Opinions on makes please....
- Thread starter galamb
- Start date
Well, this thread has gone on considerably longer than I thought it would. And either because of or in spite of (not sure which) I still am considering a Rem 700 in the mix. 
So I will add this pic to see if any opinions change. These are the pics of the exact models I'm looking at and a price comparison (without actually posting the prices available to me for a new, in the box, rifle). While I realize there are countless options in some of these models, due to availability and caliber choice, this is what I have got to work with - so not interested in say a Model 700 BDL etc - if the model isn't in the pic, it's not within my consideration.
So I will add this pic to see if any opinions change. These are the pics of the exact models I'm looking at and a price comparison (without actually posting the prices available to me for a new, in the box, rifle). While I realize there are countless options in some of these models, due to availability and caliber choice, this is what I have got to work with - so not interested in say a Model 700 BDL etc - if the model isn't in the pic, it's not within my consideration.
The advantage is in the action and its safety. Dave was right, you are a REM hater and your doing nothing but reinforcing that in everything you post. Is it the best, no... is it one of the best, absolutely. Is it the safest ever? I dunno.... Its safer then any Browning , tikka, or vanguard.... and its because of the design.... You can argue it all you want, but it will be to no avail. That is an advantage...
So let me get this straight, on the one hand we have:
- A company which specifically makes and effort to make cheapest bolt and comes up with a design of Rem 700. (We know that for a fact because they didn't approve 5.5 cent extra cost on a trigger - 100% safety issue)
- A company files a patent on that design which expires 50 years ago for anyone to use, but no one does
- Huge number of Rem 700 are refitted with outside extractor. Huge number of aftermarket custom made Rem700 actions are made with outside extractors.
So in 50 years no one saw a value of that apart from cheaper to make boltface.
On the other hand we have anecdotal evidence of a Rem 700 which was fired with a wrong cartridge all together and didn't blow up. You attribute that one occurrence to the inherit huge advantage of Rem 700 action while you didn't even do the same experiment with any other rifle, but YOU THINK they will do worse.
And in order for argument to continue you can only accept me personally taking a rifle and blowing it up with a wrong ammunition? Are you serious?
Anyway, what makes you think that extractor will fly anywhere at the first place? You THINK it will? Lets watch barrel obstruction tests:
Do you see ANY extractors flying anywhere? Couple of rifles exploded to bits (Rem 700 is one of them ironically) - I don't see any extractors flying.
A-bolt totally explodes - bolt to receiver as we see practically intact:
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/A-Bolt-disaster-660x406.jpg
Savage blows up - bolt is holding just fine:
http://s273.photobucket.com/user/marshalette/media/gun%20stuff/muzzle4jpg.jpg.html
But its all bs because you saw a Rem 700 chambered in 7mm rem mag ( 3,200 ft x lbf energy ) firing .303 Brit ( 2,630 ft x lbf energy = 20% less ) and it was fine. ONCE. And you never did it again with anything else, but you THINK it proves that Rem700 has a DESIGN advantage over all other 2 lugs.
Again, are you seriously presenting that as an argument for you position?
Barrel obstruction test, man your just grasping for straws now. Yeah lets fire our rifles with obstructions in the chamber.... Thats absolutely screwed up. A barrel blows up... yeah, of course it will, no barrel is meant to contain user stupidity. You're so far off the topic now
OP those all look like decent choices, I think you will do fine with any of those.
personally not a Browning fan, but for not a good enough reason to slag them.
To the back and forth Remington banter: I would say wrong thread but not bad fellas. As much as some are jumping on their wagons, I think they are both making valid points and if I was having a garage beer with these guys I would be having a great time!
Everyone has the BEST rifle and BEST car and BEST boots. To each their own.
enjoy your new rifle OP!
personally not a Browning fan, but for not a good enough reason to slag them.
To the back and forth Remington banter: I would say wrong thread but not bad fellas. As much as some are jumping on their wagons, I think they are both making valid points and if I was having a garage beer with these guys I would be having a great time!
Everyone has the BEST rifle and BEST car and BEST boots. To each their own.
enjoy your new rifle OP!
Well, this thread has gone on considerably longer than I thought it would. And either because of or in spite of (not sure which) I still am considering a Rem 700 in the mix.
So I will add this pic to see if any opinions change. These are the pics of the exact models I'm looking at and a price comparison (without actually posting the prices available to me for a new, in the box, rifle). While I realize there are countless options in some of these models, due to availability and caliber choice, this is what I have got to work with - so not interested in say a Model 700 BDL etc - if the model isn't in the pic, it's not within my consideration.
I would pick whichever model of Weatherby or Rem that fits you best. If you're worried about beating up a wood stock in the bush, go with synthetic.
This.... In the end, go shoulder some rifles, cycle the action and find the one that talks to you. Shoot some at a local range if you can.... One mans gold is an other mans trash
s
- Location
- Rockland, ON
galamb. I'm with Pete G's thinking. For the first 20+ years that I hunted I only had one rifle. It was an E.A.L. (Essential Agencies Limited) Lee Enfield in 303 British. I hunted everything with that gun. I got so experienced and comfortable (muscle memory) with that gun that I could and would take any shot offered on all game (rabbits ;-) to moose). I had tremendous confidence in it, and in my ability with it, to deliver a kill shot every time. Generally, I could out shoot the other guys in camp who had "better" guns in one of the more modern and better performing calibers. I don’t think it was because the E.A.L. is more accurate than their rifles or that I was better shot. I think it was because the E.A.L. was all I used for so long that I was more confident with what I could do with that gun than they were with theirs.
I started to approach hunting with more game/caliber specific interests about 20 years ago. In 1995 I went to Gagnon’s and acquired a Pre '64 (1955) Winchester Model 70 Featherweight in 30-06 cal. specifically for moose hunting. I successfully shot 2 moose with the Model 70, a cow and calf at over 250 yards, a range I probably would have had trouble at with the 303. Afterwards I decided I still needed a heavier, long range caliber. So I went back to Gagnon’s and swapped the Mod 70 for a used 1994 Browning A Bolt II Hunter in 300 Win Mag that has a 26" barrel with BOSS. That’s when I fell for the A Bolt II rifle.
I wanted to keep the comfort level that I had developed with the E.A.L. but also to use different caliber rifles for different game. I decided I would stick with one model of gun and have it in several calibers. The gun I chose was the A Bolt II and I now have 6 of them, (the 300 Win Mag Hunter, a 223 Rem SSA Mossy Oak Brush, a 30-06 Springfield Eclipse Hunter with BOSS, 12 gauge Stalker shotgun, 270 Win Composite Stalker and a 270 Win Stainless Stalker). I still have the E.A.L. but haven't put a round through it in 15 years or more. The confidence I had built in the E.A.L. has been shifted to the A Bolt II rifles I have. When its time to shoot they all come up and perform the same way, regardless of which one I'm carrying, and I know exactly where the bullet will go.
I found the A Bolt II’s to be excellent quality, very accurate, reliable and priced right. Personally, I think it too bad that the market drove Browning to drop the line (I think they only make a Medallion in 7mm Mag and 300 Win Mag now).
I started to approach hunting with more game/caliber specific interests about 20 years ago. In 1995 I went to Gagnon’s and acquired a Pre '64 (1955) Winchester Model 70 Featherweight in 30-06 cal. specifically for moose hunting. I successfully shot 2 moose with the Model 70, a cow and calf at over 250 yards, a range I probably would have had trouble at with the 303. Afterwards I decided I still needed a heavier, long range caliber. So I went back to Gagnon’s and swapped the Mod 70 for a used 1994 Browning A Bolt II Hunter in 300 Win Mag that has a 26" barrel with BOSS. That’s when I fell for the A Bolt II rifle.
I wanted to keep the comfort level that I had developed with the E.A.L. but also to use different caliber rifles for different game. I decided I would stick with one model of gun and have it in several calibers. The gun I chose was the A Bolt II and I now have 6 of them, (the 300 Win Mag Hunter, a 223 Rem SSA Mossy Oak Brush, a 30-06 Springfield Eclipse Hunter with BOSS, 12 gauge Stalker shotgun, 270 Win Composite Stalker and a 270 Win Stainless Stalker). I still have the E.A.L. but haven't put a round through it in 15 years or more. The confidence I had built in the E.A.L. has been shifted to the A Bolt II rifles I have. When its time to shoot they all come up and perform the same way, regardless of which one I'm carrying, and I know exactly where the bullet will go.
I found the A Bolt II’s to be excellent quality, very accurate, reliable and priced right. Personally, I think it too bad that the market drove Browning to drop the line (I think they only make a Medallion in 7mm Mag and 300 Win Mag now).
I'm going to have to express some disbelief on the whole ' Which brand' theory of questioning. As a guess 90 % of the answers are championing their personal favorite, and expressing a narrow point of veiw.
Why not tag along on an existing thread or two; follow the uberhunters on this site ( not saying which though; their heads would get out sized...not me though, I'm just an enthusiast...no expert or Nimrod at all ).
Too hard to sort through the chaff looking for wheat on a broad based thread like this...it just is.
Stay safe though
Why not tag along on an existing thread or two; follow the uberhunters on this site ( not saying which though; their heads would get out sized...not me though, I'm just an enthusiast...no expert or Nimrod at all ).
Too hard to sort through the chaff looking for wheat on a broad based thread like this...it just is.
Stay safe though
Actually, despite all the back and forth I have gained some valuable information here.
While I agree, that many posts are simply going on about the virtues of their favourite rifle brand/model etc, there has been little to no "I bought brand A and it sucked - had a ton of problems and the customer service when I tried to get it fixed was horrible".
And that really was more what I was looking for (the bad if it existed).
I am confident that all of the rifles I listed are "safe and reliable" if used as intended.
I'm not going to go "Tim Taylor" on any of them and hop them up. While I reload I stick well within the max limits posted by the bullet or powder company data (even if more than a few consider them "lawyer safe loads") - I don't load "hot". I am more interested in shooting game animals than chronographs and actually chrono very few loads.
I am torn between wood and synthetic stocks. Until I got my synthetic Wby I would have never considered a "plastic" stock, but after having to replace the buttstock on my pre-64/Win 94 due to a shattered wrist and a couple of cracks developing in the forestock of my 740 Rem (ok, they are closing in on 60 years old and they were never "safe queens") I am not as opposed to "plastic" as I once was.
I purposely left out the caliber(s) that I'm (waffling) over at the moment or this thread would have drifted even further from what I asked about, but will throw them in now since I think it's starting to die (this topic that is). My first and second choice (and still not sure which is first) is 6.5 Creedmoor and 7mm-08 Rem. In a distant third I will consider a 270 Win.
These "wants" have somewhat limited what models are available and from who (The Savage 111 is the only model I would consider that chambers for the Creed, otherwise it wouldn't even be on the short list - while Wby makes a VGII/syn in 6.5, I can't get the wholesaler to bring one in from the US and Rem/Browning just don't chamber it).
I love the look of the Wby Kryptek but the only caliber I'm even kinda interested in, in that model is the 270 (and actually, I plan on picking up a Browning BLR pistol grip after this next rifle and kinda want that to be either a 270 Win or 270 WSM and not really looking to duplicate the caliber).
So I do appreciate the responses that have at least tried to address my original question, even if they were just a testimonial to your love of your own rifles - that info is still "very valuable" - if it has worked well for "you", provided I like the ergonomics of that model it should likewise work well for "me".
I am not a "newbie" to rifles, shooting, or hunting - just been working with some "very old" equipment and not familiar with much of anything that has been built in the past 50 years.
While I agree, that many posts are simply going on about the virtues of their favourite rifle brand/model etc, there has been little to no "I bought brand A and it sucked - had a ton of problems and the customer service when I tried to get it fixed was horrible".
And that really was more what I was looking for (the bad if it existed).
I am confident that all of the rifles I listed are "safe and reliable" if used as intended.
I'm not going to go "Tim Taylor" on any of them and hop them up. While I reload I stick well within the max limits posted by the bullet or powder company data (even if more than a few consider them "lawyer safe loads") - I don't load "hot". I am more interested in shooting game animals than chronographs and actually chrono very few loads.
I am torn between wood and synthetic stocks. Until I got my synthetic Wby I would have never considered a "plastic" stock, but after having to replace the buttstock on my pre-64/Win 94 due to a shattered wrist and a couple of cracks developing in the forestock of my 740 Rem (ok, they are closing in on 60 years old and they were never "safe queens") I am not as opposed to "plastic" as I once was.
I purposely left out the caliber(s) that I'm (waffling) over at the moment or this thread would have drifted even further from what I asked about, but will throw them in now since I think it's starting to die (this topic that is). My first and second choice (and still not sure which is first) is 6.5 Creedmoor and 7mm-08 Rem. In a distant third I will consider a 270 Win.
These "wants" have somewhat limited what models are available and from who (The Savage 111 is the only model I would consider that chambers for the Creed, otherwise it wouldn't even be on the short list - while Wby makes a VGII/syn in 6.5, I can't get the wholesaler to bring one in from the US and Rem/Browning just don't chamber it).
I love the look of the Wby Kryptek but the only caliber I'm even kinda interested in, in that model is the 270 (and actually, I plan on picking up a Browning BLR pistol grip after this next rifle and kinda want that to be either a 270 Win or 270 WSM and not really looking to duplicate the caliber).
So I do appreciate the responses that have at least tried to address my original question, even if they were just a testimonial to your love of your own rifles - that info is still "very valuable" - if it has worked well for "you", provided I like the ergonomics of that model it should likewise work well for "me".
I am not a "newbie" to rifles, shooting, or hunting - just been working with some "very old" equipment and not familiar with much of anything that has been built in the past 50 years.
duncansuds
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Weyburn, SK
I think you have a couple very good choices here. I would personally stick to the 700. Don't let the nay-Sayers ram anything down your throat. I think from what you describe, you may be very happy with it. I would strongly consider a 700 in the .308 family. There was a couple of 7-08 rem 700 or Model 7 on the EE a short time ago..... Would likely be right up your alley. I personally went this route recently for a decent handling rifle and won't look back. Perfect caliber for anything I want to shoot in NA, light but not too light and flimsy, easy to modify if there is a small detail you do not like (ie stock type) to make perfect for YOU. Good luck.
BeaverMeat
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nanaimo, B.C.
I'll just say this.
Have any Browning X-bolt, Weatherby, and Savage haters bombarded your thread?
The way it stands Remington has some skeletons in the closet. If someone is going to spend the time and energy hating on Remington 700s there must be a reason. Even Mauser vs. Enfield threads show a common complacency towards favoured actions. And those arguments can get heated.
Personally I would stay away from a modern 700. A 700 built in the 60s, 70s, and 80s are a different breed and I personally would have no issue picking one up. But I'm vested in Mauser 98s, so that won't happen any time soon
As others have said. Handle them, and if you get a chance shoot them. Then make a decision for yourself.
(don't buy a 700)
Have any Browning X-bolt, Weatherby, and Savage haters bombarded your thread?
The way it stands Remington has some skeletons in the closet. If someone is going to spend the time and energy hating on Remington 700s there must be a reason. Even Mauser vs. Enfield threads show a common complacency towards favoured actions. And those arguments can get heated.
Personally I would stay away from a modern 700. A 700 built in the 60s, 70s, and 80s are a different breed and I personally would have no issue picking one up. But I'm vested in Mauser 98s, so that won't happen any time soon
As others have said. Handle them, and if you get a chance shoot them. Then make a decision for yourself.
(don't buy a 700)
I think I'm in the 10% minority but in case you think I'm not, if I was championing any rifle it would be the Tikka T3 Lite. Which I have in .270WSM and is as stated is one super accurate, smooth action 'out of the box' rifle with a fine user adjustable trigger.
And this is not just my opinion but that of a friend of mine that was a member of Canada's Bisley team and was coach to a woman trying out for Canada's Olympic Woman's Biathlon team. So he knows a thing or two about guns.
But the OP stated at the outset that he wasn't interested in a Tikka so I didn't fly the Tikka flag... till now.
BeaverMeat
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nanaimo, B.C.
True, but the OP hasn't mentioned anything outside the realm on USA.
I have both a bolt action .270 WSM (Tikka T3 Lite) and a BLR and imho would not want a BLR in .270 WSM. Recoil would be rough in a Lightweight '81, especially since they're now on the lighter side with the aluminum receivers (and there nothing wrong with that- BLRs lockup on the barrel).
Again imho if you go to a different caliber BLR than your .308 stay with a short action. From what I've read long action BLRs (.270,.30/06) are a pita. Lever throws are reportedly long which negates the fast handling of a bush gun.
If Browning makes 'em you might want to try a BLR in .260Rem which is a necked down .308.
OP stated back in the beginning he didn't think the extra cost of a Tikka was justified. So I didn't push a Tikka, only mentioned it as an option possibly in 6.5mm Swedish.
gunrunner8
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Kamloops, B.C.
I'll just say this.
Have any Browning X-bolt, Weatherby, and Savage haters bombarded your thread?
The way it stands Remington has some skeletons in the closet. If someone is going to spend the time and energy hating on Remington 700s there must be a reason. Even Mauser vs. Enfield threads show a common complacency towards favoured actions. And those arguments can get heated.
Personally I would stay away from a modern 700. A 700 built in the 60s, 70s, and 80s are a different breed and I personally would have no issue picking one up. But I'm vested in Mauser 98s, so that won't happen any time soon
As others have said. Handle them, and if you get a chance shoot them. Then make a decision for yourself.
(don't buy a 700)
That's very wise statement right here. I am not Remington hater but can mention another skeleton from that closet.
As mentioned newest Remingtons have QC issues and their method of brazing bolt handles to bolt body is less than desirable.
I heard about couple of instances of handles "flying off" on Remingtons.
I had bolt handle separated with new rifle while hunting 20 years ago or so and lots of trouble with warranty delivery.
Sure I used handloads but they were mild ones b/c my aim is trouble free hunting and long life of brass.
The bolt was tig welded and rifle sold with large loss month later, useing Rugers ever since with no complaints whatsoever.
