UMC
powder: varget
primers: Federal Match
Lucky group? Maybe.
Lets try another one:
Or another one:
Or how about two?
I could keep on going if you want...
I have not even tried using different powders or even match bullets yet. I'm told that varget is better for heavy bullets, so who knows what kind of accuracy I'll get with a powder designed for lighter bullets. I'm a amateur reloader/shooter too, I've only been dong this for less than a year.
I spent 3k (well 2.5k actually) on the best damn rife ever made. Everything about it is top of the line. Materials, reliability, accuracy, durability, quality, whatever. There may be others out there that excell in single aspects, but then compared to the swiss arms loose in other areas.
IMO 3k is a frigen deal for what you get.
The point isn't the screws, it's the fact that if they are not tight things can go wrong. Having a rifle system that relies on screws holding together is a bad design IMO.
This is quite possibly the most misleading complaint about the XCR.
There are only three hex bolts on the entire rifle. One fastens the barrel, and is neccessary to allow it to be removed and changed for other calibers. One fastens the polymer brass deflector. The other fastens the ambidextrous bolt release. The only one that MUST be fastened is the barrel bolt. The manual is simply being excessive in its recommendation to ensure everything is tightly fastened, mine required no adjustment at all. This recommendation is best understood as a response to the litigious nature of the US market, and not a reflection on the manufacturer.
Aside from the barrel bolt, which is neccessary to allow for the calibre change capability, there is no truth to the argument that 'screws' hold the rifle together.
If all of the XCR fans want to start threads and get in a big circle and jerk each other about how great the rifle and Robarms is, that is fantastic; I'm not likely to interject comments.
I don't have issue with Robarms or the XCR; it isn't a personal issue with me.
I have a problem when people on this board come on and claim the XCR is a superior system to the Sig rifles... or ARs for that matter. They are not.
If you expect to add comments of how great they are to unsuspecting people and not have comments that refute that information in return, you are mistaken.
..
LMAO...sorry just the funniest thing I have herd on cgn yet lol...I think i started a war here.
I only wanted to compare the two guns as they are the best 2 non-rest in are market the xcr is good but the swiss seems to be the best if i am not mistaken and the xcr guys are gonna have to PROVE other wise ...soo ill see you on the range with SA...
thanks 4 the help
Bingo, we have a winner.
angryeyebrows
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Oscar Mike
What about the bolted on ejector? You'd be pretty screwed if that came loose no? I recall that being an issue for some owners.
You've got 5 peoplewho think they know everything about a rifle they don't own, and you're reversing the burden of proof because of it? Boy, you belong with them.
Its a deflector, not an ejector. They would still eject, they'd just eject sideways and slightly rear instead of sideways and slightly forward.
Despite the fact that you're in law school, I don't see that there is the need to treat this formally enough to start talking about burden of proof.
Just for curiosity's sake, I posted a question about the XCR on an American forum I go to. I was advised to check out Lightfighter, so I had a look there. I would sum up the responses as follows:
33% - I love mine, although I don't have to depend on it, it's just a toy
33% - I had one, it had some nice features but wasn't great overall and I dumped it
33% - I teach tactical courses and am tired of watching them experience failures.
1% - XCR LOL
I also saw a pic describing it as "yawn-tastic" and it was compared to cold clam chowder in terms of appeal.
Nobody who carried guns for a living recommended one, and most specifically warned people off of them.
One guy said "if you MUST have a piston gun, I guess get one" but then he remembered several other options and rescinded his opinion.
I have been eyeballing them for AGES and spent maybe 8-12 hours total reading opinions and reviews over the last couple of years and my general impression is that they are okay for people who will never depend on their rifle, but that they don't run with the big dogs. I'm sorry about that because I really wanted to like them.
Anyway if you want the opinions of more than 5 people who don't own them plus three people who do and won't admit there's anything wrong with them at all, check out places like thehighroad or lightfighter...you will get a much better sample of people.
But you will come to the same conclusions, so whether you want to invest the time or not, it's up to you!
Just for curiosity's sake, I posted a question about the XCR on an American forum I go to. I was advised to check out Lightfighter, so I had a look there. I would sum up the responses as follows:
33% - I love mine, although I don't have to depend on it, it's just a toy
33% - I had one, it had some nice features but wasn't great overall and I dumped it
33% - I teach tactical courses and am tired of watching them experience failures.
1% - XCR LOL
I also saw a pic describing it as "yawn-tastic" and it was compared to cold clam chowder in terms of appeal.
Nobody who carried guns for a living recommended one, and most specifically warned people off of them.
One guy said "if you MUST have a piston gun, I guess get one" but then he remembered several other options and rescinded his opinion.
I have been eyeballing them for AGES and spent maybe 8-12 hours total reading opinions and reviews over the last couple of years and my general impression is that they are okay for people who will never depend on their rifle, but that they don't run with the big dogs. I'm sorry about that because I really wanted to like them.
Anyway if you want the opinions of more than 5 people who don't own them plus three people who do and won't admit there's anything wrong with them at all, check out places like thehighroad or lightfighter...you will get a much better sample of people.
But you will come to the same conclusions, so whether you want to invest the time or not, it's up to you!
angryeyebrows
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Oscar Mike
No the EJECTOR (I put it in big letters so you will understand). It is bolted on the inside of your rifle's upper receiver. LOOK here's a video of it!---------------------------------------------------> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zarsfz90ME
Very informative! even though I did not watch the whole thing!!!!!!!
- Location
- Port Perry/Toronto
Pics or it didn't happen. Keep in mind I'm only using bulk bullets and brass, and powder that's not even optimized for the lighter bullets. I'm not even shooting off a benchrest either. With Swiss match ammo, these are known to shoot 35mm at 300 m regularly (0.4 MOA), 50mm with regular old GP90.
this my rifle is better than your rifle/my dad can beat up your dad/ my #### is bigger thing is kind of ridiculous. the swiss rifles , if anything like my sig 226 are likley high quality firearms, i dont know i havnt handled one or fired one. i know i will more than likeley buy one in the future. that is after my xcr i ordered. the fact that we have these two unrestriced, plus a few more, rifles to choose from instead of the usual ar platform is good stuff. to each his own, but in my minda good rifle is a good rifle. i dont think ill put the xcr and swiss rifles in the same class, one being a new development that still has some bugs to work out and the other a rifle with an established record of reliability and accuracy. im not going to buy either for a service rifle, i have a c7a2/c8 for that. these, like my sig, 870, and m14 are nothing more than items i buy for my own enjoyment , and possibly to use in a match or two for a good laugh. maybe someone should organize a FRIENDLY swiss vs xcr match some day to see the outcome. could be a good afternoon. im sure the swiss would come out on top, but it would be fun. anyway, my .02 cents
thats the part i left out of my rant. the reason i bought the xcr was the price difference. i had the money for one from kicking around at the time i ordered it. when i have the extra money for a non restricted swiss rifle, or even a cqb or carbine,ill grab one of them. and im sure there is an ar in my future as well. maybe im just trying to avoid the fan boy label for the open minded gun enthusiast label.
