OkayShooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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What made the OP think we got 1911s? The Para Ords Canadian Forces Appreciation SF45s?
Canadian Armed Forces looking to retire BHP by 2026
- Thread starter Challenger2010
- Start date
maple_leaf_eh
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
That remark was a correction to a 5-watt reaction to a typo in a posting title. Just because the title didn't match the article doesn't automatically make the whole thing fake news. It is a mistake, either by ignorance or misunderstanding. Fake news is becoming the go-to attack phrase, even though most time it isn't warranted.
Yes, Canada has had 1911s. Not arguing that. Just like the RCAF had M1 Garands. But the newstory was about Browning 9mms never about 45s.
Should retirees worry about the Code of Service Discipline? Generally no. The serving members have been ordered to comply with a particular operation. The CDS and CAFCWO have been very clear on that. Orders, briefings, videos and statements. It is hard to miss the commander's intent. The CANFORGEN amplified how noncompliance was going to be handled. Publically disagreeing with the CDS will be a fast way to get kicked out in this particular context. Taking charges to court martial might be worth the price of the popcorn to see how both sides present their cases.
The para above directly effects serving members. Retired members are regularly hauled back to face charges arising from offences during their service. There is a retired medic up on charges for alleged ###ual misconduct. Recently, a retired Sgt(?) was called back and charged for calling some junior officer a rude word (or six) at a mess dinner. Retirement doesn't wipe the slate clean as far as the Code of Service Discipline. Although the discretion to proceed with charges rests with JAG and the chain of command. Canada does not have a statute of limitations. The military doesn't either.
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I don't know why we don't just get more of the P226. It's in the system, it's supported, there's already lessons in place.
But no...probably gonna roll another contract out and burn money and get no result because the requests are ridiculous.
But no...probably gonna roll another contract out and burn money and get no result because the requests are ridiculous.
OkayShooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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Your the one trying to police CGN over a news article that everything in the open. When nobody cares about the canforgen.
How do you edit a thread title?
Couldn't Colt Canada tool up to produce a license copy of the HP?
If it an't broke, don't fix it with something of less quality/reliability.
The change over to the new rifles from the FN C1 was in line with the NATO change to 5.56 and geared towards CQB style rifle instead of main battle rifles. But isn't 9mm still a NATO round?
If it an't broke, don't fix it with something of less quality/reliability.
The change over to the new rifles from the FN C1 was in line with the NATO change to 5.56 and geared towards CQB style rifle instead of main battle rifles. But isn't 9mm still a NATO round?
Double click on the title box - to the right of the actual words not on them. It will become editable.
The gun is an old design, relatively heavy, lost to the Beretta 92 in US Army trials 30 odd years ago and cheaper alternatives that may or may not be better alternatives likely exist. Our Army deserves the best equipment money and budgets can afford. What it does not deserve is political meddling when it comes to equipment procurement. All the political elite should be doing is setting the budget or deciding whether or not or accept the cost of the proposal. If some Officer or Political Party or Politician is getting a kick back from a purchase you charge him/her and move on. This seems to be what all the rules are aimed at preventing.
Take Care
Bob
- Location
- On the beach
Because the BHP is an ancient design that doesn't meet the requirements as a combat pistol. As has been pointed out already; The "magazine in" safety is not just a pain but sometimes dangerous, it has no firing pin safety so it can drop fire, and the sights are complete crap....that's the start.
I was going to say the same thing.
We actually have a license to produce the Inglis Hi-Power. Just have Colt Canada produce new Hi-Powers, with upgraded 3-dot sights and leave out the magazine disconnect. This would require zero changes, unlike adopting something new.
You can't fix what ain't broke.
Not if the hammer is cocked, like a pre-Series 80 1911. As long as it is not carried Condition 2, it will not drop fire.
- Location
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Carrying a BHP with the hammer back?
When I got out of Regular Army, I got into "Combat Pistol Shooting" ala Jeff Cooper (now IPSC) with my commercial Hi-power. I was also a BCRA member and that year became the BCRA 'Service Pistol' champ using an issue Inglis Hi-Power from CFB Chilliwack.
I was able to select a gun with the fixed sights, not the tangent type, a reasonable trigger pull and found a couple of magazines with undamaged feed lips and well polished surfaces where the mag disconnect safety contacted. The COF was strictly bulls eye out to 50m. You were given five 'sighters' at 25m (IIRC) and then took your place in a relay. I remember having to hold at 1 o'clock on the edge of the black bull to hit centre at 50m.
My original commercial Hi-Power had the meagre factory sights that were quickly replaced with after market sights and a second later model had that Mickey Mouse adjustable rear sight offered by Browning. Both were fitted with after market ambi-safeties.
I was able to shoot into IPSC "A" class with these guns. Later I sold them and bought my first 1911 and shot my way back into "A" class. Due to the scoring system, it was easier with the 1911.
The point? If the Hi-Power was considered to be a viable Combat Pistol for the entire time of it's existence and used by elite forces such as the SAS, what has changed? Just because the current flavour of the day tends towards polymer framed pistols with a few bells and whistles, it remains an iconic design like the 1911.
To my knowledge, the US military still carries the 1911 with hammer down on an empty chamber, SEVEN round mag loaded. When the USMC ordered some 45,000 1911 rail guns, they specified 7 rd magazines.
Like Maxman1 said- If it ain't broke .....
I was able to select a gun with the fixed sights, not the tangent type, a reasonable trigger pull and found a couple of magazines with undamaged feed lips and well polished surfaces where the mag disconnect safety contacted. The COF was strictly bulls eye out to 50m. You were given five 'sighters' at 25m (IIRC) and then took your place in a relay. I remember having to hold at 1 o'clock on the edge of the black bull to hit centre at 50m.
My original commercial Hi-Power had the meagre factory sights that were quickly replaced with after market sights and a second later model had that Mickey Mouse adjustable rear sight offered by Browning. Both were fitted with after market ambi-safeties.
I was able to shoot into IPSC "A" class with these guns. Later I sold them and bought my first 1911 and shot my way back into "A" class. Due to the scoring system, it was easier with the 1911.
The point? If the Hi-Power was considered to be a viable Combat Pistol for the entire time of it's existence and used by elite forces such as the SAS, what has changed? Just because the current flavour of the day tends towards polymer framed pistols with a few bells and whistles, it remains an iconic design like the 1911.
To my knowledge, the US military still carries the 1911 with hammer down on an empty chamber, SEVEN round mag loaded. When the USMC ordered some 45,000 1911 rail guns, they specified 7 rd magazines.
Like Maxman1 said- If it ain't broke .....
Are you asking what Condition 2 is? Condition 2 is hammer down on a loaded chamber. Condition 3 is an empty chamber.
Condition 1 is hammer cocked, chamber loaded, safety on (the CZ 75 is the only DA pistol capable of being carried Condition 1).
mebiuspower
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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I'm sure our police agencies regularly order directly from Brownells, with a company credit card.
- Location
- On the beach
Condition 2 has led to a ton of ND's in Afghanistan. Guys try to lower the hammer and slip or otherwise release it and it fires. Hence CAF policy that the pistol be carried in condition 3.
The only pistols allowed to be carried in condition 2 are the ones equipped with a mechanical de-cocker (the 225 and 226). Hell, in Kandahar they wouldn't even let guys keep a mag in their pistol in camp. It had to be carried fully unloaded (Unless you had a card saying you were CPP or you were SOF).
- Location
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Most of the US military still carries a Beretta 92. USSF carries either a 92 or a Glock (they are given a choice). Marsoc are the only ones who routinely carry 1911s and I once met a SEAL in Afghanistan with an old school 1911 and an old school M14 and a thumper on his back. He was retro as hell.
Nope but parts are available to the general public and if we can get them surely police agencies can as well, it isn't rocket science for most. I would think agencies using the pistol would have enough foresight to have a service contract with the supplier.
Take Care
Bob
OkayShooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Even with a Force protection card, It caused a issue. It was only good for your area of work, Not the whole camp. Like some thought.
Hi-Powers to day are assembled in Portugal by FN the manufacture of the FN Hi-Power, "Browning" has never made a HI-Power....ever. Too, the chief designer of the gun was Sauve, FN's chief engineer. JMD dies seven years before the final design for the Hi-Power was completed by Sauve in 1935. They are expensive to make hence FN taking the assembling to Portugal where wages are lower. Just because the Cdn Army held on to the gun for so long hardly makes it worthy of life support. Surely our soldiers deserve better than a 82 year old design, that weighs more than modern polymer pistols and would could twice as much or more considering the need for FN to ramp up production or as some have suggested asking a third party to tool up to copy and produce the design.
If we are going to ask our young men to put themselves in harms way we can surely afford to provide them with the best equipment available.
Take Care
Bob
