ATRS modern hunter?

mikethebike said:
Wow I never knew!
I cannot tolerate any false education, false credentials, false deeds, false experiences and/or false valor, it always tarnishes the ones who really hold them. it is one of my pet peeves.

For that alone, I cannot endorse this business any further in any way.
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I was not aware of these accusations myself until the link was posted last night. That said I refuse to base purchases based solely on the word of those making the accusations. He has been on the large part really reasonable with me, no questionable stories, and no
beating around the bush.

The posts in the thread CFC that quote him chewing my ass out was a miss understanding as he apparrently thought he had sent a pm that did not reach me due to his full inbox, so he thought I was pressing buttons by continuing on. A lengthy phone conversation cleared everything up, and a follow up in person this easter at the Calgary show allowed for a better understanding of the situation.

I would advise that others do not take these accusations to heart based solely on the opinion of those making the accusations, and that for one to take a stand against with out any personal negative experience would be foolish.

To be clear I do not condone stolen valour either.
 
mikethebike said:
yah but i dont have permission to see that page, anywho
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Long story short: The person claims to have been a US Army sniper in Vietnam and has allegedly told some wild tales about his service there. An American web site which specializes in outing cases of stolen valour alleged that the person never served in the U.S. military (or at least records could not be found).

I have no idea of any of this is true, I am only pointing out what has appeared on CGN in the past, allegations that I do not believe the person in question has refuted despite being a member here.
 
Haven't fired a shot yet from my MH, but I can say it's gorgeous, beautifully made, and heavy.....

To keep it as light as possible you'll be pushing $6k, and it'll still be 8lbs before a scope.

They have popped up on the EE from time to time.

GGG
 
KePet said:
If you want a quality, semi-custom, non restricted rifle that will shoot MOA then the MH is it. You don't see a lot of reviews on them yet, because a lot of us haven't had the time behind them to do a proper review. Many reviews/range reports were just taken down as well, because every owner that posted anything seemed to get slagged by a bunch of no-minds that had never even held one. After market support is fantastic, because ATRS isn't a big company and they stand behind their product. This isn't NEA or Robinson Arms using their customers as beta testers.

There is nothing wrong with the M-14 platform as well, but to get close to what ATRS is offering in an M-14 you're looking at LRB and an aftermarket stock. I think TonyBen just posted that his setup is worth about $6500 US. That ain't chicken feed

As for accuracy/reliability. These are MOA rifles. There was even a post from one owner that shot MOA using Norc surplus. However: Rick has been very up front from the start about these rifles not liking hard primers. They were never designed to shoot cheap surplus. The general attitude was that you don't spend 4K on a rifle to shoot cheap ammo in. You can if you want, but don't expect it to eat surplus like an SKS

These were built and marketed as an extremely accurate hunting rifle-hence the name. They are not a Battle Rifle. They are the top of the heap for a modern style, AR type, non restricted rifle. They are, in my opinion, simply fantastic.

Flame suit on!!!
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No flaming. Just take out your BCG. Go to the DPMS website and look at their consumer/hobby grade LR308 BCG. Yes that's right, you have a very nice, very expensive DPMS LR308 rifle. It's non restricted, absolutely. High end? I think not. But I guess that's subjective.

These rifles aren't just finicky with hard primers, but also soft points (which are often used for hunting) and magazines. No G3 Pmags for you! It should also be known that the LR308 extractor spring is a very well known and documented weak point. So there are at least three possibilities here for issues just due to design. Two of these problems can cause issues with expensive match grade ammo. Not the end users fault.
 
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onetwentyish said:
I was not aware of these accusations myself until the link was posted last night. That said I refuse to base purchases based solely on the word of those making the accusations. He has been on the large part really reasonable with me, no questionable stories, and no
beating around the bush.

The posts in the thread CFC that quote him chewing my ass out was a miss understanding as he apparrently thought he had sent a pm that did not reach me due to his full inbox, so he thought I was pressing buttons by continuing on. A lengthy phone conversation cleared everything up, and a follow up in person this easter at the Calgary show allowed for a better understanding of the situation.

I would advise that others do not take these accusations to heart based solely on the opinion of those making the accusations, and that for one to take a stand against with out any personal negative experience would be foolish.

To be clear I do not condone stolen valour either.
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Are you referring to changing the trigger? How modifying an AR trigger would somehow change the classification for a trigger that is listed in the FRT table as a Timney's drop in one pin AR10 trigger? Not sure how modifying an AR trigger to replace an AR trigger can cause a change in classification. Nor why it would warrant such a response. "Misunderstanding" or not. It defies logic.
 
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Epoxy7 said:
Are you referring to changing the trigger? How modifying an AR trigger would somehow change the classification for a trigger that is listed in the FRT table as a Timney's drop in one pin AR10 trigger? Not sure how modifying an AR trigger to replace an AR trigger can cause a change in classification. Nor why it would warrant such a response. "Misunderstanding" or not. It defies logic.
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The misunderstanding was that he strongly thought I was intending to modify the rifle, the truth is I was toying with the idea of a custom housing for a geissele trigger. His quom was that the single trigger pin design is a crucial feature to its status, even though it does use a type of AR Timney. He figured I was just going to continue ahead just to defy him when he seen my post after he attempted to PM me.
 
onetwentyish said:
The misunderstanding was that he strongly thought I was intending to modify the rifle, the truth is I was toying with the idea of a custom housing for a geissele trigger. His quom was that the single trigger pin design is a crucial feature to its status, even though it does use a type of AR Timney. He figured I was just going to continue ahead just to defy him when he seen my post after he attempted to PM me.
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According to the FRT table write up, it uses a drop in Timney AR10 trigger. Changing that won't have any influence on the status. If it doesn't work then I can see you being on your own regarding fixing it. But that's about it. "Defy" him? Ya ok. Who's property is it again? Good to see the purchase of a rifle now includes a father you never wanted as part of the package.
 
onetwentyish said:
The misunderstanding was that he strongly thought I was intending to modify the rifle, the truth is I was toying with the idea of a custom housing for a geissele trigger. His quom was that the single trigger pin design is a crucial feature to its status, even though it does use a type of AR Timney. He figured I was just going to continue ahead just to defy him when he seen my post after he attempted to PM me.
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sounds rough bro, kinda weird comments he's giving to customer who just bought a super expensive rile from him.
im too much of a frenchie hot head to handle things like that well
 
Epoxy7 said:
No flaming. Just take out your BCG. Go to the DPMS website and look at their consumer/hobby grade LR308 BCG. Yes that's right, you have a very nice, very expensive DPMS LR308 rifle. It's non restricted, absolutely. High end? I think not. But I guess that's subjective.

These rifles aren't just finicky with hard primers, but also soft points (which are often used for hunting) and magazines. No G3 Pmags for you! It should also be known that the LR308 extractor spring is a very well known and documented weak point. So there are at least three possibilities here for issues just due to design. Two of these problems can cause issues with expensive match grade ammo. Not the end users fault.
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Following this thread has in fact raised some unsettling feelings, but that has more to do with the other thread which I carefully read through. As may be obvious from my avatar I am prior service.

Putting personal feelings aside and looking at the product itself, I have no complaints, and honestly don't see anything in your post which disagrees with my statement. It is a "semi" custom rifle. Is it a LR-308 bolt. I can't say 100% from photos, but I'm pretty sure that the LR-308 bolt will not drop in without modification. And I think to a certain extent all DI guns of this style will have similar bolts. Is the extractor weak? Possibly. Time will tell. I do know that the upper and lower are sufficiently different that they are NR. And I didn't see a DPMS with a carbon fibre barrel.

The magazines are a definite issue, but there was no such thing as a Gen III when this was developed. I can't, in good conscience, blame a company for not being able to predict changes to a magazine. At least they are working to solve the problem, or so has been reported. I have yet to see the final product, but will give them the benefit of the doubt, at this time

As for soft point bullets: most semi's don't like soft points. My M-305 sure doesn't. As far as that goes, I've got a Winchester 94 in 30-30 that doesn't like pointy bullets. Proper bullet for the proper rifle. I'm not claiming that this rifle is perfect, or that it will make me the best shot in the world. What I am saying is that at the time I ordered mine there was very little price difference between it and the Famae in .308, that uses proprietary mags at $100/ea and that seems to struggle to achieve 1.5 MOA.
 
having read everything I could find on the modern hunter over the pat 6 months while I have been waiting for mine to be built I have come across a lot of information. However very little in way of actually reviews with accuracy and function of the rifle.

I am far from able to do a full review on mine as I just received it last week and have only fire 60 rounds so far. My rifle is a 6.5 creedmoor with 22" barrel, prs stock and ATRS muzzle break. The ammunition I shot has been one box of American eagle 140gr hpbt match. To sight in the scope I shot 2 sitters at 50yrd then a group of 5 which I never measured but to guess I would say .8". Then I shot two more groups at 100yrd which measure 1.04 and .96Moa

The last 2 boxes were hornady 140gr ELDX match which I shot 2 group at 100yrds measuring .384moa a personal best for me beating out my bolt rifles as well, and the second measured .791 Moa.

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Then out to 200 meters. First group was .635moa follows by .969 Moa then 1.14, and 1.18moa. The last group was a rapid fire 5 rounds under 8 seconds with a group 1.4moa.



At 60 rounds this rifle is far from even broken in with a lot of room to improve. Overall my MH has exceeded my expectations and I feel with hand loads I can improve the consistency and realistically achieve half Moa. Now since it can't all be perfect the American eagle ammo I fired through 2 full 10 round mags each mag experienced one FTF which jammed the bullet into the feed ramps and pushed the bullet into the case. The hornady ammo was also shot though the same fully loaded 10 xcr pistol mag and the 40 rounds all cycled without any problem. So while report say soft points don't feed well it would seem hollow point don't aswell but I will need to test further as I hope to reload 140gr bergers.
 
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Epoxy7 said:
According to the FRT table write up, it uses a drop in Timney AR10 trigger. Changing that won't have any influence on the status. If it doesn't work then I can see you being on your own regarding fixing it. But that's about it. "Defy" him? Ya ok. Who's property is it again? Good to see the purchase of a rifle now includes a father you never wanted as part of the package.
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What evs man. I know what side your on, the way you aggressivly insist on making an issue out of something this small. It makes me glad I am still on the neutral ground, because this is not the type of character I am interested in being associated with.

I truly am curious what underlying agenda lays within you, and what you have to gain from it that pushes you to nitpick everything in attempt for use as ammo.

What ever the case, I need to take the time to do my own testing if I can manage it, and I will draw my own conclusions on it capabilities from my own experiences. Problem is I am sure the rifle will out strip my accuracy potential, I am not well experienced in precision shooting, so I likely can not tell you what it's true potential is, and I don't have any similar or different precision rifles to compare with to set a base line of my capabilities.

I will also reserve judgement on a person's character to my personal experiences and those of people I know I can trust.
 
mikethebike said:
sounds rough bro, kinda weird comments he's giving to customer who just bought a super expensive rile from him.
im too much of a frenchie hot head to handle things like that well
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To be fair, I am second owner. Handling thing's well is not always easy but I prefer the high road. In the end I left with a good understanding of the rifle, some possible solutions to my problems, and a decent understanding of the bureaucracy that a manufacture has to put up with when attempting to apply for a NR status on a new design.

I learned a fair amount in that hour long conversation.
 
onetwentyish said:
What evs man. I know what side your on, the way you aggressivly insist on making an issue out of something this small. It makes me glad I am still on the neutral ground, because this is not the type of character I am interested in being associated with.

I truly am curious what underlying agenda lays within you, and what you have to gain from it that pushes you to nitpick everything in attempt for use as ammo.

What ever the case, I need to take the time to do my own testing if I can manage it, and I will draw my own conclusions on it capabilities from my own experiences. Problem is I am sure the rifle will out strip my accuracy potential, I am not well experienced in precision shooting, so I likely can not tell you what it's true potential is, and I don't have any similar or different precision rifles to compare with to set a base line of my capabilities.

I will also reserve judgement on a person's character to my personal experiences and those of people I know I can trust.
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It's very simple. What you posted made zero sense. What I posted was exactly what is listed in the FRT table. Not conjecture, not opinion but fact. Same with the DPMS LR308 BCG. You can try to make this personal all you wish. For me it really isn't.

Good luck to you.
 
Epoxy7 said:
It's very simple. What you posted made zero sense. What I posted was exactly what is listed in the FRT table. Not conjecture, not opinion but fact. Same with the DPMS LR308 BCG. You can try to make this personal all you wish. For me it really isn't.

Good luck to you.
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The idea that there may be possible concequences for altering the receiver to house a different trigger doesn't make sense?:confused: That is what Rick's problem was with incase I was not clear before.

I never disagreed with you on the FRT info you provided, and while I have only looked on DPMS' site for the BCG you speak of I could not find any Gen 1 LR308 BCG listed. That said I don't doubt you on that but would like to see for myself as well.

I don't know if your grudge is personal, business, or relationship related, but something drives you feel the need to not just drop it. What skin do you have in the game? None that I can see from here.
 
onetwentyish said:
The idea that there may be possible concequences for altering the receiver to house a different trigger doesn't make sense?:confused: That is what Rick's problem was with incase I was not clear before.

I never disagreed with you on the FRT info you provided, and while I have only looked on DPMS' site for the BCG you speak of I could not find any Gen 1 LR308 BCG listed. That said I don't doubt you on that but would like to see for myself as well.

I don't know if your grudge is personal, business, or relationship related, but something drives you feel the need to not just drop it. What skin do you have in the game? None that I can see from here.
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Where to find the info proving the BCG as well as other info on this platform has already been posted on the first page of this thread. It's a fact.

Nothing personal or a grudge. I did my pre purchase research. I don't have 3.5 to 6 thousand invested in this. No purchase justification required on my end.
 
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